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I give up: I'd rather go backwards, than forwards (in Evolution)

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by Gottservant, Jul 25, 2020.

  1. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    Neurologically, there is a stronger signal, the nearer the mind reaches comprehension of which Evolution is getting in the way.

    For a predator to go without Evolution is impossible, without dying to it's self,, a little - but that does not exonerate the same predator from choosing anything but the best prey.

    Necessary exercise of fitness, therefore, delivers most species, from every needing to consider that they may be considered too "evolved".
     
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  2. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    Go slow. "I can use English" - an English statement - "to end this sentence in another language" - still English - "da?" German.

    How do you understand you cannot use apes, to end the ape species, in humanity?

    You can't.

    I really want you to get this, because it is the one fundamental error Evolution makes, which I cannot simply tolerate. Mutation leading to adaptation is spurious enough as it is, but apes becoming humans is beyond the pale.

    Ending insensitively (not discerning the difference between apes and humans, for example), is not wrong, unless you intentionally libel people with it, to protract a point.

    I think you are acting insensitively; I think you are libelling God to protract the lawless scope of the ungodly and protracting sin, to presume you know more about Creation than God does - its an insult.

    Maybe I'm being too sensitive about you being "insensitive", maybe you never thought about what point you were protracting - but even despite that, I think in the end you would be grateful that someone spoke up, about behaviour no god could tolerate.

    If I'm wrong, forgive me - but to date, I've been given almost no breathing room as to how the layman understands Evolution and as a result I have had to develop a partial model of my own, just to understand it. The point for me, is "how does Evolution change what I do, as a rule?" from there it has basically been down to you guys, to explain that.

    I think God wants to reach you, I think God wants to trust your interpretation - where we go from there, on the understanding that we develop, is praise to Him.
     
  3. tas8831

    tas8831 Well-Known Member

    +3,490
    United States
    Atheist
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    It will be so cool when you start making sense.
     
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  4. Hans Blaster

    Hans Blaster Well-Known Member

    +3,291
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    Nothing in the post even resembles the evolution that is the topic of this forum.
     
  5. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
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    But what is the next generation supposed to focus on, if they believe Evolution?

    The Bible is full of advice on how to live, with predictions about how the difference between obedience and disobedience will play out.

    I'm not just shooting at the wind, understanding Christ's obedience is a monumental book all of its own (in the Bible).
     
  6. Shemjaza

    Shemjaza Regular Member Supporter

    +2,702
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    Evolution is just a scientific theory about life... it isn't a philosophy or a theology.

    It's just a conclusion from evidence.
     
  7. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    Yes but what "bias" did it have, when something evolved?

    Everything has a bias, unless it is basically ready to die.
     
  8. Shemjaza

    Shemjaza Regular Member Supporter

    +2,702
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    Nothing, because it is a scientific theory about a physical process.

    It isn't alive.
    It isn't an individual.
    It isn't a belief.

    So, it doesn't have bias.
     
  9. Ponderous Curmudgeon

    Ponderous Curmudgeon Active Member

    286
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    Does gravity have a bias when a person rolls down a hill?
     
  10. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    Which is your bias.
     
  11. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    More biased toward the bottom of the hill.

    Simple enough, answer?
     
  12. Ponderous Curmudgeon

    Ponderous Curmudgeon Active Member

    286
    +126
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    And as with evolution, not something the person can change. Things roll down hill and imperfect replicators evolve.

    Humans have control over their thoughts and actions and can change. Evolution in the general sense means change. But as everybody has been telling you, the concepts of biological evolution you are trying to repurpose toward your idea of your search for god are no more connected to the reality of evolution than the mechanisms behind gravity are to your search for god.
     
  13. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    Gravity biased to drop, is like God holding a kid: at some point the kid is going to have to stand on his own two feet.

    It's that sweet. If there is an element of faith, in a theory, that theory can be repurposed for a spiritual lesson.

    It's not like it only cuts one way: you are welcome to read science into what Jesus said, if you can find the "angle".

    It's the fact that you are hedging your interpretation against spiritual interpretation, that hurts - as in, you don't have to do it, but are anyway!
     
  14. Warden_of_the_Storm

    Warden_of_the_Storm Well-Known Member

    +4,357
    United Kingdom
    Deist
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    Evolution is not a belief system. You've been told this nearly a hundred times. Evolution is simply change of biological life. That's it.
     
  15. SelfSim

    SelfSim A non "-ist"

    +1,018
    Humanist
    Private
    A 'spiritual interpretation' doesn't help in making predictions for objective phenomena, nor in assigning meaning for objective reality .. that's why science would typically put it at the very bottom of the very tall pile of other more useful interpretations.
     
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  16. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    But if I communicate the same expectation, to the entire species - that species will conflate that communication, with the "evolution" of that self-same species.

    I mean you are saying "you can't tell the difference" 'that the species itself can't tell'? Therefore your interpretation of the viability of the species, tends toward sin ("sin" in this context being, no change offered for difference, in the young).

    I want to help, but how do you know that the species won't listen to me and do something "evolved" that ubiquitously adopted would pass from one generation to the next?

    Or are you saying even if I did communicate to the species, only a part of what I passed on would survive?
     
  17. Warden_of_the_Storm

    Warden_of_the_Storm Well-Known Member

    +4,357
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    You can communicate whatever you want all you want: evolution is not a belief system. It is a scientific fact and explanation of how biological life changes.
     
  18. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    But that is precisely what Jesus did: repurposing common knowledge for a spiritual lesson - farmers, kings, sheep - the legitimacy of knowledge has to pass the test, as to whether it successfully passes for inspiration of a greater spiritual principle.

    What I am talking about, is not some pervasive thing that gets in the way of good science - I am simply communicating to a standard that is well established, that more room to breathe is needed.
     
  19. Gottservant

    Gottservant God loves your words, may men love them also Supporter

    +477
    Messianic
    Are you just ignoring my point or do you honestly not understand what the species believing almost the same thing together actually means?

    I mean you are purposely saying the bar is species high, and I am jumping that bar by saying "there are a number of ways for the species to believe it together" and you are ignoring my perception of the species, for yours. Why?
     
  20. Warden_of_the_Storm

    Warden_of_the_Storm Well-Known Member

    +4,357
    United Kingdom
    Deist
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    I can easily make the claim that you are ignoring my point. Evolution is not something that is believed in, it is not something that belief factors into. Evolution is the explanation of the scientific fact that biological life changes.
     
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