I am Obsessed with Paul’s Gospel — Here’s Why!

[Guojing]

No.



Have you read the OT prophecies? They speak of Jesus, the suffering servant, who was despised, rejected and took our sins upon himself, Isaiah 53.
God, their king, WAS walking among them - it was Jesus. Jesus, who said that he had come to give his life as a ransom for many, who said that he was fulfilling the law and the prophets.



Eternal life starts now, when people accept the life that Jesus came to give.
He did not say, "come to me, receive eternal life and at some point in the future you will have it". The Kingdom of God is here now - it is not fully here, because not everyone and every place accepts that Jesus is king. That will happen when he returns and every knee bows before him. Then, the kingdom will fully, and perfectly have arrived.
But Jesus taught that the kingdom is like a mustard seed - starts off very small and grows. Or like yeast - just a small pinch can alter the dough and make it rise. So we are to be salt and light and proclaim the Gospel and Jesus' kingship - not say "accept Jesus now, they when you die you may have eternal life."
When Jesus returns the Kingdom will be here, fully; not starting off small and then spreading - EVERY eye will see him. We won't need to preach the kingdom, it will be here; fully and perfectly.



John 20:31 says that John has written about Jesus so that we may believe in him and have eternal life - it says nothing about "at some point, when he returns".



I wasn't unsure about it, that's what I've said all along.
Jesus' birth, ministry, healings, crucifixion, betrayal, resurrection were all prophesied by OT prophets. After his resurrection Jesus taught the disciples what the Scriptures said about him - including that he would die and be raised again, Luke 24:25-27. EVERYTHING that was written about Jesus in Moses and the prophets had to be fulfilled, Luke 24:44. He was the suffering servant in Isaiah 53.
Read Acts chapters 1-4; how many times did Peter quote from the OT? Did he, or did he not, say in Acts of the Apostles 3:22 that God was going to send a prophet like Moses, and that anyone who did not listen to him would be cut off?
He said all that all those prophecies referred to Jesus.

You earlier said the 12 were not preaching the Cross in Luke 9:6.

Are you reversing that statement and claiming now that they are preaching the cross?

 

[Strong in Him]

You earlier said the 12 were not preaching the Cross in Luke 9:6.

Are you reversing that statement and claiming now that they are preaching the cross?

No, I said that the 12 didn't know about the cross; they were proclaiming that the King, and therefore the kingdom, was here. The kingdom had begun.

When we're learning to read, we don't start with Shakespeare. We start by learning the alphabet, the basics. Then when we know that, we can learn to read words, sentences, books and go on to more complicated things.
When we become Christians we don't know and understand everything immediately. We accept Jesus, his death on the cross and resurrection and receive new life. We are born again; in the kingdom.
But we spend the rest of our lives learning more about God and the Kingdom - we learn about the Trinity, the gifts and fruits of the Spirit, how to pray, what God's will is for us and so on.

The disciples were preaching that the king was here - of course he was, he was walking around, teaching and healing people. They didn't know that their king was going to die and that he would live IN them by his Spirit; all that came later, after Jesus had been raised from the dead. The kingdom started with Jesus, it grows whenever Jesus is preached and people accept him as Saviour and Lord. But it will fully be here when Jesus returns, everyone can see him and every tongue confesses that he is Lord. When King Jesus returns people will "look on the one that they pierced".

 

[Guojing]

No, I said that the 12 didn't know about the cross; they were proclaiming that the King, and therefore the kingdom, was here. The kingdom had begun.

When we're learning to read, we don't start with Shakespeare. We start by learning the alphabet, the basics. Then when we know that, we can learn to read words, sentences, books and go on to more complicated things.
When we become Christians we don't know and understand everything immediately. We accept Jesus, his death on the cross and resurrection and receive new life. We are born again; in the kingdom.
But we spend the rest of our lives learning more about God and the Kingdom - we learn about the Trinity, the gifts and fruits of the Spirit, how to pray, what God's will is for us and so on.

The disciples were preaching that the king was here - of course he was, he was walking around, teaching and healing people. They didn't know that their king was going to die and that he would live IN them by his Spirit; all that came later, after Jesus had been raised from the dead. The kingdom started with Jesus, it grows whenever Jesus is preached and people accept him as Saviour and Lord. But it will fully be here when Jesus returns, everyone can see him and every tongue confesses that he is Lord. When King Jesus returns people will "look on the one that they pierced".

Okay, so you agree that the gospel of the kingdom did not involve the cross.

 

[Behold]

The Kingdom of God - God's kingdom - is where God rules as King.
Jesus is King.

The KOG is a spiritual Kingdom.
The believers are born again INTO this KOG.
"the Kingdom of God is WITHIN You".

 

[Strong in Him]

Okay, so you agree that the gospel of the kingdom did not involve the cross.

The Gospel of the Kingdom is that Jesus is king, and we can have a new relationship with God.

How do we do that, come to the Father and enter the Kingdom? Through Jesus who died for us.
The Gospel of the Kingdom means accepting the King, crucified, risen, ascended and glorified.

It is not possible to accept Jesus without accepting what he said and did; and that means the cross.
It is not possible to bypass the cross and think that you can still get into heaven and have eternal life. The devil wants to persuade us that we can, because the Gospel of doing good deeds and accepting that Jesus was a good teacher is nicer than the one of death to self. The devil was defeated on the cross, so of course he will do all he can to distract us from it and negate its power.

Tell me, how do you believe we can accept the Gospel of the kingdom without accepting what the King teaches?

 

[Guojing]

The Gospel of the Kingdom is that Jesus is king, and we can have a new relationship with God.

How do we do that, come to the Father and enter the Kingdom? Through Jesus who died for us.
The Gospel of the Kingdom means accepting the King, crucified, risen, ascended and glorified.

It is not possible to accept Jesus without accepting what he said and did; and that means the cross.
It is not possible to bypass the cross and think that you can still get into heaven and have eternal life. The devil wants to persuade us that we can, because the Gospel of doing good deeds and accepting that Jesus was a good teacher is nicer than the one of death to self. The devil was defeated on the cross, so of course he will do all he can to distract us from it and negate its power.

Tell me, how do you believe we can accept the Gospel of the kingdom without accepting what the King teaches?

I see you like to go around in circles

did the gospel preached by the 12 in Luke 9:6 included the cross, yes or no?

 

[Strong in Him]

I see you like to go around in circles

did the gospel preached by the 12 in Luke 9:6 included the cross, yes or no?

I've answered that already.

I've answered other things as well and given many Scriptures; you never address any of them.

 

[Guojing]

I've answered that already.

I've answered other things as well and given many Scriptures; you never address any of them.

Alright, the answer was no, but because you kept flipping back and forth, you confuse your readers.

There was a gospel that was preached in Luke that did not include the cross.

 

[Strong in Him]

Alright, the answer was no, but because you kept flipping back and forth, you confuse your readers.

There was a gospel that was preached in Luke that did not include the cross.

I was explaining about the Kingdom of God and how Jesus said that we can only enter that Kingdom if we are born again - posts, and Scriptures, that you keep ignoring.

The Kingdom of God started when Jesus began his ministry and He, Jesus the King, was with and among them.
THAT is most likely what they were preaching - that God didn't have to be approached through the prophets, that there is a Way to the Father.

The fact is that if someone tries to enter the Kingdom of God without Jesus; they'll fail.

 

[Guojing]

I was explaining about the Kingdom of God and how Jesus said that we can only enter that Kingdom if we are born again - posts, and Scriptures, that you keep ignoring.

The Kingdom of God started when Jesus began his ministry and He, Jesus the King, was with and among them.
THAT is most likely what they were preaching - that God didn't have to be approached through the prophets, that there is a Way to the Father.

The fact is that if someone tries to enter the Kingdom of God without Jesus; they'll fail.

Of course the gospel they preached was about Jesus, no one is denying that.

As long as you accept that the gospel they were preaching in Luke 9:6 does not contain the cross, I am fine.

 

[JLB777]

Yes I do, he is talking about the rapture of the Body of Christ.

Jesus will meet us in the air, as you have stated in 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17.

If that is what you believe, we are in agreement.

I believe the Church will be raptured, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ.


But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
1 Thessalonians 4:13-16


The resurrection and rapture occur at His coming.




JLB

 

[Guojing]

I believe the Church will be raptured, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ.


But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
1 Thessalonians 4:13-16


The resurrection and rapture occur at His coming.




JLB

If you believe the body of Christ will only be taken to heaven at Jesus's 2nd coming, then you are a post trib believer

This picture contrast my view, which is pre-trib and yours.

 

[JLB777]

If you believe the body of Christ will only be taken to heaven at Jesus's 2nd coming, then you are a post trib believer

This picture contrast my view, which is pre-trib and yours.

I didn’t mention the tribulation.

I am only discussing the rapture and resurrection and what the scriptures say.


I believe the Church will be raptured, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

Do you believe the resurrection and rapture occur at His coming?


But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
1 Thessalonians 4:13-16







JLB

 

[Guojing]

I didn’t mention the tribulation.

I am only discussing the rapture and resurrection and what the scriptures say.


I believe the Church will be raptured, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

Do you believe the resurrection and rapture occur at His coming?


But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
1 Thessalonians 4:13-16







JLB

Wait, you don't even believe there will be a tribulation before Jesus's 2nd coming?

 

[Strong in Him]

Of course the gospel they preached was about Jesus, no one is denying that.

As long as you accept that the gospel they were preaching in Luke 9:6 does not contain the cross, I am fine.

You haven't answered Jesus' statement that no one can enter the Kingdom unless they are born again. The disciples may even have preached this in Luke 9 - you don't know.

 

[Guojing]

You haven't answered Jesus' statement that no one can enter the Kingdom unless they are born again. The disciples may even have preached this in Luke 9 - you don't know.

We are born again when we believe according to 1 Cor 15:1-4/

That option was not avaliable under the gospel of the kingdom.

 

[Strong in Him]

We are born again when we believe according to 1 Cor 15:1-4/

That option was not avaliable under the gospel of the kingdom.

The Gospel of the Kingdom was that the King has arrived and the Kingdom of God is here.
Jesus the King taught that people needed to come to him, accept him to receive eternal life, and be born again. He taught that he would die as a ransom for many, Mark 10:45 that his blood would be shed for sin, Matthew 26:28, that he would rise again - and that they needed to be born again to enter the Kingdom.

Whether the disciples a) fully understood this and b) preached it when they were sent out by Jesus, is not the point.
Jesus taught it, and you can't enter the Kingdom without it. He said you need to be born again by the Spirit, not by believing 1 Cor 15.

If this is not "the Gospel of the Kingdom", what is? Do good deeds and you'll be saved?

 

[Guojing]

The Gospel of the Kingdom was that the King has arrived and the Kingdom of God is here.
Jesus the King taught that people needed to come to him, accept him to receive eternal life, and be born again. He taught that he would die as a ransom for many, Mark 10:45 that his blood would be shed for sin, Matthew 26:28, that he would rise again - and that they needed to be born again to enter the Kingdom.

Whether the disciples a) fully understood this and b) preached it when they were sent out by Jesus, is not the point.
Jesus taught it, and you can't enter the Kingdom without it. He said you need to be born again by the Spirit, not by believing 1 Cor 15.

If this is not "the Gospel of the Kingdom", what is? Do good deeds and you'll be saved?

John 20:31 tells the Jews how they can have eternal life thru the gospel of the kingdom

 

[wisemenpray]

Somebody asked me why I was always referring to Paul’s Gospel......I will attempt to make my case.....



Paul was God’s “ Chosen Vessel” to deliver the “ Good News” to the Gentiles. After Christ returned to Heaven, He used Paul as His Secretary to reveal the Mysteries Of God, kept secret since the Foundation Of the World .Jesus, in His Earthly Ministry to Israel never enlightened His Disciples to things in regard to the Church,the Rapture, The Body Of Christ with Jesus as the Head Of The Body, Justification Without The Works Of The Law, Salvation By Grace Alone, The Age Of Grace, the Gospel That proclaims one is Saved by Faith in the Risen Christ and the fact that He died for your sins. There was no mention of Giving from the Heart as opposed to being Obligated to give.....no mention of Forgiving others because YOU have been forgiven as opposed to forgiving because you will be denied forgiveness if you don’t......
Paul never wrote a word that Jesus did not tell him to say.......When reading the Epistles Of Paul, you need to realize that if Paul said it— JESUS said it!
I constantly bring up Paul’s Gospel because it is the Way Of Salvation to all that Believe it and Believe it enough to REST in it. It ALONE! If one adds to this Gospel Of Grace with any type of Works, they are “ Fallen From Grace”. Anybody that PREACHES a different gospel than the One that Paul preached in 1Cor15:1-4 is Damned by God forever.
This Gospel was given to Paul by Jesus Himself , not any man.The World sees this gospel as Foolishness , an offense to “ those that perish.”
John 3:16 has always been the “ Go To” verse for Salvation , and certainly there is no error in that.......BUT......Paul says that God will judge Mankind by “ HIS” Gospel- NOT by John 3:16..... it would be wise to get familiar with Paul’s Gospel and do as God Commands — REST in it or be accused of UNBELIEF— not the way you want to meet your Maker....
I think 1Cor15:1-4 is the best Anchor for our Faith....A nice place to put our Trust and ground us when things get crazy or when difficult verses are being debated.No matter what anybody says.....Jesus Promises, through Paul , to Save us if we simply Believe THIS GOSPEL ( Jesus died for our sins and rose from the grave ) .....Plus Nothing!God Bless......

 

[wisemenpray]

*And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles BY MY MOUTH should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.* Acts 15:7

How can God appoint Peter to preach the word to the gentiles, and at the same tell Paul that he is the one to preach the gospel to the gentiles? One of them is obviously a liar.