Hundreds of active and former police officers are part of extremist Facebook groups

[SummerMadness]

Actually i was responding to the remark about walking into white neighborhoods.

And more non-white citizens are accosted by the police for being in a white neighborhood. Your anecdote does not negate the data.

 

[W2L]

And more non-white citizens are accosted by the police for being in a white neighborhood. Your anecdote does not negate the data.

Just sharing my experience. Not trying to negate anything.

 

[Lord Give Me A Sign]

Im thankful to see that racism and oppression are often discussed on here. I am white but my girlfriend is Haitian and i know the streets well

I have listened to hours and hours or Rick Warren, Greg Laurie, Joyce Meyers and a few others

I rarely hear any mention of the oppression in America that minorities face. I think racism and oppression are often overlooked and many whites do not understand the struggle minorities go through. Im thankful a forum like this exists

 

[Brightmoon]

I just wanted to add that this isn't "Islamophobia." It is just simple racism and bigotry against white people. If I were to have reworded this as "It's walking down the street and worrying if that crowd of black guys on the corner is going to be a problem", what would you call it? BTW...I am Hispanic and resemble a muslim but I have never once "felt threatened" in the way you have described.

. Bigotry against WHITE people?!?!?!?! I have to put up with this crap myself or see other people putting up with it at least once a month. And I don’t live in a highly racist environment. Ever since that horror in the White House started shooting off his mouth it happens more and more.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

. Bigotry against WHITE people?!?!?!?! I have to put up with this crap myself or see other people putting up with it at least once a month. And I don’t live in a highly racist environment. Ever since that horror in the White House started shooting off his mouth it happens more and more.

It’s walking down the street and worrying if that crowd of white guys on the corner is gonna be a problem.

Yes, what you have just described above is bigotry and prejudice against white people. When a person claims that they become afraid and feel threatened because they assume that "the guys on the corner is gonna be a problem" for no other reason than because they are white, that is textbook prejudice and bigotry. It is not in any way different than when a white woman discovers that their new neighbors are black and say "Well, there goes the neighborhood." It is no different than when a black teenager walks into a store and immediately gets followed around. It is no different than when a white woman "feels threatened" and becomes afraid for no other reason than because a Middle Eastern looking man boards the airplane with her. It is bigotry and prejudice.

 

[SummerMadness]

Yes, what you have just described above is bigotry and racism against white people. When a person claims that they become afraid and feel threatened because they assume that "the guys on the corner is gonna be a problem" for no other reason than because they are white, that is textbook racism and bigotry. It is not in any way different than when a white woman discovers that their new neighbors are black and say "Well, there goes the neighborhood." It is no different than when a black teenager walks into a store and immediately gets followed around. It is no different than when a white woman "feels threatened" and becomes afraid for no other reason than because a Middle Eastern looking man boards the airplane with her. It is bigotry and racism.

No it is not textbook racism. Marginalized groups that fear being further marginalized by an oppressive group in power are not bigots if they fear further harassment. You are completely incorrect. Prejudiced perhaps, but not racist.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

No it is not textbook racism. Marginalized groups that fear being further marginalized by an oppressive group in power are not bigots if they fear further harassment. You are completely incorrect. Prejudiced perhaps, but not racist.

Perhaps we can call it bigotry induced prejudice.

 

[SummerMadness]

Perhaps we can call it bigotry induced prejudice.

You might want to look up the definition of bigotry, you're using the term incorrectly.

 

[Ophiolite]

I think that’s what makes traveling around the world so much more fascinating, I know I will never be bothered by the police unless I’ve actually done something wrong.

Sorry. I'm still grinning from ear to ear at that one. I figured you were making a joke, but I suspect you were serious. On that basis consider, in conducting my lawful business I have had the following occur, while travelling round the world:
1. Stopped while driving on a highway, obeying all traffic laws, and questioned while having two automatic rifles pointed at me.
2, Stopped on three separate occasions and given the option of paying an on the spot fine (i.e. bribe)of $100 or being conducted to a police cell for an alleged (but non-existent) traffic offence.
3. Stopped while getting into a car by armed police and held at gun point (pistol) while being interrogated.
4. Stopped on a highway by a combined police/military group, required to leave the car while several soldiers levelled automatic weapons at me.
5. Stopped in a taxi, at night, on a dark side road by police who demanded money. (No weapons produced on this occasion, but the taxi driver was ordered to walk 50m down the road while the "negotiation" proceeded.)

Five events. Four different countries. All anecdotal, as was your post. Of course, I'm white and British - a natural target. Racism involved? Probably not and if there was, so what? I'm not generally inconvenienced by any racism directed at me. I reserve my concern for personal racism at that directed at my wife and children.

 

[SummerMadness]

Sorry. I'm still grinning from ear to ear at that one. I figured you were making a joke, but I suspect you were serious. On that basis consider, in conducting my lawful business I have had the following occur, while travelling round the world:
1. Stopped while driving on a highway, obeying all traffic laws, and questioned while having two automatic rifles pointed at me.
2, Stopped on three separate occasions and given the option of paying an on the spot fine (i.e. bribe)of $100 or being conducted to a police cell for an alleged (but non-existent) traffic offence.
3. Stopped while getting into a car by armed police and held at gun point (pistol) while being interrogated.
4. Stopped on a highway by a combined police/military group, required to leave the car while several soldiers levelled automatic weapons at me.
5. Stopped in a taxi, at night, on a dark side road by police who demanded money. (No weapons produced on this occasion, but the taxi driver was ordered to walk 50m down the road while the "negotiation" proceeded.)

Five events. Four different countries. All anecdotal, as was your post. Of course, I'm white and British - a natural target. Racism involved? Probably not and if there was, so what? I'm not generally inconvenienced by any racism directed at me. I reserve my concern for personal racism at that directed at my wife and children.

Sadly, I'm a tad serious about this, especially when considering visiting countries that are comparable to the US in terms of economy and development. The only time I've experienced anything negative with police was at a checkpoint where the officer claimed a violation had been committed and demanded a bribe to be paid by the driver. We didn't pay, which meant we would have to sit at the checkpoint longer. The general attitude is that most people do not want to drive at night to avoid this hassle. But that's one incident out of the many times I've traveled around the world, and many times, the level of development in the country plays a bigger role in how the police act. Nonetheless, it pales in comparison to my negative encounters with police officers starting at the age of 12 in the US. Being asked for a bribe is unfortunate, but not the same as interrogating a child while shining a light in his/her face.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

You might want to look up the definition of bigotry, you're using the term incorrectly.

Bigotry = "intolerance towards those who hold different opinions from oneself." Perhaps "bigotry" is not an appropriate word. I think your recommendation of "prejudice" is more appropriate.

 

[SummerMadness]

Bigotry = "intolerance towards those who hold different opinions from oneself." Perhaps "bigotry" is not an appropriate word. I think your recommendation of "prejudice" is more appropriate.

Everyone holds prejudice, it's a question of whether that prejudice is understandable. A person that was mauled by a dog may have a certain negative attitude towards dogs that they may apply toward all dogs; it may not be justified to label all dogs as dangerous, but it is understandable. A person that was subject to a racist attack by a group of people may be wary of a group of people that look like their attackers. Understandable, but not racist. But if your prejudice comes from a space where it is defined by your ignorance and experience, it becomes more evidently racist/xenophobic/sexist/etc. Moreover, if your experience leads you to target a group in a manner that impinges on their rights and freedom, then it is more appropriately considered racist as their skin color becomes the target.

 

[rjs330]

Everyone holds prejudice, it's a question of whether that prejudice is understandable. A person that was mauled by a dog may have a certain negative attitude towards dogs that they may apply toward all dogs; it may not be justified to label all dogs as dangerous, but it is understandable. A person that was subject to a racist attack by a group of people may be wary of a group of people that look like their attackers. Understandable, but not racist. But if your prejudice comes from a space where it is defined by your ignorance and experience, it becomes more evidently racist/xenophobic/sexist/etc. Moreover, if your experience leads you to target a group in a manner that impinges on their rights and freedom, then it is more appropriately considered racist as their skin color becomes the target.

That's not how you typically look at it though. Or at least thats the way it seems. For example, stores predominantly have black people stealing so they start following black people around and people decry it as racism. I can't remember the last time you or anyone who thinks like you saying it's understandable to be wary, it's usually described as racist.

You are right though, people do have prejudices based upon personal experiences.

 

[SummerMadness]

That's not how you typically look at it though. Or at least thats the way it seems. For example, stores predominantly have black people stealing so they start following black people around and people decry it as racism. I can't remember the last time you or anyone who thinks like you saying it's understandable to be wary, it's usually described as racist.

You are right though, people do have prejudices based upon personal experiences.

There's a difference between reacting to a traumatic experience and instituting a discriminatory policy. Following black people around a store is racist, their skin color is not connected to the shoplifting, certain behaviors are related to shoplifting. The comparison is not valid.

 

[rjs330]

Let's get something straight here with this whole thing. This article deals with present and former officers. There are presently about 850,000-900,000 men and women in law enforcement. We don't have accurate numbers for retired ones today, but more than are working. So for fairness sake let's just say the numbers are even.

Now the sites listed are not all racist sites. Some were simply conservative sites like Allen West it Fox News.

Now they found what 400? So 400 out of about 2 million is supposed to be of great concern? That's .0002% of the men and women who are or have served.

Just to be clear here. Racism is a should be countered and not tolerated at all. If a cop is found to be racist, he should be fired. Plain and simple.

But this article and group leads one down the road that the problem is rampant and pervasive. And somehow they support this by showing that .0002% of cops visited those sites.

I would venture to guess that you would find that kind of percentage in just about any profession. And it would be inexcusable in any profession. But I don't see a lot of articles on the rampant racism of any other profession.

This falls along the same lines as cops shooting black people for no reason. Of all the police encounters across the USA less than 1% are found to be unjustified shootings. Yet by the way it is portrayed in the media you'd think cops were running around all over the place shooting black people Willy nilly. Less than 1%. Sure we'd like see 0%. But when your dealing with human beings you are not going to get 0%. Less than 1% is pretty awesome if you ask me. That's about as good as you are going to get.

 

[rjs330]

There's a difference between reacting to a traumatic experience and instituting a discriminatory policy. Following black people around a store is racist, their skin color is not connected to the shoplifting, certain behaviors are related to shoplifting. The comparison is not valid.

But you just said that it's understandable. And you equated it to dogs and groups of people. Let's use an example from where I live. Every year we have a Native American Pow Wow in town. When they are here crime goes up, shoplifting goes up. Do all of the NDN people steal? Of course not. But how does a shopkeeper supposed to differentiate between those that do or don't? They have to follow them around to see if the behaviors are there. That would be racist to you. Or would it be understandable?

Cops unjustifiably shoot people in less than 1% of the times they shoot someone. Then you claim that it's perfectly understandable if people are leery of cops. But the black population is only about 12% of the population and yet commits 28% of crime. But it's completely racist to deal with that.

 

[SummerMadness]

But you just said that it's understandable. And you equated it to dogs and groups of people. Let's use an example from where I live. Every year we have a Native American Pow Wow in town. When they are here crime goes up, shoplifting goes up. Do all of the NDN people steal? Of course not. But how does a shopkeeper supposed to differentiate between those that do or don't? They have to follow them around to see if the behaviors are there. That would be racist to you. Or would it be understandable?

Cops unjustifiably shoot people in less than 1% of the times they shoot someone. Then you claim that it's perfectly understandable if people are leery of cops. But the black population is only about 12% of the population and yet commits 28% of crime. But it's completely racist to deal with that.

Still trying to argue that it's skin color as the determining factor as opposed to behavior and still attempting to compare a traumatic experience to instituting a policy based on race. Yeah, there's are difference between racism and understandable prejudice based on personal experience.

 

[SummerMadness]

Let's get something straight here with this whole thing. This article deals with present and former officers. There are presently about 850,000-900,000 men and women in law enforcement. We don't have accurate numbers for retired ones today, but more than are working. So for fairness sake let's just say the numbers are even.

Now the sites listed are not all racist sites. Some were simply conservative sites like Allen West it Fox News.

Now they found what 400? So 400 out of about 2 million is supposed to be of great concern? That's .0002% of the men and women who are or have served.

Just to be clear here. Racism is a should be countered and not tolerated at all. If a cop is found to be racist, he should be fired. Plain and simple.

But this article and group leads one down the road that the problem is rampant and pervasive. And somehow they support this by showing that .0002% of cops visited those sites.

I would venture to guess that you would find that kind of percentage in just about any profession. And it would be inexcusable in any profession. But I don't see a lot of articles on the rampant racism of any other profession.

This falls along the same lines as cops shooting black people for no reason. Of all the police encounters across the USA less than 1% are found to be unjustified shootings. Yet by the way it is portrayed in the media you'd think cops were running around all over the place shooting black people Willy nilly. Less than 1%. Sure we'd like see 0%. But when your dealing with human beings you are not going to get 0%. Less than 1% is pretty awesome if you ask me. That's about as good as you are going to get.

Most people do not commit crimes, yet you still give tacit approval to racist practices such as racial profiling...

The difference here is that police are the government; most police officers see something and say nothing, yet they are the ones promoting "when you see something, say something." The abuses are carried out by a minority of the group, but the majority does absolutely nothing about it when they see those abuses. That's a big a problem and it hurts all police officers and is straight deadly for the public, especially people of color.

 

[iluvatar5150]

72 Philadelphia Police Officers Placed On Desk Duty Over Offensive Social Media Posts

 

[bhsmte]

Sadly, I'm a tad serious about this, especially when considering visiting countries that are comparable to the US in terms of economy and development. The only time I've experienced anything negative with police was at a checkpoint where the officer claimed a violation had been committed and demanded a bribe to be paid by the driver. We didn't pay, which meant we would have to sit at the checkpoint longer. The general attitude is that most people do not want to drive at night to avoid this hassle. But that's one incident out of the many times I've traveled around the world, and many times, the level of development in the country plays a bigger role in how the police act. Nonetheless, it pales in comparison to my negative encounters with police officers starting at the age of 12 in the US. Being asked for a bribe is unfortunate, but not the same as interrogating a child while shining a light in his/her face.

Ever consider, other people have had different experiences than you and they are just as valid as your personal experiences?