How to choose between creation and evolution.

[OldWiseGuy]

Some things are just too complex to decode even if you know the principles behind their working. The brain is the most complex thing we know of.

The evidence we have suggests that thoughts are the patterns of activity in the brain, but so far we can only tell whether someone is thinking of some particular thing if we already know the corresponding pattern of activity and we see it occurring again. We don't even need science to tell why people do some things, but many things people do are for reasons that are the result of the cumulative effects of a lifetime of experiences - there's not much chance of decoding a puzzle of that complexity.

I think the bigger question is the origin of thought; the brain or the mind.

 

[SelfSim]

Good will, evidenced by good behavior, comes from a spirit of good will (and conversely). It cannot be otherwise.

.. Just another belief that hides behind the semantics of language, in order to acquire credibility of existence.
We need to test for such things. The evidence shows us that there is a mind producing its own evidence of conceiving good will and then demonstrating it because minds produce behaviors (I know mine does!).. and none for an untestable 'spirit' conspiring in the background to steal credit from the mind that evidently did it!

Your conclusion of: 'It cannot be otherwise' demonstrates Absolutism, (which is just another belief). Science never claims such things .. neither can logic arrive at such all-encompassing exclusionary conclusions!

 

[VirOptimus]

I think the bigger question is the origin of thought; the brain or the mind.

Inserting magic concepts isnt helping your imagined ”point”.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

.. Just another belief that hides behind the semantics of language, in order to acquire credibility of existence.
We need to test for such things. The evidence shows us that there is a mind producing its own evidence of conceiving good will and then demonstrating it because minds produce behaviors (I know mine does!).. and none for an untestable 'spirit' conspiring in the background to steal credit from the mind that evidently did it!

Your conclusion of: 'It cannot be otherwise' demonstrates Absolutism, (which is just another belief). Science never claims such things .. neither can logic arrive at such all-encompassing exclusionary conclusions!

What do you think overrides certain decisions put forth by the mind? The conscious mind has several facets, one being the spirit or conscience. Indecision is often caused by a conflict between the mind and the conscience.

 

[Allandavid]

All that tells us is that there is brain activity. For example just seeing someone start their vehicle doesn't tell you where they are going.

I often take a longer indirect route home from the grocery store. If thoughts were material/physical the scientific method should be able to determine why I do this.

Your claim was that they couldn’t be observed...you said nothing about analysing them. That said, neurologists are able to utilise those heat maps to determine where in the brain our thoughts derive, simply by having people think of various concepts and seeing which parts ‘light up’ as a result...this has been well known for some time.

And, as I said earlier, the ultimate evidence of the brain’s functions causing thought is found in the effect of suffering a brain injury. Ever seen ‘One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest’...?

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Please reference your post#2310.

For the record, would you mind correcting the quotation in it?
(I did not say the things you attribute to me).

Just a case of errored attribution, methinks.
Cheers

Done! My apologies, it must have been a system glitch - I clicked 'Reply' on coffe4u's post and didn't even notice the quote attribution was wrong... It has been known to happen occasionally.

 

[SelfSim]

.. I often take a longer indirect route home from the grocery store. If thoughts were material/physical the scientific method should be able to determine why I do this.

I can ask you why you do this and observe how you make references to your own mind in your response. I can then draw conclusions when I see evidence of your own mental processes, from your description.
That is the scientific method being applied in order to investigate.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I can ask you why you do this and observe how you make references to your own mind in your response. I can then draw conclusions when I see evidence of your own mental processes, from your description.
That is the scientific method being applied in order to investigate.

If I tell you why, you don't need the scientific method.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

I think the bigger question is the origin of thought; the brain or the mind.

The indications are that the mind is what the brain does; IOW it's a process that we have reified.

 

[SelfSim]

What do you think overrides certain decisions put forth by the mind? The conscious mind has several facets, one being the spirit or conscience. Indecision is often caused by a conflict between the mind and the conscience.

Are you referring to ethics/morality?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Are you referring to ethics/morality?

How the mind deals with ethics and morality.

 

[SelfSim]

If I tell you why, you don't need the scientific method.

Are you saying that science somehow forbids me from applying the the scientific method to the content of what rolls off your fingertips, or comes from your mouth?
Why would I accept that when I can just go ahead and apply scientific thinking? Its not like I need permission from someone else or something .. its quite a natural thing for all of us to do y'know(?)

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Are you saying that science somehow forbids me from applying the the scientific method to the content of what rolls off your fingertips, or comes from your mouth?
Why would I accept that when I can just go ahead and apply scientific thinking? Its not like I need permission from someone else or something .. its quite a natural thing for all of us to do y'know(?)

I didn't say you can't use the SM, just that if I tell you you will have all the answers you need without it.

 

[SelfSim]

How the mind deals with ethics and morality.

Its ethical and moral to accept responsibility for one's own words and actions .. and not ethical, or moral, to pretend they exist in some form which is somehow independent from my mind.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Its ethical and moral to accept responsibility for one's own words and actions .. and not ethical, or moral, to pretend they exist in some form which is somehow independent from my mind.

My mind rationalizes my ethics and morality, therefore...

 

[SelfSim]

I didn't say you can't use the SM, just that if I tell you you will have all the answers you need without it.

I wonder if cops presently doing roadblocks during lockdown just blindly accept excuses without cross-checking the logic and the stories coming from the drivers? (If they don't, they must be following some other process which makes use of the driver responses .. its quite a natural process for minds to follow, y'know).

 

[SelfSim]

My mind rationalizes my ethics and morality, therefore...

.. well I can't step outside of my own mind y'know .. I've sorta become attached to it (or I was born attached to it).

 

[coffee4u]

It could, in principle, be wrong, but can't be a hoax because there's no intent to decieve.

Oh yes there is. Satan will do whatever it takes to keep people away from the knowledge that God created them, that they are sinful and in need of a saviour.
If chance random process made us then there can easily be no God in this world view. Which means man sets the rules with no need to answer to any God.
If God made us, he sets the rules, he is in control, and we will answer to him.

 

[sjastro]

Oh yes there is. Satan will do whatever it takes to keep people away from the knowledge that God created them, that they are sinful and in need of a saviour.
If chance random process made us then there can easily be no God in this world view. Which means man sets the rules with no need to answer to any God.
If God made us, he sets the rules, he is in control, and we will answer to him.

Can God create a weight he/she cannot lift or make 1+1=3?
(Warning alert this is the Ominpotence Paradox.)

 

[Speedwell]

Oh yes there is. Satan will do whatever it takes to keep people away from the knowledge that God created them, that they are sinful and in need of a saviour.
If chance random process made us then there can easily be no God in this world view. Which means man sets the rules with no need to answer to any God.
If God made us, he sets the rules, he is in control, and we will answer to him.

Seems like a really dumb way for Satan to go about it. No wonder he's going to lose in the end.