How some creationists pushed me away from christianity

[Oncedeceived]

If that had happened to me, the new knowledge would be that although I knew in theory that our God is a personal God, with interest in each one of us, however small, the lights would have been a direct statement from him that he is interested in my life, and that I am safe in his hands.

In one way this is nothing new; we can read the same message in Psalm 23, but having Psalm 23 portrayed all the way across the sky in lights, just for you to see, is a lovely gift from God.

Several thousand other people probably saw those lights at the same time, but only those who had asked God for a sign would have been able to recognise exactly what they were seeing. That is how it works.

I agree and disagree with you so much it makes my head spin.

 

[Catherineanne]

Maybe God is the cause behind these doubts.

I think God would prefer me not to have these doubts. He tries to reassure me through my priest, but they remain all the same.

The cause is ancient history. It is not easy for someone with a history of chronic abuse to accept unconditional love and acceptance, even from God. They don't count as sin, because this is not my choice, but the healing is going to take some time.

 

[Catherineanne]

I agree and disagree with you so much it makes my head spin.

If we agreed with everyone all the time life would be incredibly dull, and we would have nothing to say to one another.

 

[Oncedeceived]

I think God would prefer me not to have these doubts. He tries to reassure me through my priest, but they remain all the same.

The cause is ancient history. It is not easy for someone with a history of chronic abuse to accept unconditional love and acceptance, even from God. They don't count as sin, because this is not my choice, but the healing is going to take some time.

God doesn't want you to doubt His love or concern for you that is very true. I meant that sometimes we choose the wrong avenue of worship of Him. Just something to think about.

I am sorry that you have had so much pain in your life. God will heal you and yes it will take time. He will lead you in the way that you should go. Just always listen, which I am sure you are.

 

[Oncedeceived]

If we agreed with everyone all the time life would be incredibly dull, and we would have nothing to say to one another.

While I agree with this as well, some disagreements are there to show us certain things that we need to see.

 

[Catherineanne]

God doesn't want you to doubt His love or concern for you that is very true. I meant that sometimes we choose the wrong avenue of worship of Him. Just something to think about.

Thanks for the concern, but you do not need to worry.

I am more than safe with my present church and priest; the worship resonates with my faith, and is most certainly the right one for me. It might not be right for you, but it is for me. My church has Mass (Eucharist) every day, and this is a very great blessing; unless you understand what that means to a catholic, you can have no real idea, but it is everything.

I am sorry that you have had so much pain in your life. God will heal you and yes it will take time. He will lead you in the way that you should go. Just always listen, which I am sure you are.

The healing will happen in God's time, and indeed already is, but it is slow. I accept God's will in this, as indeed in everything.

 

[Catherineanne]

While I agree with this as well, some disagreements are there to show us certain things that we need to see.

Funny how it is somehow always the others who need to see, though, isn't it?

 

[Delphiki]

Not that the need to see: that they need to stop having hallucinations, delusions, and/or simply lying about the things they've seen.

 

[Catherineanne]

Not that the need to see: that they need to stop having hallucinations, delusions, and/or simply lying about the things they've seen.

You really don't understand religion at all, do you?

 

[selfinflikted]

You are mistaken. These are relatively new concepts that atheists are trying to make into a definition, but it is not the received version. There is no such thing a weak atheism, for a start.

I would disagree, but I've been wrong before (like, once. Ever).

Lacking a belief in God - or anything else - does not make you an atheist.

In fact, that is the very definition of "atheist."

I am not an Allah atheist, or a Vishnu atheist.

I would argue that you are.

However, feel free to believe it if it makes you happier.

Irrelevant. I just want to agree on definitions so that meaningful discussion can take place.

I won't quibble over the definitions of these words too much, but I will cite a common reference to back up my earlier definitions:

From Wiki:

Atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities.[1] In a narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[2] Most inclusively, atheism is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist.[3] (Atheism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia)

Agnosticism is the view that the truth value of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—is unknown or unknowable.[1][2][3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnosticism)

(emphasis mine)

 

[Oncedeceived]

Funny how it is somehow always the others who need to see, though, isn't it?

Not at all. Hence Oncedeceived.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Not that the need to see: that they need to stop having hallucinations, delusions, and/or simply lying about the things they've seen.

Why in the world are you so terribly bitter?

 

[Delphiki]

You really don't understand religion at all, do you?

Do you even realize how often this accusation is made?
i used to be Christian. The fact that I'm now an atheist shows that I have a thorough understanding of religion.

All it takes is for one to be honest with themselves. Just don't get so stubborn in what your supposed to believe that you go setting off bombs or condoning those who do, then we'll be fine.

 

[Catherineanne]

Do you even realize how often this accusation is made?

There's a reason for that.

i used to be Christian. The fact that I'm now an atheist shows that I have a thorough understanding of religion.

The evidence indicates quite the opposite, I would say.

All it takes is for one to be honest with themselves. Just don't get so stubborn in what your supposed to believe that you go setting off bombs or condoning those who do, then we'll be fine.

Shame on you for even thinking such a thing.

 

[Non sequitur]

There's a reason for that.

The evidence indicates quite the opposite, I would say.

Shame on you for even thinking such a thing.

I like how you judged them and what they have experienced

 

[Catherineanne]

I like how you judged them and what they have experienced

Because making an observation about someone is exactly the same as passing judgment, and as deciding that Christians probably condone terrorism.

I thought there was supposed to be a premium on logic and reason around here?

 

[Oncedeceived]

But the longer I wait, the more it hardens my heart. So the later it comes, the less successful it will be.

No one probably had a harder heart than John. He persecuted the church with great exuberance. Jesus appeared to Him and He gave his life over to preaching the gospel.

Absolutely. If there's a God, and Jesus is His son who died for our sins, and by accepting Jesus as such (and all that entails) I am spared eternal damnation, then yes, a simple phone call that would almost certainly make the idea of God far more palatable and believable for me is a call I absolutely want.

I'm having trouble equating this with this?:

"I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day." - Douglas Adams

"Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?" - Douglas Adams

"Skaloopdidit" - Keeping Skaloop as the first cause until science can rule him out.

"I'd be a theist if it weren't for God." - Me

 

[Non sequitur]

Because making an observation about someone is exactly the same as passing judgment, and as deciding that Christians probably condone terrorism.

I thought there was supposed to be a premium on logic and reason around here?

I am confused by your statement.

Are you saying he does nor does not have a good understanding of religion?

 

[Oncedeceived]

Thanks for the concern, but you do not need to worry.

Your welcome.

I am more than safe with my present church and priest; the worship resonates with my faith, and is most certainly the right one for me. It might not be right for you, but it is for me.

It doesn't matter if it is right for you or me really. Right?

My church has Mass (Eucharist) every day, and this is a very great blessing; unless you understand what that means to a catholic, you can have no real idea, but it is everything.

I am unaware why it would be more meaningful for a catholic than for any other Christian but I am not catholic so I may be ignorant of this.

The healing will happen in God's time, and indeed already is, but it is slow. I accept God's will in this, as indeed in everything.

Very glad to hear it...sincerely.

 

[Delphiki]

Someone post that study showing atheists understand religion better than religious people. I'm getting tired of doing it.

See, the whole reason one remains Christian is because there has to be something that makes them incapable of seeing the contradictions in the bible, or incapable of discerning the reason for interpreting one passage literally and another figuratively even in cases where they are in the same book.

It's what you implement logic and actually understand the words you're reading (or at least not selectively making special pleas to fit your opinion when the bible blatantly disagrees with you) that causes one to lose faith in it.

The reason I'm an atheist is because I understand religion.