How Fauci Fooled America

[Searching1God]

He was not involved with any horrible Beagle study. This is a right-wing lie.

Sigh...

Do you even know who puts the Ethical stamp on scientific experiments conducted at the NIH?

DO YOU EVEN KNOW???????

It's Fauci's WIFE, Dr. Christine Grady! She is the Chief of the Department of Bioethics at the National Institutes of Health Clinical Center. Here is her bio at the NIH:
Principal Investigators

Let's not even talk about the conflict of interest!! Fauci's wife is the chief person who can rubberstamp all those experiments as "Ethical". That is how deep the rabbit hole is.

 

[Bradskii]

If you have not caught sight of Fauci saying that he lied to us about masks....

Nup. Never saw that. I saw him saying very early on in the outbreak that wearing masks was unnecessary at that stage. Nothing about him saying that he lied. Maybe you have something we all missed?

 

[Searching1God]

Nup. Never saw that. I saw him saying very early on in the outbreak that wearing masks was unnecessary at that stage. Nothing about him saying that he lied. Maybe you have something we all missed?

Okay.

You seem honest and sincere enough, so I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt. From the horse's mouth:

 

[muichimotsu]

If you have not caught sight of Fauci saying that he lied to us about masks for a good reason. when it was all over the news, I am not going to entertain you.

So no burden of proof for your claim, just deflect responsibility?

 

[Bradskii]

Okay.

You seem honest and sincere enough, so I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt. From the horse's mouth:

You said Fauci admitted that he lied. You asked us about 'Fauci saying that he lied to us about masks.' I said he explained why he said masks weren't recommended early in the pandemic. That video didn't show him admitting that he lied. The video just confirmed what I said and denied what you said.

 

[muichimotsu]

Okay.

You seem honest and sincere enough, so I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt. From the horse's mouth:

Wow, pretty sure someone in the thread already debunked this and I barely watched a minute of it before I pieced that together. They never lied, because they never said it wasn't effective absolutely, but also it was based on concerns of limited supplies, because we saw how people would panic buy things because capitalist greed.

They were trying to maintain a balance here, lying entails malicious intent and deception versus the problem of the government (which is separate from the health community) putting forth one message based on issues of causing a panic or the like. If masks didn't work, then why were they still trying to keep them supplied to healthcare workers?

The government was the issue here (particularly Trump's administration, as I recall), not the medical community that were trying to put out that message, but the government got ahead of them and spread disinformation and misinformation in regards to mask efficacy, which would be lying, the very thing the medical community was not doing. It's like you only half listened to the video and the content in question to fit your narrative and not actually listening with full focus

 

[Searching1God]

You said Fauci admitted that he lied. You asked us about 'Fauci saying that he lied to us about masks.' I said he explained why he said masks weren't recommended early in the pandemic. That video didn't show him admitting that he lied. The video just confirmed what I said and denied what you said.

You didn't see an admission of a lie in the video I just posted?...

I thought you seemed honest and sincere enough...Oh well...I now see we have no common ground to hold a conversation. Carry on!

 

[RDKirk]

Wow, pretty sure someone in the thread already debunked this and I barely watched a minute of it before I pieced that together. They never lied, because they never said it wasn't effective absolutely, but also it was based on concerns of limited supplies, because we saw how people would panic buy things because capitalist greed.

Then Fauci was ignorant of the logistical system. Civilian "panic buying" would not touch the medical supply. Those are totally different supply chains right out of the factory. The product isn't even the same. What would--and did--happen was that 3M stopped making civilian masks and funneled all their efforts into the medical supply chain. The product is different, the retailing suppliers are different. If they had told the truth, civilians would simply have found empty shelves at Home Depot.

But by claiming that civilians need not wear masks (which I knew was false from the start), Fauci did prevent industry from ramping up mask production. Companies like GM and a couple of gun manufacturers were prepared to convert production lines to mask production (GM in fact already had converted to mask production), but the government told them "No thanks" because Fauci had said it was not required. That is the worst part of the lie: It killed any US ramping up of mask manufacturing. So today we're all wearing Chinese and Korean masks.

They didn't learn anything new about masking to change the recommendation later. Yes, he did lie.

 

[Searching1God]

A lie is not a lie if it's told by Saint Fauci.

well, um, ...we told people that masks were useless, but, we were saying that because we were concerned about having enough supplies of mask for medical personel... blah blah blah

So, it's not a lie. It's just truthism.

 

[Bradskii]

You didn't see an admission of a lie in the video I just posted?...

I thought you seemed honest and sincere enough...Oh well...I now see we have no common ground to hold a conversation. Carry on!

You said he said he lied. That means that Fauci uttered the words 'I lied'. He didn't. He told everyone, quite rightly, that masks weren't necessary at that early stage of the pandemic. Later he changed his position to one where he said that masks were required. I'll type that bit again: 'he changed his position...'

I think as a general rule you should be a little more specific when you claims someone said something. If you had said 'It seems to me like he lied' then that would have been quite accurate (in that that was what it seemed to you to be). You'd still have been wrong re Fauci lying but your statement would have been more reasonable.

But thanks for your input.

 

[muichimotsu]

Then Fauci was ignorant of the logistical system. Civilian "panic buying" would not touch the medical supply. Those are totally different supply chains right out of the factory. The product isn't even the same. What would--and did--happen was that 3M stopped making civilian masks and funneled all their efforts into the medical supply chain. The product is different, the retailing suppliers are different. If they had told the truth, civilians would simply have found empty shelves at Home Depot.

But by claiming that civilians need not wear masks (which I knew was false from the start), Fauci did prevent industry from ramping up mask production. Companies like GM and a couple of gun manufacturers were prepared to convert production lines to mask production (GM in fact already had converted to mask production), but the government told them "No thanks" because Fauci had said it was not required. That is the worst part of the lie: It killed any US ramping up of mask manufacturing. So today we're all wearing Chinese and Korean masks.

They didn't learn anything new about masking to change the recommendation later. Yes, he did lie.

No one said it would affect the medical supply, it would still affect a supply, same as with anything when you have price gouging and a shortage.

That's not lying when he was, by your own description, ignorant of the supply chains. That's being wrong, which is decidedly different from saying something you know to be wrong and presenting it as the truth.

If everyone involved knew masks worked and said otherwise, then that's a lie and a conspiratorial level one, but if there's just a miscommunication issue and understandable ignorance that a specialist in communicable diseases would not necessarily know, then that cannot logically and definitively be called lying anymore than someone confidently selling something that turns out to be fraudulent if they didn't know it themselves.

 

[muichimotsu]

A lie is not a lie if it's told by Saint Fauci.

well, um, ...we told people that masks were useless, but, we were saying that because we were concerned about having enough supplies of mask for medical personel... blah blah blah

So, it's not a lie. It's just truthism.

Fauci being wrong is not the same as him insisting he was right and refusing to admit it: that's Trump's playbook. Fauci will and likely has admitted he was wrong, admitting you knew something was the case and telling people otherwise is admitting you lied, but acknowledging you missed some factor of a supply chain and the like.

Plus the government's desire to downplay the pandemic so Trump could promote himself for reelection affected things, because Trump's own rhetoric downplayed it and he is on record in an interview that he did so because he knew otherwise he wouldn't get all the attention he still craves

 

[stevil]

Fauci himself said that he lied. He claimed that he lied for a good reason.

But funnily enough, there are videos of him before Covid saying that wearing masks against coronaviruses or H1N1 virus is a waste of time.

So he is either lying, or flipflopping because he doesn't really know what he is talking about.

He has always said that the wearer of the mask isn't protected from catching Covid 19, but that people should wear the masks to reduce the spread to others.

 

[RDKirk]

You said he said he lied. That means that Fauci uttered the words 'I lied'.

Oh, come on. You're more sophisticated than that.

 

[RDKirk]

No one said it would affect the medical supply, it would still affect a supply, same as with anything when you have price gouging and a shortage.

That's doubletalk. He specifically mentioned the medical supply. The medical supply chain is controlled.

That's not lying when he was, by your own description, ignorant of the supply chains. That's being wrong, which is decidedly different from saying something you know to be wrong and presenting it as the truth.

I had a commander who taught me, "It's okay to be mistaken, but never be wrong. Being mistaken is when you tell me about it...being wrong is when you don't."

Fauci knew that masks were effective for medical people who worked within the contagion--he said that. He knew that essential non-medical workers would also have to continue to work within the contagion themselves. That was the truth he knew. He did not tell that truth, he said that civilians didn't need masks.

 

[RDKirk]

He has always said that the wearer of the mask isn't protected from catching Covid 19, but that people should wear the masks to reduce the spread to others.

He was talking about cloth masks there. N-95 masks work both ways--which is why medical personnel working within the contagion wear them.

 

[Bradskii]

Oh, come on. You're more sophisticated than that.

Nah. I took him at his word. I did ask to make sure. I read what he said and what he said never happened. He thought it happened. But even the evidence he gave showed he was wrong. He was even wrong in thinking he was right.

 

[NxNW]

Sigh...

Do you even know who puts the Ethical stamp on scientific experiments conducted at the NIH?

DO YOU EVEN KNOW???????

It's Fauci's WIFE, Dr. Christine Grady! She is the Chief of the Department of Bioethics at the National Institutes of Health Clinical Center. Here is her bio at the NIH:
Principal Investigators

Let's not even talk about the conflict of interest!! Fauci's wife is the chief person who can rubberstamp all those experiments as "Ethical". That is how deep the rabbit hole is.

Since the NIH did not fund any such experiment, I assume you have a reason for bringing all this up?

 

[Searching1God]

He has always said that the wearer of the mask isn't protected from catching Covid 19, but that people should wear the masks to reduce the spread to others.

No he has not ALWAYS said that.
In fact, in the beginning of the pandemic, he said wearing masks were not doing anything.

 

[Searching1God]

You said he said he lied. That means that Fauci uttered the words 'I lied'. He didn't. He told everyone, quite rightly, that masks weren't necessary at that early stage of the pandemic. Later he changed his position to one where he said that masks were required. I'll type that bit again: 'he changed his position...'

I think as a general rule you should be a little more specific when you claims someone said something. If you had said 'It seems to me like he lied' then that would have been quite accurate (in that that was what it seemed to you to be). You'd still have been wrong re Fauci lying but your statement would have been more reasonable.

But thanks for your input.

Let me explore your logic.

If when confronted by my husband, I tell him: I told you I was having lunch with my girlfriends, but it is because I didn't want to tell you I was having lunch with another man.

I didn't utter the word lie, I didn't say I lied, so I didn't admit to a lie. Got it!

And by the way, NO! Fauci didn't change his position. Fauci stated that he and the government official said masks were not useful because they wanted to protect mask supplies for the hospital workers.