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Yes but your focus seems to be stealing where as the pro grace person doesn't even think about it. There is no dwelling on it. I did't say they're not tempted and can't fall (sin). Some are more affected by vanity than others. I have no desire for your stuff. I might find it usefull and therefore aquire (purchase) something similar or build it my self. These days need is more a motivating factor for me. It (need) has always been a more primary factor in my life.
Isn't the teaching of love good enough? Do you really have to be told what you don't like being done to you?
Yes,and if you read a little farther, you can see that the writer of Hebrews recognizes the possibilty that one can be sanctified and yet still reject it.Do u see progressive sanctification here?
NRSV Hebrews 10:14 For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are sanctified.
What needs to be done? Does one have to go through the 613 laws found in the law and make a personal statement on each one to drive home the idea that they simply have no desire to perform the shalt nots of the law as a Christian. I think that this lack of desire comes from within a person by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit for the Christian.
I can't speak for the unregenerate in this matter. It is that I also see this coming from inside a person. I will say that some are more given to evil than others. What better genes? I dunno.
It does contribute to more difficulty in reaching them for Jesus. The lack of holiness on the part of church goers makes it even more difficult to reach these people for Jesus. I too have no need of the behavior exhibited by most church goers who call themselves Christians. Holiness is a very real issue.
The lack of desire to obey God comes from self, not the Holy Spirit. To want to disobey God is unholy. And I'm sure we've all been there, but that doesnt' mean we shouldn't obey Him. The Holy Spirit prompts us to obey, never to disobey.
I think when someone views the law as ugly and damaging rather than given by God, it's going to look like a drudgery. But King David said 'oh how I love Your Law" and even Paul said the law is holy.
The desire to obey comes from the flesh wanting to prove it's good enough to be with God . this attitude nullifies the power of the cross .
Therefore, the risen life must be the reason and source for transformation not the deadness of the old written code .
This is how St Basil put it:
If we turn away from evil out of fear of punishment, we are in the position of slaves. If we pursue the enticement of wages, . . . we resemble mercenaries. Finally if we obey for the sake of the good itself and out of love for him who commands . . . we are in the position of children.
The desire to obey comes through the flesh?? I'm not even answering this one.
The flesh wants a list, but obedience is trusting God not knowing what he wants you to do next . the former is idolatry .
I've no desire to become holy or righteous because I already am according to Scripture. See Romans and Timothy for starters.
Well, Jesus said that 'by their fruits you will know them'. I could turn your statement around and say that anyone can think they're a Christian in reality without truly being one. In any case, Catholics believe salvation is a process, worked out over time (we're saved, being saved, and will be saved). We have the confidence of salvation without the 100% certainty that only God is privy to. For our part we must continuously choose-we must persevere in doing right, in growing in faith, hope, and love for God, which expresses itself in how we live and treat others. IMO that's a balanced understanding of it all.
I've no desire to become holy or righteous because I already am according to Scripture. See Romans and Timothy for starters.
Well so far we have 3 different kinds or levels of the Temple.
i was taking a James approach, if they want a law, talk about the perfect law of liberty .
What is it?
I ask because some seem to say holiness and righteosuness aren't the same thing.
No one will see God without holiness and yet righteousness is discussed in Scripture to imply holiness? I think there is more than one meaning of holiness or being holy. What do you think?
I think there is only one meaning torighteousness.
Yes, he's rejecting the position of mercenaries -as an inferior one. And he's saying that, as a believer matures, fear is replaced more and more with genuine love for God.God tells us to store up treasure in heaven and Hes not telling us to be mercenaries, God tells us to perfect Holiness in the fear of God, if anything it means we are slaves to our flesh because if we are not yet seeking Holiness. I'm not saying St basil is wrong by any means, i'm just expounding on what he said.
God tells us to follow peace and holiness, Its described by the apostles and we're told to follow it. We cant ignore what they teach us.
Originally Posted by NanopantsTo isolate the word here obfuscates its meaning. We have some options here, but they are limited since we know that whatever "perfect" means in this case, it is "perfect" as God is "perfect". Now we can either elevate the semantics of the word to the level of that which describes an aspect of God, or we can bring God down to our level to fit within our chosen definition.
Ya noticed that also?Tell you what though. It sure causes a problem in most people's theology.
Especially cooks in diners after they use the bathroomJames said "cleanse ye hands ye sinners, and humble yourselves before God".
Especially cooks in diners after they use the bathroom
Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary
Young) Matthew 27:24 And Pilate having seen that it profiteth nothing, but rather a tumult is made, having taken water, he did wash the hands before the multitude, saying "I am innocent from the blood of this righteous one; ye--ye shall see"
Reve 6:16 And they are saying to the mountains and to the rocks 'be falling upon us! and hide us! from face of the One sitting upon the Throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb
17 that came the great day of the wrath of Him, and who is able to stand'. [Hosea 10:8/Luke 23:30]
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