Gun Control

[SkyWriting]

What a complicated way to keep track on guns and shooters. Get rid of the guns, make it mandatory to keep guns in a gun safe and bullets in a different location with the gun's firing mechanism separated from the body of the gun and stop selling guns to people who do not have a justifiable reason for having one - hunting and access to hunting lands, professional target shooter and such.

That would eliminate most of the legal guns and have no effect on illegal arms.
Has there ever been a mass shooting or a sniper at a gun show?


Has there ever been a mass shooting at a grade school, high school, or a music concert?
If so, then how did that happen? Those are gun-free zones!

 

[SkyWriting]

Not sure where you get your numbers.
as of noon eastern time, for the last 5 days I have 4 dead and 18 wounded.

Mass Shooting Tracker

More than 800 People Have Been Shot in America Since Las Vegas
At least 25 people were accidentally shot in the week after Las Vegas, 13 of them fatally.

 

[SkyWriting]

Not sure where you get your numbers.
as of noon eastern time, for the last 5 days I have 4 dead and 18 wounded.

Mass Shooting Tracker

Your link shows 3 dead on the same day and 7 after that.

 

[GingerBeer]

That would eliminate most of the legal guns and have no effect on illegal arms.
Has there ever been a mass shooting or a sniper at a gun show?


Has there ever been a mass shooting at a grade school, high school, or a music concert?
If so, then how did that happen? Those are gun-free zones!

Most of the mass shootings are done by the legal owners of legal guns I think. The idea that legal guns keep law abiding citizens safe from illegal guns wielded by mean nasty criminals is one of the absurdities that the NRA repeats and repeats until a gullible public accepts it as if it were true.

 

[SkyWriting]

Agreed, but access to cigarettes are not Constitutionaly guaranteed. The 2nd amendment makes firearms ownership a unique right, and the Supreme Court has affirmed it to be an individual right in DC vs. Heller. To introduce technology that forces price increases to an extent that the common man can no longer afford a firearm could be argued to be an unreasonable burden on the private citizens ability to excessive their constitutional right. It would be like limiting the right to free speech to only those who can afford to purchase a venue to speak in.

That has been argued? Or you're just imagining such an argument.
Or you do plan to argue that before the court?
I imagine they will laugh you back home.
Has the "unreasonable burden" tactic ever been used in court on access issues?
Can I use the "unreasonable burden" tactic for
housing?
Healthcare?
Tithing at church?

 

[Phil 1:21]

Most of the mass shootings are done by the legal owners of legal guns I think.

You would "think" wrong.

The idea that legal guns keep law abiding citizens safe from illegal guns wielded by mean nasty criminals is one of the absurdities that the NRA repeats and repeats until a gullible public accepts it as if it were true.

11 times a good guy with a gun stopped a bad guy, saving lives - Photos - Washington Times

 

[GingerBeer]

You would "think" wrong.

The Las Vegas mass shooter owned his guns legally and even owned only legal extensions and ammunition for them yet he shot and killed 58 people and caused the wounding and/or injury of another 500 people. Even if every last one of those 500 and more people was carrying a holstered gun they would still have been shot and the shooter would still have been safe. The truth is that people only rarely carry a gun ready to "stop the bad guys". That's just a fantasy.

 

[SkyWriting]

Most of the mass shootings are done by the legal owners of legal guns I think. The idea that legal guns keep law abiding citizens safe from illegal guns wielded by mean nasty criminals is one of the absurdities that the NRA repeats and repeats until a gullible public accepts it as if it were true.

How often a person can defend them self is a practical issue.
The point being, if we have any gun rights at all, we have
the RIGHT to defend ourselves and our property.

Even if it is most likely that gun will harm us. It's like
saying we have the right to have a baseball bat to defend
ourselves, even though thugs often find it and hit us with it.

If gun are kept in locked cases, then people can defend themselves
less often, but with less danger to themselves. If guns were kept in
a shielded bunker, then people could defend themselves quite safely.

 

[GingerBeer]

How often a person can defend them self is a practical issue.
The point being, if we have any gun rights at all, we have
the RIGHT to defend ourselves and our property.

Even if it is most likely that gun will harm us. It's like
saying we have the right to have a baseball bat to defend
ourselves, even though thugs often find it and hit us with it.

Okay, you want a gun to shoot at burgles or something. Fine. People in England manage to "defend their property" without shooting at anybody and they do not usually have guns. The same is true of people in most Western Democracies - the USA excluded. Nobody has a "right to own a gun" but USA people think of "the right to bear arms" as a personal "right". Fine. Have it that way. It works well for the USA, right? 200+ mass shootings so far in 2017 - yep it works really well.

 

[SkyWriting]

The Las Vegas mass shooter owned his guns legally and even owned only legal extensions and ammunition for them yet he shot and killed 58 people and caused the wounding and/or injury of another 500 people. Even if ever last one of those 500 and more people was carrying a holstered gun they would still have been shot and the shooter would still have been safe. The truth is that people only rarely carry a gun ready to "stop the bad guys". That's just a fantasy.

My proposal would work for all legal guns to quickly locate any use of the gun.
I can't help the 70 minute delay getting to the shooter.

 

[Aldebaran]

I said cities will ban car drivers and only allow self driving cars, soon in N Y.
Another topic is banning the resale of unmodified used guns, which is possible.

Based on what I've seen, I wouldn't want to be riding in a car where I'm "banned" from driving it if it goes out of control.

In the same vein, I certainly wouldn't want to face a violent criminal in my home using a gun that is "modified" with electronic gizmos that are prone to failure. BTW, those are the only kind that have been introduced so far.

 

[SkyWriting]

Okay, you want a gun to shoot at burgles or something. Fine. People in England manage to "defend their property" without shooting at anybody and they do not usually have guns. The same is true of people in most Western Democracies - the USA excluded. Nobody has a "right to own a gun" but USA people think of "the right to bear arms" as a personal "right". Fine. Have it that way. It works well for the USA, right? 200+ mass shootings so far in 2017 - yep it works really well.

I find that they live in fear of the government. Most of us in the US don't have that worry.

 

[SkyWriting]

Based on what I've seen, I wouldn't want to be riding in a car where I'm "banned" from driving it if it goes out of control.

Traction control works way better than you can to stop a car.
So far, self driving cars are multiple times safer than your driving.

 

[SkyWriting]

In the same vein, I certainly wouldn't want to face a violent criminal in my home using a gun that is "modified" with electronic gizmos that are prone to failure. BTW, those are the only kind that have been introduced so far.

And this is not like that. It simply changes some of the gun noise into
radio waves so the "Bang" is easier to track. I appreciate you being back on the topic!

 

[Aldebaran]

If guns were kept in
a shielded bunker, then people could defend themselves quite safely.

Maybe so, but only if the owner was in that shielded bunker as well.

 

[SkyWriting]

Children are raised with violence as entertainment in video games and movies.

It has been shown that people who "practice" violence in video games
make more responsible choices in real life becasue they have thought
things through more often.

 

[Aldebaran]

Traction control works way better than you can to stop a car.
So far, self driving cars are multiple times safer than your driving.

Traction control only works if the malfunctioning computer that drives the car tells it to.

Ever hear about the guy who was so proud of his self driving car that he took videos all the time to brag about it--right up to the point where he crashed into a semi truck that the computer couldn't distinguish from the sky? He's dead now.

 

[GingerBeer]

My proposal would work for all legal guns to quickly locate any use of the gun.
I can't help the 70 minute delay getting to the shooter.

Las Vegas mass shooting only lasted 11 minutes. Knowing where he was would not have ended it in 11 minutes or less. Anyway, not having a gun would have stopped him doing it in the first place. Repeal the second amendment and get rid of guns except for people who really have a good reason to have one and even then keep the guns in a safe separated from their firing mechanism and from ammunition. separate safes, locked and inspected every few months by the police.

 

[Aldebaran]

Las Vegas mass shooting only lasted 11 minutes. Knowing where he was would not have ended it in 11 minutes or less. Anyway, not having a gun would have stopped him doing it in the first place. Repeal the second amendment and get rid of guns except for people who really have a good reason to have one and even then keep the guns in a safe separated from their firing mechanism and from ammunition. separate safes, locked and inspected every few months by the police.

With all that in place, how does a person defend himself against an already armed intruder in their home? (That's right, the intruder will not have his gun disassembled from their firing mechanism and from ammunition.)

 

[Phil 1:21]

The Las Vegas mass shooter owned his guns legally and even owned only legal extensions and ammunition for them yet he shot and killed 58 people and caused the wounding and/or injury of another 500 people. Even if every last one of those 500 and more people was carrying a holstered gun they would still have been shot and the shooter would still have been safe. The truth is that people only rarely carry a gun ready to "stop the bad guys". That's just a fantasy.

One does not constitute "most." Nor does it constitute a universal truth.