GOD'S WORD vs TRADITIONS OF MEN; Sabbath vs Sunday

[sparow]

So your saying that you are not under the Sabbath law?

Only someone under the law suffers the punishment for the failure to obey the law.

You seem to be stuck in a semantical rut; have you heard of outside the box? Given your rut, there seems to be something you are not aware of; with every threat of punishment God makes, "unless you repent is implied". Any person punished, after long suffering by God, will be a person who has not repented.

John 8:33-36 (NKJV)
33 They answered Him, "We are Abraham's descendants, and have never been in bondage to anyone. How can you say, 'You will be made free'?"
34 Jesus answered them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin.
35 And a slave does not abide in the house forever, but a son abides forever.
36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed.

I am not a slave of the Law, if anything the opposite is true, the law is for my benefit. If the Law was abrogated I would have no benefit. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath that was made for man, I, as a disciple of Christ am in a smaller way, Lord of the Sabbath also.

 

[sparow]

You bet we will.

God made circumcision and that law will never fail.

Regarding circumcision, are you apart from the world or are you a part of the world? The is pretty much what physical circumcision achieves.

 

[D.A. Wright]

A letter of the law cannot fail until all is fulfilled or accomplished. So how do you explain that
circumcision is no longer a valid law?

Now you seem to be arguing with yourself. As stimulating as these zany word games are, I think I need a short break from this nonsense.

 

[klutedavid]

I am not under any law, I am under the King ; the Law of God is a foundation I stand on, as does the King also.

If your not under the law, then you are not required to obey the law.

 

[klutedavid]

Now you seem to be arguing with yourself. As stimulating as these zany word games are, I think I need a short break from this nonsense.

I do not regard any of these posts as nonsense.

Have a rest you need it.

 

[Bro. Dave Gardner]

This verse you quoted just about sums up the debate on the ten commandments.

Yes, if one verse which poses a 'glorious vs. more glorious' comparison can settle a debate on a major scriptural topic, then it most certainly does.

Jesus was not referring to the ten commandments in that verse above because Jesus never mentioned the phrase 'the ten commandments'.

Is that how it works? Because if it is, whole bunches of arguments about the ten commandments being strictly for "old covenant Judaizers" go right up in smoke, since the phrase "the ten commandments" only occurs 3 times in the entire Bible. (I couldn't believe it either.)

that point cannot be debated.

Anything can be debated. Are you new here?

No circumcision means no law!

Just as no law means lawlessness!

 

[sparow]

If your not under the law, then you are not required to obey the law.

If I choose to live in the Kingdom of God I do.

 

[klutedavid]

Yes, if one verse which poses a 'glorious vs. more glorious' comparison can settle a debate on a major scriptural topic, then it most certainly does.

Is that how it works? Because if it is, whole bunches of arguments about the ten commandments being strictly for "old covenant Judaizers" go right up in smoke, since the phrase "the ten commandments" only occurs 3 times in the entire Bible. (I couldn't believe it either.)

Anything can be debated. Are you new here?

Just as no law means lawlessness!

The New Testament does not contain that phrase that you mention so often, 'the ten commandments'. Nor are the ten commandments even mentioned in Acts 15.

1 Thessalonians 4:2
For you know what commandments we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.

Is this the, 'lawlessness', that you are referring to in your post?

Matthew 25:41-46
“Then He will also say to those on His left, ‘Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels; for I was hungry, and you gave Me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me nothing to drink; I was a stranger, and you did not invite Me in; naked, and you did not clothe Me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit Me.’ Then they themselves also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not take care of You?’ Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

So which commandments is the New Testament referring to exactly the Lord's commandments or the ten commandments?

 

[klutedavid]

If I choose to live in the Kingdom of God I do.

You don't obey the law, that is, the prophets, Exodus and Leviticus. You have a minute set of laws that you have been taught are the commandments that you need to obey.

There are two sets of commandments in the scripture; one set is in the law and the other set is the words Jesus spoke.

1 Thessalonians 4:2
For you know what commandments we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.

I follow the Lord's commandments!

 

[Bro. Dave Gardner]

The New Testament does not contain that phrase that you mention so often, 'the ten commandments'. Nor are the ten commandments even mentioned in Acts 15.

Well, according to the logic in your earlier plea:

So why do nearly all church organizations regard the Sabbath as a ceremonial law or even a sign of the old covenant. None of them ever call the Sabbath a moral law, you need to think about that.

Why do nearly all church organizations recognize the ten commandments as the moral law? I didn't invent the phrase. It's an actual thing. As late as 40 years ago, no Christian anywhere would have questioned that. Nor its authoritative status. Except for the Sabbath, of couse. That is, unless they were of a mind that Sunday was the Sabbath.

And I guess I missed the part where we were talking about Acts 15.

Is this the, 'lawlessness', that you are referring to in your post?

That bit was just a facetious flow of logic. Nothing more.

 

[sparow]

You don't obey the law, that is, the prophets, Exodus and Leviticus. You have a minute set of laws that you have been taught are the commandments that you need to obey.

There are two sets of commandments in the scripture; one set is in the law and the other set is the words Jesus spoke.

1 Thessalonians 4:2
For you know what commandments we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus.

I follow the Lord's commandments!

Can you articulate the lords commandments, do you know how many there are.

I acknowledge the law of God and in as far as I can comprehend it, I try to keep it. I cannot convert my understanding of the spiritual Law into words. Moses with God's help did as good as it gets, not only did Moses not only articulate the spiritual Law of God, he delivered it with training wheels.

 

[Bro. Dave Gardner]

 

[sparow]

Is Trump the sixth trumpet? Has the four angels been released and are these the gold head, the silver chest, the bronze middle and the iron legs. Will the Russians join in the Syrian/Turkish War? Where will it end?

 

[D.A. Wright]

Is Trump the sixth trumpet? Has the four angels been released and are these the gold head, the silver chest, the bronze middle and the iron legs. Will the Russians join in the Syrian/Turkish War? Where will it end?

With the stone (Christ) cut out without hands dashing the statue to pieces at the the feet (Modern Rome--The west).

 

[D.A. Wright]

Can you articulate the lords commandments, do you know how many there are.

I acknowledge the law of God and in as far as I can comprehend it, I try to keep it. I cannot convert my understanding of the spiritual Law into words. Moses with God's help did as good as it gets, not only did Moses not only articulate the spiritual Law of God, he delivered it with training wheels.

But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’ ” (Matthew 4:4)

 

[D.A. Wright]

 

[Bro. Dave Gardner]

Well well, you use the fact that the day Jews use as the Sabbath to confirm that is the true day God set up at Sinai and Jesus kept,

Why wouldn't I (if I, in fact, did)? It's true.

but you will not recognize that those same Jews have counted 613 separate commands in the Torah.

But I do recognize that.

Seems to me you are just trying to find something to use against me or to make me out as not having any knowledge concerning the law of Moses.

Seems to me that you are becoming quite a professional victim for someone with such "broad shoulders."

Where is your proof?

Not prepared to do a copy-and-paste fest to give you something to vomit on. It's obvious enough to me.

Then stop putting a 10 before commandments. If the authors wanted a ten there they would have put one there.

When I mean "ten commandments," I'll say "ten commandments," thank you. I was taught to count to ten at a very early age, and I picked it up easily enough. I count ten. So do billions of other people. I try to avoid falling into cognitive dissonance. I hear it's bad for one's mental health.

 

[sparow]

Question for all. If the law (Torah) is what is written on our hearts then why do those who claim they keep the law wear clothes without tassels and do not wear the Yarmulke. Are you allowing the barber to trim your sideburns?

The Torah or written law is an expression of God's law. God's Law is spiritual and as such cannot be written; but when one reads the written Law, one is required to receive a spiritual understanding.

Deuteronomy 32:46 (NKJV)
46 and He said to them: "Set your hearts on all the words which I testify among you today, which you shall command your children to be careful to observe--all the words of this law.

Job 22:22 (NKJV)
22 Receive, please, instruction from His mouth, And lay up His words in your heart.

Psalm 37:31 (NKJV)
31 The law of his God is in his heart; None of his steps shall slide.

Psalm 40:8 (NKJV)
8 I delight to do Your will, O my God, And Your law is within my heart."

Psalm 119:34 (NKJV)
34 Give me understanding, and I shall keep Your law; Indeed, I shall observe it with my whole heart.

Proverbs 3:1 (NKJV)
1 My son, do not forget my law, But let your heart keep my commands;

Isaiah 51:7 (NKJV)
7 "Listen to Me, you who know righteousness, You people in whose heart is My law: Do not fear the reproach of men, Nor be afraid of their insults.

Jeremiah 31:33 (NKJV)
33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.


It seems to me the only difference between the old and the new is the matter of process. The new received water baptism and baptism by the Holy spirit, but I believe the Levite priesthood also received the spirit of God.

 

[Bob S]

The Torah or written law is an expression of God's law. God's Law is spiritual and as such cannot be written; but when one reads the written Law, one is required to receive a spiritual understanding.

My study of scripture indicates that God gave Israel special laws only for Israel. Torah WAS God's law for Israel. I do not have any idea about it being an expression. And where do you get that God's Law is spiritual and as such cannot be written????

It seems to me the only difference between the old and the new is the matter of process.

What is process? Have you studied the two covenants? If you have then your conclusion is sure different than what I have gleaned. God took Moses aside and told him what the covenant He was about to give Israel was to be about.
Ex19:5 Now obey me completely. Keep my covenant. If you do, then out of all the nations you will be my special treasure. The whole earth is mine. 6 But you will be a kingdom of priests to serve me. You will be my holy nation.’ That is what you must tell the Israelites.” It was about how Israel was to live in the desert and in Canaan to become a Holy Nation. The new covenant is all about what we have to do to be ready to inherit Heaven.

The new received water baptism and baptism by the Holy spirit, but I believe the Levite priesthood also received the spirit of God.

What happened at Pentecost? Why did Jesus tell believers He would send the Comforter to be with us? It seems like this was a new phenomenon.

 

[Bro. Dave Gardner]

God's Law is spiritual and as such cannot be written

Rank mysticism