For anyone who doesn't like Secular music...

[Grover143]

Why would I feel concerned if someone was listening to secular music? If they're going down the road blazing music with curse words, words glorifying a "loose" lifestyle, etc. I'm concerned because I've seen firsthand what it leads to.

Preacher, can you really say that you think that anyone who listens to secular music automatically does this. Are you aware of the fact that huge numbers of groups that you call "secular" don't curse or promote what you call a "loose" lifestyle? How can you possibly think that? How can you paint such a broad brush over every group out there that doesn't fit into your "christian" category. Ya know what I call that? I call that bearing false witness. You judge them and speak out against them without even knowing them or their lives.

If you're going to blame music for "leading" someone into anything sinful, you're taking away that person's right to their own choices. If the music they listens to "influences" them in sinning, then it's on them to remove it from their life. Honestly, I don't believe for a second that any but the most dimwitted people would be compelled in this way. I think you need to give people a bit more credit for their own judgement. Leave my speck alone (despite the fact that I don't have one) and work on your own plank!!!

For everyone else who's here to talk about music. Does anyone like singer/songwriters? I'm a huge Patty Griffin fan.

 

[nadroj1985]

. . . sadder than you know.

Well, maybe it won't be that sad then. Hopefully we can all sit back and laugh at how wrong we all were about certain things, even though we were so adamant about them here on earth. Maybe then we'll all realize that our love for God and others was all that really mattered. Or maybe not. Who knows? It should be interesting

 

[Grover143]

Well, maybe it won't be that sad then. Hopefully we can all sit back and laugh at how wrong we all were about certain things, even though we were so adamant about them here on earth. Maybe then we'll all realize that our love for God and others was all that really mattered. Or maybe not. Who knows? It should be interesting

I know it's gonna be wonderful, and humbling, and glorious. May God be praised!!!

Sometimes I get too angry. Sometimes I get too complacent. I pray I'll never get too apathetic.

I'm slipping off topic with this, sorry if it bothers anyone.

 

[renaistre]

Ok, you can take your "cussing" band who people think are Christians and listen to what you won't, not bother with discernment, and just listen to what you want to do and leave God out of the equation. It's a free country, you can do that, but in that Day, don't say I didn't tell you to you stop listening to that Spirit quenching music

Most of my secular albums have not one cuss word in them. And no, they are not all instrumental.

 

[PreacherFergy]

Most of my secular albums have not one cuss word in them. And no, they are not all instrumental.

none > most

 

[peanutbutter12]

none > most

Dude, I am guessing you are either too young of a Xian to get it, or you have been boxed up your whole life cause you have a LOT of maturing to do. There is a delicate balance between the world and Xianity. I suggest you seek not just one, but multiple counsel from different backrounds because if you continue this way and sometime choose to take the robe as your name states you want to be a preacher, you are going to hurt a lot of people with the one sided attitude. The fact that you feel you are right and everyone else is wrong in here is proving that point.

CJ

 

[* kittie *]

i say we just ignore him. i mean...it's like yelling to a wall. but yeah...it will be wrong for him to hurt a congratation like that. hopefully, it won't happen.

 

[PreacherFergy]

Dude, I am guessing you are either too young of a Xian to get it, or you have been boxed up your whole life cause you have a LOT of maturing to do. There is a delicate balance between the world and Xianity. I suggest you seek not just one, but multiple counsel from different backrounds because if you continue this way and sometime choose to take the robe as your name states you want to be a preacher, you are going to hurt a lot of people with the one sided attitude. The fact that you feel you are right and everyone else is wrong in here is proving that point.

CJ

Not once have I said that I know everything. Your ad hominem attacks show that you can't discuss the issue, but rather you have to revert to personal attacks to attempt to debate this topic.

There are several things in the scriptures that I'm not 100% sure of, from the events of the Second Coming of Christ (I know He is coming, but I'm not 100% of the timing events) to what role God plays in salvation, that is, where His sovereign will and the will of man "collide," or at what point they meet you could say. There are a lot of stuff I haven't learned yet, and a lot of things I've come to understand I've been wrong about, but this is one thing that God has stirred my soul about and settled, this issue is as grounded as Mt. Everest.

I'm open to discussion of eschatology or sotierology, etc. however this is one issue I'm not stepping back on. This issue is clearly defined in scripture, from Romans 6 and 12 which are excellent chapters about sanctification, to Psalms which clearly defines the use of music, that is, glorifying the Lord.

Teleivision, sports, etc. were never created to directly glorify the Lord, of course, how you play a game or what you watch on TV could indirectly bring honor to God, but music is a specific part of worshipping the Lord.

As for me "wanting to be a preacher," God called me to preach, so that's what I do, preach (when God opens the door to do so a different times). "Preaching" or being a preacher isn't something you "grow" into, it's something that God puts a divine call on your life that you cannot get away from. If I had my way, I'd be majoring in architectual engineering or mechanical engineering, as I love building things and working on cars, however, God has called me elsewhere.

I've been wrong before, and I'll be wrong again if the Lord tarries, but some things are unshakeable, they're not debateable, and this issue falls under that category.

 

[nadroj1985]

I've been wrong before, and I'll be wrong again if the Lord tarries, but some things are unshakeable, they're not debateable, and this issue falls under that category.

Gray is such a beautiful color..................

 

[PreacherFergy]

Gray is such a beautiful color..................

This isn't a "gray" issue,

besides, with God, there's only wrong and right, not "almost" wrong or "almost" right.

 

[Joel_goober_head]

um so exactly would the old hymns derived from drinking songs lay in all of this?

"sanctified" secular music?

 

[nadroj1985]

This isn't a "gray" issue

Says you. If two people are honestly searching for the truth, and come up with different answers, the issue is not clear. We obviously have that scenario here, so this issue is not as simple as you would make it out to be.

besides, with God, there's only wrong and right, not "almost" wrong or "almost" right.

Agreed. But we are not God. At least I'm pretty sure I'm not. If I find out I am, I'll be sure to let you know

 

[Grover143]

ad hominem [/i]attacks show that you can't discuss the issue, but rather you have to revert to personal attacks to attempt to debate this topic.

Isn't THAT the pot calling the kettle....

I'm gonna pick the rest of your last post apart when I have more time, I just can't believe the hipocrisy in that line. I mean really? I think you're just baiting everyone now.

LOL

 

[* kittie *]

ooo...howie day. not bad. well...at least not this song.

anyways, i love grey skies. they're so beautiful.

 

[PreacherFergy]

Says you. If two people are honestly searching for the truth, and come up with different answers, the issue is not clear. We obviously have that scenario here, so this issue is not as simple as you would make it out to be.

"There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;"
Eph. 4:4

Two Spirit-led people will arrive at the same conclusion.

Regarding judging, John 7:24 and 1 Cor. 14-15 both teach about judging, how it is good according to the Bible. It's quite alarming to see so many people yanking Matthew 7:1 out of its conext and building an entire belief system out of it

 

[PreacherFergy]

Isn't THAT the pot calling the kettle....

I'm gonna pick the rest of your last post apart when I have more time, I just can't believe the hipocrisy in that line. I mean really? I think you're just baiting everyone now.

LOL

Who character was I attacking? Sure, I was pointing out the errors in many of the secular artists lives (U2 and Bono for example) b/c my point was that Christians shouldn't listen to those who aren't trying to glorify the Lord.

Anyway, I have to get up at 4am for work, so I'm heading to bed

 

[nadroj1985]

"There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;"
Eph. 4:4

Two Spirit-led people will arrive at the same conclusion.

You are not understanding me. I am not arguing that there is no right answer. The question is this: How do we know which one of us is Spirit-led?

Regarding judging, John 7:24 and 1 Cor. 14-15 both teach about judging, how it is good according to the Bible. It's quite alarming to see so many people yanking Matthew 7:1 out of its conext and building an entire belief system out of it

Matthew 7:1 is abused by many, certainly. It is also ignored by some.

 

[Jedi Penguins]

Who character was I attacking? Sure, I was pointing out the errors in many of the secular artists lives (U2 and Bono for example) b/c my point was that Christians shouldn't listen to those who aren't trying to glorify the Lord.

Anyway, I have to get up at 4am for work, so I'm heading to bed

Who are you to say who is trying to glorify God and who is not. The day you can see somebodies heart and know what they are truely thinking is they day when you earn the right to decided this.

You seem to still be overlooking Romans 14, and I have posted it before so I'm not going to post it again.

 

[PreacherFergy]

Who are you to say who is trying to glorify God and who is not. The day you can see somebodies heart and know what they are truely thinking is they day when you earn the right to decided this.

You seem to still be overlooking Romans 14, and I have posted it before so I'm not going to post it again.

What about Romans 14? "We then that are strong ought to bear the infirmities of the weak, and not to please ourselves" (maybe not be verbatim, jus quoting it from memory). What's your point?

Perhaps you should do a study on scriptural judging. I guess Peter was wrong when he referred to the Jews as a wicked generation, Stephen as well.

 

[Grover143]

This issue is clearly defined in scripture, from Romans 6 and 12 which are excellent chapters about sanctification,

Yes, they are excellent chapters about sanctification. They say nothing about art or literature. They're specifically talking about values. Your argument would only hold validity if people didn't have the ability to discern/separate the right from the wrong. I can definately separate a lyric that doesn't conform to the principals laid out in scripture and one that does, or is completely unrelated. I have a mind you see. I am able to think. I don't need to cloister myself in a place where, what you call, "secular" music doesn't enter my ears.

to Psalms which clearly defines the use of music, that is, glorifying the Lord..

This is such a stretch. The psalms are songs and poems. That's true. That doesn't mean that it's wrong to write a song about anything other than for the purpose of "glorifying" God. Frankly, the fact that a creation of God used the creativity that God gave him to craft a song is in itself glorifying to God. In fact, some could argue that despite the fact that the song may openly curse God, God is still glorified in it's creation simply because it was created. That doesn't mean I'm interested in listening to it, but that's not the issue.

Teleivision, sports, etc. were never created to directly glorify the Lord, of course, how you play a game or what you watch on TV could indirectly bring honor to God,

What on earth makes you think that you have the knowledge to know what "directly" or "indirectly" brings glory to God in the first palce? It seems to me that glory is glory, period.

I've been wrong before, and I'll be wrong again if the Lord tarries, but some things are unshakeable, they're not debateable, and this issue falls under that category.

Ok, if this is such a undebateable issue, then why is there so much argument? I can tell you that my pastor would directly disagree with you and so would thousands and thousands of men and women of God around the world. So if it's so unshakeable, why is there so much disagreement? This IS a disputable matter. I suggest you go back and read my posts in the other forum adn let's talk about the notion of "secular" anything. That's really the base that this whole house of cards totters on. It's a flawed foundation.