Everyone got this Parable wrong!

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Yup, it wouldn't be the first time I accepted being wrong on a subject and changed my belief accordingly!

As years go by, we gain more knowledge and must be open to correction if our former beliefs no longer stand against scrutiny.

Sure, we all grow in knowledge and wisdom and change our minds accordingly.

I used to believe the more popular interpretations of the Parable of Talents until studying Matthew 13 lately, I then realized, it stood to much greater scrutiny than the other interpretations.

But what I don't get is why you are interpreting a parable in the light of one that was given, maybe, months before?
True, we don't know when Jesus gave his various teachings, but 3 of the Gospels place the parable of the sower near the beginning of his ministry - whereas the parable of the talents, it seems, came towards the end. So, apart from the repetition of one verse, what was it that made you think "ah, I need to go back 12 chapters in order to understand this?" What was it that made you think, "the parable of the talents is clearly not about talents"?

The other things have no purpose and are meaningless outside of the knowledge of Truth... Why is this so important? Because we live in world ruled by the devil, the father of lies. Apart from the Truth, the ways we live are of the devil. The "western" idea of "love" is rapidly depleting our resources. A lot of Chrisitians love money but because they have no idea what the Bible is saying about it.

I don't get what that has to do with the parable of the talents. The 3rd servant was condemned because he hid the talents; did nothing with them, instead of working and making even more for his master. It wasn't the amount of money that was wrong; it was his attitude. He also accused his master of being a hard man.
 
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I don't get what that has to do with the parable of the talents. The 3rd servant was condemned because he hid the talents; did nothing with them, instead of working and making even more for his master. It wasn't the amount of money that was wrong; it was his attitude. He also accused his master of being a hard man.


I was thinking along these lines as well. The man pretty much told on himself before he even gave his master a chance to speak--and he didn't come with faith, but with doubt and condemnation.


He should've been more like this woman:

"26But Jesus replied, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs.” 27“Yes, Lord,”she said, “even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their master’s table.” 28“O woman,” Jesus answered, “your faith is great! Let it be done for you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed from that very hour."
 
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timewerx

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He also accused his master of being a hard man.

A very good point to bring up:oldthumbsup:

Don't many Christians also reason God being a hard master who will throw them to hell to suffer for eternity if they believe the wrong things?;)

That is primarily the reason why many Christians are too afraid to even try to look for major flaws in their beliefs nor seek the Truth, no matter where it leads them.

They practically "bury" the little knowledge that was given out of senseless fear of God of being thrown to hell.

You bury things you don't want to check and don't want to increase.....And that's how many Christians treat their beliefs.

Seeking the Truth will always take priority even over our own souls. Seek to preserve your life and you lose it. Lose it for the sake of the Lord (I am the Way, the TRUTH, and the life) and you shall have it for eternity.

Only few will ever find this Truth according to the Bible. You'll have to risk everything, you have to unbury it and face it. A task most Christians are unwilling to undertake, blinded by the things of this world and senseless fear of losing their soul.
 
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timewerx

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"26But Jesus replied, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs.” 27“Yes, Lord,”she said, “even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their master’s table.” 28“O woman,” Jesus answered, “your faith is great! Let it be done for you as you desire.” And her daughter was healed from that very hour."

Jesus gave her a partial truth. I think Jesus is testing her.

The woman is not afraid to reason with the Lord that even rules are not always absolute!:oldthumbsup:

Even Mary sat at the feet of Jesus, not minding how many rules she might have broken (lol!) just so she can listen closely to Him preach the Truth.

That's fearless, child-like faith, and that's what the Lord wants!
 
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Strong in Him

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A very good point to bring up:oldthumbsup:

Don't many Christians also reason God being a hard master who will throw them to hell to suffer for eternity if they believe the wrong things?;)

That is primarily the reason why many Christians are too afraid to even try to look for major flaws in their beliefs nor seek the Truth, no matter where it leads them.

They practically "bury" the little knowledge that was given out of senseless fear of God of being thrown to hell.

You bury things you don't want to check and don't want to increase.....And that's how many Christians treat their beliefs.

Seeking the Truth will always take priority even over our own souls. Seek to preserve your life and you lose it. Lose it for the sake of the Lord (I am the Way, the TRUTH, and the life) and you shall have it for eternity.

So in the parable of the talents, you're saying that talents = truth? :scratch:
Sorry, but that makes even less sense.
That would mean the master gave one of his servants 5 x the truth, or 5 truths, another 2 x the truth, or 2 truths and the last one only one truth, or one part of it. While he was away, the first servant used his 5 portions of the truth to make 5 more, the second used his 2 portions to make 2 more portions of the truth and the last one buried it and was criticised for not putting it in the bank where it would have made interest??
How does that work?
 
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sdowney717

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So in the parable of the talents, you're saying that talents = truth? :scratch:
Sorry, but that makes even less sense.
That would mean the master gave one of his servants 5 x the truth, or 5 truths, another 2 x the truth, or 2 truths and the last one only one truth, or one part of it. While he was away, the first servant used his 5 portions of the truth to make 5 more, the second used his 2 portions to make 2 more portions of the truth and the last one buried it and was criticised for not putting it in the bank where it would have made interest??
How does that work?
It can make sense because not all have the same measure of faith given to them by God.
Not everyone has the same amount of knowing truth come from God by way of the Holy Spirit, obviously some know more and some less, these forums are ample evidence of this. But all believers whom the Lord saves, have a saving faith from Him.

example
Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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In other words, The Parable of The Talents has nothing to do with talents. I think you nailed it.
It is also used concerning the great hail that fell upon 70ad Jerusalem........interesting description given by the Jewish Historian Josephus........

Revelation 16:21 "..great HAIL fell on men as a talent weight.." Josephus

Luke 21:23 Woe yet to those pregnant, and to those giving suck in those the days
for there shall be great distress on the land and wrath on this people;
==============
Revelation 16:21
And Hail<5464> great as talent-weight/talantiaia <5006> is descending out of the heaven/sky upon the Men.
And the men blaspheme the God out of the blow of the Hail, that great is the blow of it, tremendous. [# 5464 used in Ezekiel 38:22]

History of the Destruction of Jerusalem & Josephan Studies Archives

"During the Middle Ages, Josephus was the most widely read ancient author in Europe.. Josephus' literary influence had no equals, with the sole exception of the Bible."

John's Revelation - “And great hail from heaven fell upon men, each hailstone about the weight of a talent.” (16:21)

Josephus - “Now the stones that were cast were of the weight of a talent, and were carried two furlongs and further. The blow they gave was no way to be sustained, not only by those that stood first in the way, but by those that were beyond them for a great space.
As for the Jews, they at first watched the coming of the stone, for it was of a white color, and could therefore not only be perceived by the great noise it made, but could be seen also before it came by its brightness;” (5:6:3)

and also the account of Josephus, who speaks of stones a talent in weight being thrown by machines at the siege of Jerusalem (see Wetstein, ad loc.). "The men," though not pointing to any particular group of men who have been definitely mentioned, nevertheless necessarily refers to the wicked, were are the object of this punishment. "Hail" is frequently mentioned as a judgment of God and is added here to heighten the general effect of the description................

roman catapults jerusalem 70 ad - Google Search:

Roman-Engines-of-War.jpg


An archaeological dig has revealed Roman ammunition that is thought have been used to help break through a protective city wall prior to the destruction of the Second Temple.

1018316866.jpg


The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

History records few events more generally interesting than the destruction of Jerusalem, and the subversion of the Jewish state, by the arms of the Romans. -- Their intimate connexion with the dissolution of the Levitical economy, and the establishment of Christianity in the world ; the striking verification which they afford of so many of the prophecies, both of the Old and New Testament, and the powerful arguments of the divine authority of the Scriptures which are thence derived
=============================
Luke 19:
37 As he was now getting near, at the descent of the Mount of Olives, the whole multitude of the disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works which they had seen,
38 saying, "Blessed is the King who comes in the name of the Lord! Peace in heaven, and glory in the highest!"
39 Some of the Pharisees from the multitude said to him, "Teacher, rebuke your disciples!"
40 and answering He said to them,
“I am saying to ye that ifever these shall be being silent, the stones shall be crying out<2986>

41 And as He nears, beholding the City, and He laments on Her,
42 saying, "That if Thou knew and Thou, even indeed in this day, the toward peace of Thee, now yet it was hid from Thy eyes.
43 That shall be arriving days upon Thee, and Thy enemies shall be casting up a rampart/siege-work to Thee and shall be encompassing Thee, and pressing Thee from-every-side.
44 And shall be leveling Thee and Thy offspring in Thee,
and not shall be leaving stone upon stone in Thee,
stead which not Thou knew the season of the visitation<1984> of Thee".

.......................................
 
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timewerx

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It can make sense because not all have the same measure of faith given to them by God.
Not everyone has the same amount of knowing truth come from God by way of the Holy Spirit, obviously some know more and some less, these forums are ample evidence of this. But all believers whom the Lord saves, have a saving faith from Him.

example
Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith.
I agree

We were supposed to make it grow by seeking more of the Truth but many are too afraid they'll make a mistake and be condemned to hell.

We really must care for seeking more knowledge on what is true and what is false, more than saving our very souls.

Our obsession with saving our souls is ironically blocking us from seeking more of the truth.

We must love the Lord (and hence, the Truth) more than trying to save our souls. That's reality.
 
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timewerx

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So in the parable of the talents, you're saying that talents = truth? :scratch:
Sorry, but that makes even less sense.
That would mean the master gave one of his servants 5 x the truth, or 5 truths, another 2 x the truth, or 2 truths and the last one only one truth, or one part of it. While he was away, the first servant used his 5 portions of the truth to make 5 more, the second used his 2 portions to make 2 more portions of the truth and the last one buried it and was criticised for not putting it in the bank where it would have made interest??
How does that work?

I think putting it in the bank is like putting it (like your money) to work through the banking system in order to gain more (gain interest).

In the context of the Truth, this can be done through cross-checking / comparing it against other sources of information, "Banks of Information", like the library, internet, including secular or scientific sources. You can grow it through scrutiny and discovery.

I actually do it as a matter of fact and my research isn't just constrained on Biblical sources.
 
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Strong in Him

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It can make sense because not all have the same measure of faith given to them by God.
Not everyone has the same amount of knowing truth come from God by way of the Holy Spirit, obviously some know more and some less, these forums are ample evidence of this. But all believers whom the Lord saves, have a saving faith from Him.

But that's not what the parable says.
The master gave one of his servants 5 talents - which was money, another one had 2 talents and the third had one. After a while, we are told, the master returned to settle accounts with his servants. The one who had 5 talents had made 5 more, the one who had been given 2 had made 2 more and the one who had buried the 1 talent that he had been given was criticised for not at least putting it in the bank to gain interest.
How does that equate to truth?
Some people will be given 5 x the truth and have the ability to increase that to 10 x??
Some people will be given the truth - or maybe 1 part of it - do nothing to increase the truth they have and will then be criticised because the truth they had made no interest??

When the parable says that the servants were given talents - which would have been recognised in those days as money - I see no reason to read into the text that it actually means that some had the truth and others didn't.
 
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I think putting it in the bank is like putting it (like your money) to work through the banking system in order to gain more (gain interest).

In the context of the Truth, this can be done through cross-checking / comparing it against other sources of information, "Banks of Information", like the library, internet, including secular or scientific sources. You can grow it through scrutiny and discovery.

I actually do it as a matter of fact and my research isn't just constrained on Biblical sources.

I understand wanting to receive more truth, studying, checking references etc; I don't understand how you can read that a parable which is about talents - money - is actually about something else entirely. Reading into a text will not result in the truth; the very thing that you say this parable is about.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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I agree
We were supposed to make it grow by seeking more of the Truth but many are too afraid they'll make a mistake and be condemned to hell.
We really must care for seeking more knowledge on what is true and what is false, more than saving our very souls.
Our obsession with saving our souls is ironically blocking us from seeking more of the truth.
We must love the Lord (and hence, the Truth) more than trying to save our souls. That's reality.
I understand wanting to receive more truth, studying, checking references etc; I don't understand how you can read that a parable which is about talents - money - is actually about something else entirely. Reading into a text will not result in the truth; the very thing that you say this parable is about.
First it is a parable, so it has to be interpreted.
For rich men it is hard to enter the Kingdom, so honestly how can it be referring to money, the more money you earn the better your standing with God??? Those who built bigger barns, (who had more and more money) God calls fools.
Hello. Seeking out Truth and Knowledge is good, especially when it comes to the parables of our Lord Jesus.

Have you and/or others seen this other thread on the parable of the Rich Man and Lazarus concerning "hell/hades/gehenna"?

Luke 16 "Rich Man/Poor Man" parable.....The most misunderstood/misinterpreted Parable in the NT?

This "Covenantle" parable is probably my largest study of the Bible and would like to go thru it.
This translation of verses 19-31 is by using the T-R, a Greek interlinear, and Lexicon/Concordance.

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

The parable of Lazarus and the rich man has been the foundation for many of the erroneous beliefs about "hell" within traditional Christianity. Some have viewed it not as a parable, but as a true story Yeshua told to give details about the punishment of sinners in hell.
Yet a thorough, unbiased examination of this story will show that the generally accepted interpretations of this passage of Scripture are erroneous and misleading. In this article, we will go through the parable verse by verse to determine what the Messiah was truly teaching..............................

CONCLUSION
The parable of Lazarus and the rich man
, long used by mainstream Christian ministers to teach the "reality of hell," really has nothing to say about punishment or reward in the afterlife.
Yeshua used this story, which fit the common misconception about life after death in his day, to show the fate that awaited the Jewish nation because of the unbelief and faithlessness which caused them to reject him as the Messiah.
=============================
http://www.kingdombiblestudies.org/tablecontents.htm

Usually, when the story of the rich man and Lazarus is considered, its setting is ignored. At the time the story was told Jesus had just eaten dinner with a Pharisee, at which time He not only healed a man with dropsy, but gave some pointed advice about how to give a dinner party. When He left the house, great throngs followed Him.
Many of this great company were publicans and sinners who drew near to hear His teaching, and mingled with them were a great number of the scribes and Pharisees. The scribes and Pharisees complained openly and bitterly against Jesus, condemning Him because He received sinners into His company and ate with them.

Against this background of biting criticism Jesus stood and gave the teachings found in chapters fifteen and sixteen of Luke. There are five stories which follow consecutively. It is well known, of course, that chapters and verses were not in the original scriptures. We are at liberty to change them when they do not synchronize with other scripture. Any arrangement of chapter and verse division that clarifies or harmonizes other scripture, is more authoritative than that division that beclouds other statements of the Bible.

At the beginning of Jesus’ discourse in chapter fifteen of Luke the statement is made that “He spoke this parable unto them, saying,” (Lk. 15:3). The Greek is very definite in making the word for parable clearly a singular noun. It is “the parable this..”
This statement is followed by five separate stories, the first of which is the story of the lost sheep, and the last is the story of the rich man and Lazarus. You see, the teaching in chapter sixteen is but the continuation of the discourse in chapter fifteen, without interruption.

Now, which of the five stories He gave them in this sermon was called a parable? The only one of the five which is prefaced by the claim, “And He spoke this parable unto them,” was the story about the lost sheep. Was the lost sheep the only one that could be called a parable?
And yet, any preacher or believer that I know will answer that the story of the lost coin, as well as the prodigal son, were also parables. Then why was the singular used - “this parable”?

It should be clear to any thinking mind that all these stories were ONE PARABLE, like the facets of a diamond, as they turn each scintillates with new brilliance. Each was illustrating a view point of one great truth, and together they compose a whole.

And this parabolic discourse of Jesus is continued into chapter sixteen of Luke, including the story of the rich man and Lazarus. The truth is that all five stories are each a fractional part of the complete parable, and when we read, “He spoke this parable unto them,” symbol-pictures which in their completeness constituted the parable which He spoke.

It is a careless assumption and an unfounded assertion to argue that the story of the rich man and Lazarus is not a parable!
..............................
 
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sdowney717

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But that's not what the parable says.
The master gave one of his servants 5 talents - which was money, another one had 2 talents and the third had one. After a while, we are told, the master returned to settle accounts with his servants. The one who had 5 talents had made 5 more, the one who had been given 2 had made 2 more and the one who had buried the 1 talent that he had been given was criticised for not at least putting it in the bank to gain interest.
How does that equate to truth?
Some people will be given 5 x the truth and have the ability to increase that to 10 x??
Some people will be given the truth - or maybe 1 part of it - do nothing to increase the truth they have and will then be criticised because the truth they had made no interest??

When the parable says that the servants were given talents - which would have been recognized in those days as money - I see no reason to read into the text that it actually means that some had the truth and others didn't.
First it is a parable, so it has to be interpreted.
We bear fruit in the kingdom of God, some 30, 60, some 100 fold.
Only those who bear good fruit to God will be saved.
Knowing the truth, well it has to do with the amount of your faith that you have been given, of those given more, they are expected to bear more fruit, and so they do, as planed by God.

For rich men it is hard to enter the Kingdom, so honestly how can it be referring to money, the more money you earn the better your standing with God??? Those who built bigger barns, (who had more and more money) God calls fools.
 
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Strong in Him

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First it is a parable, so it has to be interpreted.
We bear fruit in the kingdom of God, some 30, 60, some 100 fold.
Only those who bear good fruit to God will be saved.
Knowing the truth, well it has to do with the amount of your faith that you have been given, of those given more, they are expected to bear more fruit, and so they do, as planed by God.

Sorry, I was talking about the parable of the talents, not the parable of the sower.

For rich men it is hard to enter the Kingdom, so honestly how can it be referring to money, the more money you earn the better your standing with God???

In those days a talent was money - there is a note at the bottom of my Bible to say that a talent was worth several hundred pounds. And the master asked his servant why he had not put his money on deposit where it would have earned interest, Matthew 25:27.
These days we tend to think of a talent as a skill or ability.
But in both cases, the moral is the same - if you are given something you can either use it wisely, make something of it, use it for good, or you can bury it, from fear or laziness.
 
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helmut

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I don't understand how you can read that a parable which is about talents - money - is actually about something else entirely.
A parable is a text in which the literal meaning is not the same as the meaning of the message of that text - if both ware the same, it would be no parable.

So it is legitimate to read talents=money in a parable as a message about something quite different, e.g. talents=abilities.

Whether reading talent=truth in this parable makes sense, is quite another matter.
 
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helmut

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In those days a talent was money - there is a note at the bottom of my Bible to say that a talent was worth several hundred pounds.
Calculationg the worth of antique money is difficult - do you base on what people got for labor, or what people sold for goods? And which sort of labor or goods is best fit for being a base?

A talent consisted of 60 minas, and a mina of 50 sheqel, so a talent was 6000 sheqels. The sheqel (or its divisions) was the usual coin in Judaea, often equated with the denar, the usual coin in Hellenistic-Roman society. One denar was the wage for a day's labor of an unskilled worker (that may be compared to today's wages in poor countries), and it were 30 denars that Judas got for delivering Jesus into the hands of His enemies.

This gives a feeling how much a talent was.
 
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helmut

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It is also used concerning the great hail that fell upon 70ad Jerusalem........interesting description given by the Jewish Historian Josephus........
A non-biblical writer using talent in the old sense as "weight" (almost 60 Kg, according to Wikipedia) as a simile to describe the "amount" of what (is hail a typing error for "hell", or what did Josephus mean?) is the basis of your comment, mainly on Lk 19, where there is a parable on minas, not talents (though related to the parable discussed here).

That's rather off-topic, as well as the other stuff in your post.
 
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A parable is a text in which the literal meaning is not the same as the meaning of the message of that text - if both ware the same, it would be no parable.

So it is legitimate to read talents=money in a parable as a message about something quite different, e.g. talents=abilities.

Yes, I agree.

Whether reading talent=truth in this parable makes sense, is quite another matter.

That was my point - thank you.
 
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Calculationg the worth of antique money is difficult - do you base on what people got for labor, or what people sold for goods? And which sort of labor or goods is best fit for being a base?

A talent consisted of 60 minas, and a mina of 50 sheqel, so a talent was 6000 sheqels. The sheqel (or its divisions) was the usual coin in Judaea, often equated with the denar, the usual coin in Hellenistic-Roman society. One denar was the wage for a day's labor of an unskilled worker (that may be compared to today's wages in poor countries), and it were 30 denars that Judas got for delivering Jesus into the hands of His enemies.

This gives a feeling how much a talent was.

Thank you; that's helpful.
 
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timewerx

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A parable is a text in which the literal meaning is not the same as the meaning of the message of that text - if both ware the same, it would be no parable.

So it is legitimate to read talents=money in a parable as a message about something quite different, e.g. talents=abilities.

Whether reading talent=truth in this parable makes sense, is quite another matter.

Abilities is an acceptable interpretation, although it falls short in some cases.

Money is probably not a good one as the entity is seen mostly negatively in New Testament scriptures. Accumulation of money is more a bad thing than a good one.
 
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