LDS Ephesians 2:1-10

[He is the way]

I know your opinion of that God given ministry.

As I have pointed out before their research was faulty and unreliable.

 

[Rescued One]

A divine commandment differs from the other commandments and is not needed to enter the two lower degrees of the celestial heavens where God resides. Since you have no desire to be in the highest degree of the celestial kingdom, a divine commandment is not necessary for you.

1. There is no tri-level celestial kingdom. I am following the true Savior and my home will be with the ONE true God.

2. You are right, I have no desire to be in a fictitious kingdom with fictitious gods.

3.Our twelfth article of faith states our belief in being subject to civil authority and “in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.” But man’s laws cannot make moral what God has declared immoral. Commitment to our highest priority—to love and serve God—requires that we look to His law for our standard of behavior. For example, we remain under divine command not to commit adultery or fornication even when those acts are no longer crimes under the laws of the states or countries where we reside. Similarly, laws legalizing so-called “same-sex marriage” do not change God’s law of marriage or His commandments and our standards concerning it.
No Other Gods - Elder Dallin H. Oaks


Which LDS commandments are not divine?

• Benjamin’s people willing to be obedient in all things the Lord shall command, Mosiah 5:5.
• keep my commandments, D&C 5:22 (6:6, 9, 37; 8:5; 11:6, 9, 18,20; 12:6; 14:6 -7; 18:43; 19:13; 25:15; 30:8; 35:24; 43:35; 71:11; 136:42).
• violators of commandments to suffer, D&C 10:56 (18:46; 56:2; 58:30; 95:12; 103:8).
• keepers of commandments to be blessed, D&C 11:20 (14:7; 15:5; 17:8; 58:2; 59:1, 4; 63:23; 76:52; 89:18; 93:20, 28; 95:11; 124:87).
• they who keep not commandments cannot be saved, D&C 18:46 (25:15; 56:2).

D&C 18
43 And now, after that you have received this, you must keep my commandments in all things;

46 And after that you have received this, if you keep not my commandments you cannot be saved in the kingdom of my Father.
47 Behold, I, Jesus Christ, your Lord and your God, and your Redeemer, by the power of my Spirit have spoken it. Amen.

D&C 25
15 Keep my commandments continually, and a crown of righteousness thou shalt receive. And except thou do this, where I am you cannot come.

D&C 56
2 And he that will not take up his cross and follow me, and keep my commandments, the same shall not be saved.
3 Behold, I, the Lord, command; and he that will not obey shall be cut off in mine own due time, after I have commanded and the commandment is broken.

The Father does not reside in the lower levels of the celestial kingdom. Those people didn't keep the commandments required to have exaltation/eternal life. They are less worthy than the Mormon Heavenly Father.

 

[Rescued One]

As I have pointed out before their research was faulty and unreliable.

I won't take your word for it.

 

[Ironhold]

I won't take your word for it.

Then will you at least recognize how close they came to being shut down for intellectual property rights violations?

 

[He is the way]

1. There is no tri-level celestial kingdom. I am following the true Savior and my home will be with the ONE true God.

2. You are right, I have no desire to be in a fictitious kingdom with fictitious gods.

3.Our twelfth article of faith states our belief in being subject to civil authority and “in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.” But man’s laws cannot make moral what God has declared immoral. Commitment to our highest priority—to love and serve God—requires that we look to His law for our standard of behavior. For example, we remain under divine command not to commit adultery or fornication even when those acts are no longer crimes under the laws of the states or countries where we reside. Similarly, laws legalizing so-called “same-sex marriage” do not change God’s law of marriage or His commandments and our standards concerning it.
No Other Gods - Elder Dallin H. Oaks


Which LDS commandments are not divine?

• Benjamin’s people willing to be obedient in all things the Lord shall command, Mosiah 5:5.
• keep my commandments, D&C 5:22 (6:6, 9, 37; 8:5; 11:6, 9, 18,20; 12:6; 14:6 -7; 18:43; 19:13; 25:15; 30:8; 35:24; 43:35; 71:11; 136:42).
• violators of commandments to suffer, D&C 10:56 (18:46; 56:2; 58:30; 95:12; 103:8).
• keepers of commandments to be blessed, D&C 11:20 (14:7; 15:5; 17:8; 58:2; 59:1, 4; 63:23; 76:52; 89:18; 93:20, 28; 95:11; 124:87).
• they who keep not commandments cannot be saved, D&C 18:46 (25:15; 56:2).

D&C 18
43 And now, after that you have received this, you must keep my commandments in all things;

46 And after that you have received this, if you keep not my commandments you cannot be saved in the kingdom of my Father.
47 Behold, I, Jesus Christ, your Lord and your God, and your Redeemer, by the power of my Spirit have spoken it. Amen.

D&C 25
15 Keep my commandments continually, and a crown of righteousness thou shalt receive. And except thou do this, where I am you cannot come.

D&C 56
2 And he that will not take up his cross and follow me, and keep my commandments, the same shall not be saved.
3 Behold, I, the Lord, command; and he that will not obey shall be cut off in mine own due time, after I have commanded and the commandment is broken.

The Father does not reside in the lower levels of the celestial kingdom. Those people didn't keep the commandments required to have exaltation/eternal life. They are less worthy than the Mormon Heavenly Father.

You said: "The Father does not reside in the lower levels of the celestial kingdom." However, I believe the Father and the Son resides in all three degrees of the celestial kingdom. In order to get into the highest degree of the celestial kingdom it is necessary to obey all of the commandments, but that is not the case with the lower two degrees of the celestial kingdom. Therefore temple marriage is NOT a requirement to enter the lower degrees of the celestial kingdom. That is why temple marriage is a divine commandment and only necessary to get to the highest degree of the celestial kingdom.

 

[BigDaddy4]

Then will you at least recognize how close they came to being shut down for intellectual property rights violations?

And that matters how in regards to their accuracy of information?

 

[He is the way]

I won't take your word for it.

I didn't think you would, but when someone goes to the wrong city to do their research it is faulty research. Why go to Palmyra to do research of the religious revival when the Smith family actually lived in Manchester at the time? Why use he said she said third party hearsay documentation? They overlooked the real facts because they were determined to find fault.

 

[Ironhold]

And that matters how in regards to their accuracy of information?

Phoebe called them a "God-given" group, yet they've been torn to shreds by even their own fellows for doctoring citations and their flagrant violation of the law could have gotten them forcibly shut down.

We're trying to get to realize that maybe, just maybe, she's esteeming them too highly.

 

[BigDaddy4]

Phoebe called them a "God-given" group, yet they've been torn to shreds by even their own fellows for doctoring citations and their flagrant violation of the law could have gotten them forcibly shut down.

We're trying to get to realize that maybe, just maybe, she's esteeming them too highly.

Wow, so they are human. Big whoop! You still haven't answered the question of the accuracy of the content of their information. Anything to distract from the truth, right?

 

[Peter1000]

That's something for you to consider as a believer, not something you get to decide for someone else. Works cannot save you, nor are they a condition for salvation, anything else is a works righteousness. Apart from works is unambiguous, to add works to the merits of salvation is an affront to grace.

But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus (Eph. 2:4-6)
​

There is nothing indicating saved by works, it's exactly the opposite. What is even more important is what you consider works, describe these works required for your salvation for me. Does it start with water baptism?

So are you saying that if you are saved unto the good works that Jesus has before appointed you to do, and you do not do these works, then that's OK, Jesus will just wink/nod and let you into his kingdom any way?

Good works start with believing in Jesus, believing in Jesus is fundamental, and foundational. Without that belief you certainly are not going to be saved.
Then that belief in Jesus grows into a faith in Jesus. The difference between belief, and faith is action. When our belief evolves into faith, we are ready to go and do as Jesus taught us.
Then as Peter has told us in Acts 2:38, we do the good works of repenting. We must be in a position to be ready for baptism, and that position is a humble and sincere heart that we are ready to change and be a new person.
We then continue as Peter has told us in Acts 2:38 to be baptized for the remission of sins. Baptism is a symbol of laying our sinful man into a grave and then coming up out of that grave a new person, clean and pure and ready to receive the Holy Spirit as a constant companion for our life.
Finally, as Peter has told us in Acts 2:38, we receive the Holy Spirit by the laying on of hands. Now gifted with the Holy Spirit our new person is ready to do those good works that Jesus has before appointed us to do.
As we sin, not being perfect, we repent and stay on the path as best we can and we try to endure to the end and overcome this world.
We also know that all the good works we do will not earn our salvation. Jesus must step forward with his grace and give us the final stamp of approval of justification and sanctification and we are allowed into his kingdom and have eternal life with him.
This is the true path to salvation. We start the race and finish the race and are rewarded with the gift of eternal life.
We cannot start the race and figure that we have also finished the race at exactly the same time, then sit around trusting that Jesus will get us eternal life.

 

[Ironhold]

Wow, so they are human. Big whoop! You still haven't answered the question of the accuracy of the content of their information. Anything to distract from the truth, right?

Only human?

This is enough to have them ejected from academia the world over!

Only in the realm of the Christian counter-cult and other such "fringe" groups would people like this still have any credibility.

 

[BigDaddy4]

Only human?

This is enough to have them ejected from academia the world over!

Only in the realm of the Christian counter-cult and other such "fringe" groups would people like this still have any credibility.

LOL. You still can't answer the question, can you? Typical Mormon response - can't counter the evidence so you must attempt to discredit the source.

 

[Ironhold]

LOL. You still can't answer the question, can you? Typical Mormon response - can't counter the evidence so you must attempt to discredit the source.

Welcome to the fun and lovely world of higher academia, where this kind of stuff happens all the honkin' time.

(Yes, one of the colleges I attended *did* have a scandal wherein a faculty member was forced out for lying on their resume...)

 

[BigDaddy4]

Welcome to the fun and lovely world of higher academia, where this kind of stuff happens all the honkin' time.

(Yes, one of the colleges I attended *did* have a scandal wherein a faculty member was forced out for lying on their resume...)

Your continued avoidance of the content is noted.

 

[Peter1000]

And that matters how in regards to their accuracy of information?

Please, they could care less about accuracy.

 

[BigDaddy4]

Please, they could care less about accuracy.

And your evidence for that is....?

 

[He is the way]

And your evidence for that is....?

Read my post #107.

 

[BigDaddy4]

Read my post #107.

Which has nothing to do with anything. No evidence provided.

 

[He is the way]

Which has nothing to do with anything. No evidence provided.

What do you mean, they went to the wrong place to gather information, they went to Palmyra instead of Manchester which is where the Smiths lived at the time. Do you actually think they could get the right information from the wrong place?

 

[Peter1000]

And your evidence for that is....?

Their own writings. They are full of stupid errors, and stupid lies. Let's you and I sit down and read a section together and I will tell you what is true and what is a stupid lie. Or what is half true, or 3/4 true, or 1/8 true.