Does Colossians 2:16 refer to weekly Sabbaths?

[LoveGodsWord]

Amen brother! Colossians 2:16 is not simply talking about "ceremonial Sabbaths." The words "ton sabbaton" or "sabbath days"; are the same words translated "Sabbath day" in Exodus 20:8 in the Septuagint.

We see Paul's reasoning, "Let no one judge you regarding a, festival - yearly Sabbaths, a new moon - monthly Sabbaths, or a Sabbath day - weekly Sabbaths (or Sabbath days)" CHRIST, he goes on to say is the "Substance", these things were shadows.

When this passage is compared with Galatians 4:9 we can see that a connection in Paul's teaching is revealed: "But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elemental things, to which you desire to be enslaved all over again? You observe days and months and seasons and years."

In verse 10, we read - "you observe..,"

days (weekly Sabbaths, corresponding to "Sabbath days in Colossians 2)
months (new moons, corresponding to "a new moon" in Colossians 2)
seasons (the 7 feasts, corresponding to "festivals" in Colossians 2)
and years (the sabbatical year and the 50th year of Jubilee)

Paul is clearing speaking about the observances of all Jewish holy days, including the weekly Sabbath. When God wants refers to the whole system of Jewish holy days, rather than naming them all, He would refer to the yearly, monthly and weekly as representing the whole system and yearly Sabbaths were already referred to in Colossians 2:16 as "festivals". The "Year, Month, Week" pattern is well established in the Old Testament and Colossians 2:16 must also refer to the weekly Sabbath.

Yearly, monthly, weekly pattern proves it is the weekly Sabbath

1 Chronicles 23:31 - Yearly (fixed festivals), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

2 Chronicles 2:4 - Yearly (appointed feasts), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

2 Chronicles 8:13 - Yearly (annual feasts), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

2 Chronicles 31:3 - Yearly (fixed festivals), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

Nehemiah 10:33 - Yearly (appointed times), monthly (new moon), weekly (Sabbaths)

Isaiah 1:13-14 - Yearly (appointed feasts), monthly (new moon), weekly (Sabbath)

Ezekiel 45:17 - Yearly (appointed feasts), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

Ezek 46:1-11 - Yearly (appointed feasts), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbath)

Hosea 2:11 - Yearly (festal assemblies), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

Galatians 4:10 - years, months, days

Colossians 2:16 - festival, new moon, Sabbath day

With all this emphasis being placed upon the Sabbath (which is a shadow but the substance is of Christ) it's no wonder that certain Sabbatarians have a tendency to get bogged down in legalism.

Sadly your confusion here is that you try to look at GREEK and HEBREW word meanings in isolation of within scripture and chapter context that determine that word meaning, applications and usage. Sorry friend Gods WORD disagrees with you (see post # 6 linked; post # 8 linked; post # 10 linked and post # 11 linked) By all means if you disagree please address posts 6, 8 and 10 linked above and all the scriptures provided. If you cannot why not believe God's WORD?

Hope this helps

 

[BobRyan]

Hosea 2:11 - Yearly (festal assemblies), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

Galatians 4:10 - years, months, days

Colossians 2:16 - festival, new moon, Sabbath day

Col 2:16 "Sabbath days" that are shadows - refer to Lev 23 annual Sabbaths that point forward to death of Christ "Christ our Passover has been slain" 1 Cor 5.

Gal 4:10 is talking only about pagan days - by contrast Romans 14 is talking only about the Bible-approved Holy days of Lev 23.

Hos 2 "sabbaths" -- plural -- “I will also put an end to all her gaiety,
Her feasts, her new moons, her sabbaths
And all her festal assemblies.

Because not all of the annual feast days are Sabbaths

=============================

Bible details matter.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Had to go last night a little earlier as it was late my time but wanted to give a more detailed reply to anyone that my be interested in God's WORD, so this will be broken down into some smaller posts for those interested in the detail.

Amen brother! Colossians 2:16 is not simply talking about "ceremonial Sabbaths." The words "ton sabbaton" or "sabbath days"; are the same words translated "Sabbath day" in Exodus 20:8 in the Septuagint.

The OLD TESTAMENT is written in HEBREW and translated into the GREEK. The HEBREW WORD for SABBATH is SABBATH SHABBATH שׁבּת (H7676) Intensive from H7673; intermission, that is, (specifically) the Sabbath: - (+ every) sabbath.

The GREEK translation of the HEBREW word SABBATH SHABBATH שׁבּת is σάββατον; SABBATON; sab'-bat-on Of Hebrew origin [H7676]; the Sabbath (that is, Shabbath), or day of weekly repose from secular avocations (also the observance or institution itself); by extension a se'nnight, that is, the interval between two Sabbaths; likewise the plural in all the above applications: - sabbath (day), week.

NOTE: The application of SABBATON from the GREEK translation of SHABBATH has a wider application than merely GOD'S 4th Commandment or SEVENTH DAY. It also includes ANY DAY OF WEEKLY REPOSE FROM SECULAR WORK. The use of the word SABBATON is not retricted only to the SEVENTH DAY SABBATH of God's 4th Commandment. It can also mean the intervals between the SABBATH depending on the context it is applied in also ANY DAY of the week no work is done. Therefore as the GREEK word has many meanying and applications the CONTEXT of how the GREEK word is used determines the correct definition.

This means ALL the annual feast days that were not the SEVENTH DAY but where no work was to be done are also translated as SABBATON.

These ceremonial "SPECIAL" Sabbaths (plural) were connected to..

* Annual festival of The blowing of trumpet (Leviticus 23:24)
* Annual Day of Atonement (Leviticus 23:32)
* Annual Feast of tabernacles (Leviticus 23:39)

These "SPECIAL" Sabbath could fall on any day and were connected directly to these festivals that were prophetic in nature pointing to Jesus and God's plan of Salvation in the NEW COVENANT.

................

The within scripture and chapter CONTEXT is where we then must determine the correct application and meaning of COLOSSIANS 2:16-17 which is in reference to the OLD TESTAMENT scriptures.

COLOSSIANS 2:16 [16] Let no man therefore judge you in MEAT, or in DRINK, or in respect of an HOLYDAY [FEASTIVALS], or of the NEW MOON, or of the SABBATH DAYS <plural>:

PAUL'S within scriptures CONTEXT and use of COLOSSIANS 2:16-17 is in reference to the OLD TESTAMENT scriptures.

EZEKIEL 45:17 [17] And it shall be the prince's part to give BURNT OFFERINGS, and MEAT OFFERINGS, and DRINK OFFERINGS, in the FEASTS, and in the NEW MOONS, and in the SABBATHS, in all solemnities of the house of Israel: he shall prepare the sin offering, and the meat offering, and the burnt offering, and the peace offerings, to make reconciliation for the house of Israel.

NUMBERS 28 [9] And on the Sabbath day two lambs of the first year without spot, and two tenth deals of flour for a MEAT OFFERING, mingled with oil, and the DRINK OFFERING thereof: [10] This is the burnt offering of EVERY SABBATH, beside the continual BURN'T OFFERING, and his DRINK OFFERING.

ISAIAH 1:10-14 [10] Hear the word of the LORD, ye rulers of Sodom; give ear unto the law of our God, ye people of Gomorrah.[11] To what purpose is the multitude of your sacrifices unto me? saith the LORD: I AM FULL OF THE BURNT OFFERINGS of rams, and the fat of fed beasts; and I delight not in the blood of bullocks, or of lambs, or of he goats.[12] When ye come to appear before me, who hath required this at your hand, to tread my courts?[13] BRING NO MORE VAIN OBLATIONS; incense is an abomination unto me; THE NEW MOONS AND SABBATHS, the calling of assemblies, I cannot away with; it is iniquity, even the solemn meeting.[14] Your NEW MOONS and your APPOINTED FEASTS my soul hateth: they are a trouble unto me; I am weary to bear them.

LEVITICUS 23:4 [4] These are THE FEASTS OF THE LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons. [5] In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is THE LORD'S PASSOVER. [6] And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the Lord: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread…… [13] And the MEAT OFFERING thereof shall be two tenth deals of fine flour mingled with oil, an offering made by fire unto the Lord for a sweet savour: and the DRINK OFFERING thereof shall be of wine, the fourth part of an hin.

HOSEA 2:11 [11], I will also cause all her mirth to CEASE, HER [ISRAEL'S] FEAST DAYS, her NEW MOONS, and HER SABBATHS, and all HER [ISRAELS] SOLEMN FEASTS.

wait for it back to the NEW...

HEBREWS 9:1-12 [1] Then verily THE FIRST COVENANT HAD ALSO ORDINANCES of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.... [9] WHICH WAS A FIGURE for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;[10] WHICH STOOD ONLY IN MEATS AND DRINKS, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.[12] NEITHER BY THE BLOOD OF GOATS AND CALVES, BUT BY HIS OWN BLOOD he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.

HEBREWS 10:1-9
[1], FOR THE LAW HAVING A SHADOW OF GOOD THINGS TO COME, AND NOT THE VERY IMAGE OF THE THINGS, CAN NEVER WITH THOSE SACRIFICES which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
[2], For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
[3], But in those SACRIFICES there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
[4], For it is not possible that THE BLOOD OF BULLS AND GOATS should take away sins.
[5], Why when he comes into the world, he said, SACRIFICES AND OFFERINGS YOU WOULD NOT BUT A BODY YOU HAVE PREPARED FOR ME:
[6], IN BURN'T OFFERINGS AND SACRIFICES FOR SIN YOU HAVE HAD NO PLEASURE.
[7], Then said I, See, I come in the VOLUME OF THE BOOK IT IS WRITTEN OF ME, to do your will, O God.
[8], Above when he said, SACRIFICES AND OFFERINGS AND BURNT OFFERINGS AND OFFERINGS FOR SIN YOU WOULD NOT, neither had pleasure therein; WHICH ARE OFFERED BY THE LAW;
[9], Then said he, See, I come to do your will, O God. He takes away the first, that he may establish the second.

NOTE; the LAW in reference here is NOT God's 10 Commandments but the law of sin offereings from the SHADOW laws of the MOSAIC BOOK of the LAW *DEUTERONOMY 31:24-26 from the OLD COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7 (Please look at the attached scriptures)

Your use of the GREEK leave out the context of application and word use that PAUL is writing about from the OLD TESTAMENT scriptures which are the sacrificial SIN offereings and JEWISH annual festivals that where shadow laws from the MOSAIC BOOK of the OLD COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7 that pointed to JESUS and God's plan of salvation in the NEW COVENANT *HEBREWS 8:10-12.

Will continue with this a little more. The above here is the within scripture context. Let's also look at the within chapter context.

Hope this helps.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Amen brother! Colossians 2:16 is not simply talking about "ceremonial Sabbaths." The words "ton sabbaton" or "sabbath days"; are the same words translated "Sabbath day" in Exodus 20:8 in the Septuagint.

Ok the above post is addressing the use of the GREEK word SABBATON and application and word use in the WITHIN scriptures CONTEXT applied to COLOSSIANS 2:16-17. Let's now look at the within CHAPTER CONTEXT leading up to COLOSSIANS 2:16-17 to determine the topic of conversation.

COL 2:11-17 CHAPTER CONTEXT
[11], In whom also you are CIRCUMCISION with the CIRCUMCISION made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
[12], Buried with him in baptism, in which also you are risen with him through the faith of the working of God, who has raised him from the dead.
[13], And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, has he made alive together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
[14], BLOTTING OUT the HANDWRITING of ORDINANCES that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
[15], And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a show of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
[16], Let no man therefore judge you in FOOD AND DRINK, or in respect of a HOLY DAY [FESTIVAL], or of the NEW MOON, or of the SABBATH DAYS:
[17], Which are a SHADOW OF THINGS TO COME; but the body is of Christ.

CHAPTER CONTEXT OF COL 2:14 AND SUBJECT MATTER (COL 2:11-17)

V11. Shadows of the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCE of CIRCUMCISION pointing to CIRCUMCISION of the HEART MADE WITHOUT HANDS by the CIRCUMCISION of Christ.

THE SHADOW LAWS FORETOLD IN THE OLD AND NEW TESTAMENT SCRIPTURES….

DEUTERONOMY 10:16 [16] CIRCUMCISE THERFORE THE FORESKIN OF YOUR HEART, and be no more stiff-necked.

DEUTERONOMY 30:6 [6] And the LORD your God will CIRCUMCISE YOUR HEART AND THE HEART OF YOUR DECENDENCE, TO LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART AND WITHYOU’RE YOUR SOUL, THAT YOU MAY LIVE.

JEREMIAH 4:4 [4] CIRCUMCISE YOURSELF TO THE LORD, AND TAKE AWAY THE FORESKINS OF YOUR HEART, you men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem: lest my fury come forth like fire, and burn that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings.

NOTE: NEW COVENANT FULFILLMENT of the SHADOWS of the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCE of CIRCUMCISION pointing the CIRCUMCISION of the HEART through faith in Christ…

ROMANS 2:25-29 [25] For circumcision verily profits, if you keep the law: but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision is made uncircumcision. [26], Therefore if the uncircumcision keeps the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? [27], And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfils the law, judge you, who by the letter and circumcision do transgress the law? [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW, WHO IS ONE; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OF THE OUTWARD FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; AND CIRCUMCISION IS THAT OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT AND NOT IN THE LETTER; WHOSE PRAISE IS NOT OF MEN BUT OF GOD.

1 CORITHIANS 7:19 [19] CIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, AND UNCIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, BUT THE KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD.

This is the operation of GOD in the NEW COVENANT…

HEBREWS 8:10 [10], For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR MINDS, AND WRITE THEM IN THEIR HEARTS [NOTE: THE SHADOW OF CIRCUMCSION]: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

CONCLUSION; The CEREMONIAL ORDINANCE of CIRCUMCISION is a Shadow law from the MOSAIC BOOK of the COVENANT pointing to a NEW HEART to LOVE and OBEY GOD in the NEW COVENANT. The SHADOW laws of the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCES of CIRCUMCISION from the Mosaic BOOK of the Covenant are the within CHAPTER CONTEXT BEFORE COL 2:14

Let's continue on through the chapter...

COL 2:14 SCRIPTURE SUBJECT MATTER AND CONTENT.

14, Blotting out the HANDWRITING of ORDINANCES that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

GREEK WORD MEANINGS AND WORD USE

14, “BLOTTING OUT” < G1813 ἐξαλείφω exaleipho (ex-a-lei'-fō) v. means to rub out, i.e. obliterate, erase> the “HANDWRITING” < G5498 χειρόγραφον cheirographon (chei-ro'-gra-fon) n. means something hand-written (“chirograph”), a manuscript specially, a legal document > of “ORDINANCES” < G1378 δόγμα dogma (d̮og'-ma) n. means ordinance; CIVIL, CEREMONIAL or ECCLESIASTICAL LAWS> that was against us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

The GREEK WORD meanings here in this scripture show that it follows the same CONTEXT of v11-13 in relation to the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCES found in the MOSAIC BOOK of the COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7.

V14 Blotting out or erasing the legal MANUSCRIPT or document of ORDINANCES referred to here are those of the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCES from the MOSAIC BOOK of the COVENANT.

The GREEK word for ORDIANACE is DOGMA meaning THE CIVIL, CEREMONIAL and ECCLESIASTICAL ORDINANCES once again only found in the MOSAIC BOOK of the Covenant *EXODUS 24:7

This scripture cannot be referring to the abolishing of the 10 commandments of God’s LAW as God’s 10 Commandments are not ORDINANCES and they are not written in a MANUSCRIPT they are written on two tables of stone (Exodus 31:18). Also the chapter CONTEXT is in reference to the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCES of CIRCUMCISION once again from the MOSAIC BOOK of the OLD COVENANT. These were all SHADOWS ALONG WITH THE ORDINANCES OF v17 pointing to Christ and the plan of SALVATION.

ORDINANCES that were against us is referring to the also referring to the PENALTY of SIN (breaking God’s Commandments and the ORDINANCES of curses written once again in the MOSAIC BOOK of the Covenant.

DEUTERONOMY 31:26 [26] Take this Book of the Law, and put it in the side of the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, that it may be there FOR A WITNESS AGAINST THEE.

DEUTERONOMY 30:19 [19] For GOD has said, I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, BLESSINGS AND CURSES: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live: [20] That thou mayest love the Lord thy God, and that thou mayest OBEY his voice, and that thou mayest cleave unto him: for he is thy life, and the length of thy days: that thou mayest dwell in the land which the LORD swore unto thy fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, to give them.

(See the list of ORDINACES for curses of breaking Gods’ Law in DEUTERONOMY 28:15-68)

CONCLUSION; COL 2:14 is talking about the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCES written in the MOSIAC BOOK of the Covenant which are SHADOW laws pointing to Jesus and God’s plan of SALVATION. This is supported also by the within CHAPTER CONTEXT and SUBJECT matter of v16 which are all CEREMONIAL ORDINANCES written in the MOCAIC BOOK of the COVENANT and not referring to ABOLISHING God’s 10 Commandments.

Can you see your error here brother?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

We see Paul's reasoning, "Let no one judge you regarding a, festival - yearly Sabbaths, a new moon - monthly Sabbaths, or a Sabbath day - weekly Sabbaths (or Sabbath days)" CHRIST, he goes on to say is the "Substance", these things were shadows.

Emphasis in your post in red above is mine. The scripture in COLOSSIANS 2:16 does not say Sabbath day. The use of SABBATON here is GNP meaning Genitive Neutral Plural and is translated as SABBATHS or SABBATH DAYS meaning a collective or more than one. Your error of interpretation is shown in the within scripture and chapter CONTEXT of your application that you leave out of the scriptures.

When this passage is compared with Galatians 4:9 we can see that a connection in Paul's teaching is revealed: "But now that you have come to know God, or rather to be known by God, how is it that you turn back again to the weak and worthless elemental things, to which you desire to be enslaved all over again? You observe days and months and seasons and years."

In verse 10, we read - "you observe..,"

days (weekly Sabbaths, corresponding to "Sabbath days in Colossians 2)
months (new moons, corresponding to "a new moon" in Colossians 2)
seasons (the 7 feasts, corresponding to "festivals" in Colossians 2)
and years (the sabbatical year and the 50th year of Jubilee)

Paul is clearing speaking about the observances of all Jewish holy days, including the weekly Sabbath. When God wants refers to the whole system of Jewish holy days, rather than naming them all, He would refer to the yearly, monthly and weekly as representing the whole system and yearly Sabbaths were already referred to in Colossians 2:16 as "festivals". The "Year, Month, Week" pattern is well established in the Old Testament and Colossians 2:16 must also refer to the weekly Sabbath.

Yearly, monthly, weekly pattern proves it is the weekly Sabbath

1 Chronicles 23:31 - Yearly (fixed festivals), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

2 Chronicles 2:4 - Yearly (appointed feasts), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

2 Chronicles 8:13 - Yearly (annual feasts), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

2 Chronicles 31:3 - Yearly (fixed festivals), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

Nehemiah 10:33 - Yearly (appointed times), monthly (new moon), weekly (Sabbaths)

Isaiah 1:13-14 - Yearly (appointed feasts), monthly (new moon), weekly (Sabbath)

Ezekiel 45:17 - Yearly (appointed feasts), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

Ezek 46:1-11 - Yearly (appointed feasts), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbath)

Hosea 2:11 - Yearly (festal assemblies), monthly (new moons), weekly (Sabbaths)

Galatians 4:10 - years, months, days

Colossians 2:16 - festival, new moon, Sabbath day

With all this emphasis being placed upon the Sabbath (which is a shadow but the substance is of Christ) it's no wonder that certain Sabbatarians have a tendency to get bogged down in legalism.

Your error here lies in trying to read into the scriptures something that it is not referring to. Where does it say in GALATIANS 4 that it is talking about God's 4th Commandment? Let's take a closer look at GALATIANS 4 and let the scriptures interpret themselves.

GALATIONS 4:8-11 [8], But then, when you knew not God, YOU DID SERVICE UNTO THEM WHICH BY NATURE ARE NO GODS. [9], But now, after you have known God, or rather are known of God, HOW TURN YOU BACK TO THE WEAK AND BEGGARLY ELEMENTS TO WHICH YOU DESIRE TO BE IN BONDAGE?

NOTE: CONTEXT is those who before they KNEW GOD did service to other God's v8. Then the CONTEXT is determined in v9 that these people were returning back to the bondage of serving other God's

[10], YOU OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS [11], I am afraid for you, lest I have bestowed upon you labor in vain.

NOTE: GALATIANS 4 says nothing about God's 4th Commandment Sabbath. Its speaking of those who OBSERVE TIMES. But what times is God's Word talking about that connects the CONTEXT of those returning back to serve other God's? Let's look at the scriptures.

DEUTERONOMY 18:9-11 [9] When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.[10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, OR AN OBSERVER OF TIMES, or an enchanter, or a witch,[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.

The same thing goes on to this very day. Its speaking of the occult. Those who observe certain days by use of Astrology and horoscopes?

2 CHRONICLES 33:3-6 [3] For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves, and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them.[4] Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever.[5] And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD.[6] And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: ALSO HE OBSERVED TIMES, and used enchantments, and used witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger

Enchantments, witchcraft, familiar spirits, and wizards. Its speaking of the occult. Not following sabbath days.

LEVITICUS 19:26-29 [26] You shall not eat any thing with the blood: neither shall ye use enchantment, NOR OBSERVE TIMES.[27] Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.[28] Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.[29] Do not prostitute thy daughter, to cause her to be a harlot; lest the land fall to whoredom, and the land become full of wickedness.[30] YE SHALL KEEP MY SABBATHS, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

I guess this scripture says it all. You shall not observe times BUT you will keep my sabbaths.

Can you see your error here brother? Your trying to read into the scriptures something that it is not talking about.

Hope this helps.

 

[ewq1938]

Your error here is that you mix up God's ETERNAL LAW (10 commandments) with the MOSAIC BOOK of the law which PAUL is referring to in COL 2.

The ten commandments aren't eternal.

2Co 3:1 Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?
2Co 3:2 Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:
2Co 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
2Co 3:4 And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
2Co 3:5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2Co 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
2Co 3:8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
2Co 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
2Co 3:10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
2Co 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

The original ten commandments were done away. The moral ones are brought into the new law of Christ but ceremonial ones like Saturday Sabbaths were not which is why most Christians don't and didn't keep Saturdays and why the new covenant also does not command it. It was part of the old covenant only, and only for Jews.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

The ten commandments aren't eternal.

2Co 3:1 Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?
2Co 3:2 Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:
2Co 3:3 Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.
2Co 3:4 And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:
2Co 3:5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
2Co 3:7 But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
2Co 3:8 How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
2Co 3:9 For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
2Co 3:10 For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
2Co 3:11 For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

The original ten commandments were done away. The moral ones are brought into the new law of Christ but ceremonial ones like Saturday Sabbaths were not which is why most Christians don't and didn't keep Saturdays and why the new covenant also does not command it. It was part of the old covenant only, and only for Jews.

Hello brother your in error here. Let's see why?

If you do not know what the OLD COVENANT was how can you understand what the NEW COVENANT is that the OLD COVENANT points to? You mix up the SHADOW laws from the MOSAIC BOOK of the COVENANT with God's eternal law that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172.

If your trying to argue that 2 CORINTHIANS 3 is talking about God's 10 Commandments being abolished then you really need to re-read the whole chapter brother because it is saying no such thing.

2 CORINTHIANS 3 is discussing the two glories of the covenants which are the 10 Commandments written on stone and the promise of the Spirit to write them in the heart through faith that works by LOVE.

One written on stone; Gives us the KNOWLEDGE of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172. We all must have a knowledge of what sin is before we can be forgiven and free to walk in God's Spirit *ACTS 2:38; 1 JOHN 1:9; PROVERBS 28:13. The promise of God's Spirit in the NEW COVENANT changes the minsistration of death (wages of sin ROMANS 6:23) to the ministration of the Spirit removing God's commandments written on stone by writing them on the fleshly tables of the heart through faith that works by LOVE *HEBREWS 8:7-12 because LOVE is the establishing and fulfilling of Gods LAW in all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's Word *ROMANS 13:8-10.

2 CORINTHIANS 3 is showing the process of conversion in the NEW COVENANT with God's LAW written on stone giving us the knowledge of SIN and leading us cross of Christ and to the NEW COVENANT promise to be born again, to have God's law written in the heart through faith that works by love freeing us to walk in the Spirit GALATIANS 3:22-25; GALATIANS 5:16; ROMANS 8:1-4.

Let's look at the scriptures and show all the context shall we?

2 CORINTHIANS 3:1-10
[1], Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you?
[2], You are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:
[3], Since you are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshly tables of the heart.
[4], And such trust have we through Christ toward God:
[5], Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think anything as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;
[6], Who also has made us able ministers of the new covenant; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter kills, but the spirit gives life.
[7], But if the ministry of death, written and engraved in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
[8], How shall not the ministry of the Spirit be more glorious?
[9], For if the ministry of condemnation be glory, much more does the ministry of righteousness exceed in glory.
[10], For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excels.

Now take a look at v3 highlighted in RED which is the CONTEXT or what follows. Now take a look at the NEW COVENANT promise from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and repeated by the same same author as Corinthians in Hebrews 8:10-12 and 10:16-17

Hebrews 8:10-12
[10], For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
[11], And they shall not teach every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
[12], For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

2 Corinthians 3 is talking about the NEW COVENANT of God's LAW written on the heart through faith that works by LOVE by His Spirit. Moving from the tables of stone to the fleshly tables of the heart (2 Corinthiand 3:3; Hebrews 8:10)

Let's look at the scriptures laid out together side by side...

2 CORINTHIANS 3:3, [3], Since you are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshly tables of the heart.

links to...

Hebrews 8:10 [10], For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people.

links to...

JEREMIAH 31:33 [33], But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, said the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

links to...

EZEKIEL 36:26-27 [26], A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

links to...

2 CORINTHIANS 3:3 [3], Since you are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshly tables of the heart.

continuing in Ezekiel 36..

[27], And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and you shall keep my judgments, and do them.

God's Spirit of love...

ROAMNS 13:8-10 [8], Owe no man anything, but to love one another: for he that loves another has fulfilled the law. [9], For this, You shall not commit adultery, You shall not kill, You shall not steal, You shall not bear false witness, You shall not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is summed up in this saying, namely, You shall love your neighbor as yourself. [10], Love works no ill to his neighbor: THEREFORE LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

.................

CONCLUSION: 2 Corinthians 3 is talking about the NEW COVENANT of LOVE written on the heart to walk in God's LAW, through LOVE. It is NOT talking about ABOLISHING God's LAW it is talking about FULFILLING God's LAW in those who BELIEVE God's WORD. This is RIGHTEOUSNESS (Salvation) by FAITH for a SINNER that BELIEVES the WORD'S of the SAVIOUR (JESUS). What is being ABOLISHED is the condemnation and the penalty of sin [DEATH] through FAITH in Christ by walking in the Spirit under the NEW COVENANT.

................

SIN is still the same as it has always been which is the breaking of God's Commandments (James 2:9-11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4) Those who CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will NOT enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN.

................

God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

Sorry brother God's WORD disagrees with you. If you do away with God's 10 Commandments, then you have no knowledge of what sin is. If you have no knowledge of what sin is, you have no need of a Saviour. If you have no Saviour, you have no salvation because you are still in your sins and have not been born again to walk in God's Spirit by faith that works by love.

Hope this helps

 

[godenver1]

Col 2:16 "Sabbath days" that are shadows - refer to Lev 23 annual Sabbaths that point forward to death of Christ "Christ our Passover has been slain" 1 Cor 5.

Gal 4:10 is talking only about pagan days - by contrast Romans 14 is talking only about the Bible-approved Holy days of Lev 23.

Hos 2 "sabbaths" -- plural -- “I will also put an end to all her gaiety,
Her feasts, her new moons, her sabbaths
And all her festal assemblies.

Because not all of the annual feast days are Sabbaths

=============================

Bible details matter.

I'm still not seeing convincing arguments that "Sabbath days" in Colossians 2:16 is referent to Levitical sabbaths, and that it doesn't simply mean weekly Sabbaths. You can make that claim, but you have to prove it. 1 Corinthians 5:7 alone isn't going to cut it. I'm not here to discuss a distinction between God's Law and the Law of Moses, I'm here to discuss why 'Sabbath days' in Colossians 2:16 simply means 'Sabbath days', and nothing else.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

The ten commandments aren't eternal. The original ten commandments were done away. The moral ones are brought into the new law of Christ but ceremonial ones like Saturday Sabbaths were not which is why most Christians don't and didn't keep Saturdays and why the new covenant also does not command it. It was part of the old covenant only, and only for Jews.

Your confused here brother let's look at the scriptures showing God's LAW is eternal. Your mixing up the SHADOW laws from the MOSAIC BOOK of the COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7 with God's ETERNAL law that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOUESNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172.

The Law of God (10 commandments) which includes the 4th commandment is the work of God (Exodus 32:16) whatsoever God does is forever nothing can be added to it or taken away (Ecclesiastes 3:14). God's Law is perfect converting the soul (Psalms 19:7).
It is the very standard of the Old and New Covenants (Exodus 20:1:17, Hebrews 8:10-12).
God's Law was spoken by God himself to His people (Exodus 20:1-22). Jesus says Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away (Matthew 25:35). Gods Law is still in force today (Psalms 111:7-8, Revelation 12:17, 14:12, 22:14, 1 John 3:5-8, 1 John 2:3-4 etc.).

The Law of God reveals sin to us so we can see ourselves as we truly are sinners in need of a Saviour (Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4).It is the great standard of the judgement (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14, James 2:10-12, 1 John 3:4, Acts 17:31). God's Law is our teacher revealing sin and the character of God and brings us to Christ at the foot of the cross that we might be saved by faith by Him who loves us and washed us in His own blood (Galatians 3:24; Revelation 1:5). Jesus came not to abolish the law, but to fulfil it (Matthew 5:17-20 ). The law is the embodiment of truth that instructs (Romans 2:18-19). It is "holy" and "spiritual, " making sin known to us by defining it; therefore, Paul delights in it (Romans 7:7-14; Romans 7:22). The law is good if used properly (1 Timothy 1:8 ), and is not opposed to the promises of God (Galatians 3:21). Faith does not make the law void, but the Christian establishes the law (Romans 3:31), fulfilling its requirements by walking according to the Spirit (Romans 8:4) through love (Romans 13:10 ).

You cannot know the power of God or the Gospel of Grace without the 10 commandments. If there is NO LAW then you do not know what SIN is (James 2:11; Romans 7:7; Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4). If you do not know what SIN is you have NO need of a Savior. If you have NO need of a Savior you have NO Salvation. If you have NO Salvation you are LOST because you are still in your sins because you have not accepted the gift of God's dear son (ROMANS 6:23).

GOD'S LAW (TEN COMMANDMENTS) ARE INDEED ETERNAL

PSALMS 119:142-143 Your righteousness is an EVERLASTING RIGHTEOUSNESS, and Your law is truth. Trouble and anguish have overtaken me, yet Your commandments are my delights.

PSALMS 119:172 My tongue shall speak of your word for ALL YOUR COMMANDMENTS ARE RIGHTEOUSNESS

PSALMS 119:160 All your words are true; ALL YOUR RIGHTEOUS LAWS ARE ETERNAL.

ECCLESIASTES 3:14, I know that, WHATSOEVER GOD DOES, IT SHALL BE FOREVER: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God does it, that men should fear before him.

EXODUS 32:16, And THE TABLES WERE THE WORK OF GOD, AND THE WRITING WAS THE WRITING OF GOD, graven on the tables.

ISAIAH 40:8 [8], The grass wither, the flower fades: but THE WORD OF THE LORD OF OUR GOD SHALL ENDURE FOREVER.

EXODUS 20:1-17 GOD SPOKE THE TEN COMMANDMENTS. THE TEN COMMANDMENTS ARE GOD'S WORD (v1)

1 PETER 1:25, But THE WORD OF THE LORD ENDURES FOREVER [EVERLASTING WORD OF GOD]. And this is the word which by the GOSPEL [GOOD NEWS] is preached unto you.

LUKE 21:33, Heaven and earth shall pass away: BUT MY WORDS SHALL NOT PASS AWAY [EVERLASTING WORD OF GOD].

Can you see your error here brother?

Hope this helps

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I'm still not seeing convincing arguments that "Sabbath days" in Colossians 2:16 is referent to Levitical sabbaths, and that it doesn't simply mean weekly Sabbaths. You can make that claim, but you have to prove it. 1 Corinthians 5:7 alone isn't going to cut it. I'm not here to discuss a distinction between God's Law and the Law of Moses, I'm here to discuss why 'Sabbath days' in Colossians 2:16 simply means 'Sabbath days', and nothing else.

Sadly there is no truth in this post of yours. That is because your only seeing what you want to see and is why you have no response to the scriptures that are posted. It is God's WORD that you choose not to see. If you cannot state why it is you disagree with the scriptures posted then it is because you simply choose to disagree for the sake of a disagreement.

I would refer you to the recent posts # 23 linked; post 24 linked and post # 25 linked and all the scriptures in them and GREEK and HEBREW word meanings. Ignoring God's WORD does not make it magically disappear. It is forever and will be our judge come judgment day *JOHN 12:47-48. At that time however it will be too late to argue with God *HEBREWS 10:26-31.

Hope this helps.

 

[godenver1]

I've read (most of) the posts above. I'm not sure you are understanding my point.

My point is this: the most simple reading of Colossians 2:16 would be to read the word "Sabbaths" and believe it means weekly Sabbath, as that is the obvious reading. If you believe it means something else, you have to prove it. Again, I'm not interested in a debate about 'God's Law' versus 'Moses's Law'. If you believe that the word 'Sabbath' in Colossians 2:16 means something other than weekly Sabbath, then you need scripture to justify it. I'm not interested in what Exodus or Deuteronomy has to say, unless you can show how it directly relates to Colossians 2:16.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I've read (most of) the posts above. I'm not sure you are understanding my point.

My point is this: the most simple reading of Colossians 2:16 would be to read the word "Sabbaths" and believe it means weekly Sabbath, as that is the obvious reading. If you believe it means something else, you have to prove it. Again, I'm not interested in a debate about 'God's Law' versus 'Moses's Law'. If you believe that the word 'Sabbath' in Colossians 2:16 means something other than weekly Sabbath, then you need scripture to justify it. I'm not interested in what Exodus or Deuteronomy has to say, unless you can show how it directly relates to Colossians 2:16.

The linked posts and scriptures in them show this is not the case. I would refer you to the recent posts # 23 linked; post 24 linked and post # 25 linked and all the scriptures in them and GREEK and HEBREW word meanings as they show that both the within scripture and within chapter CONTEXT is not referring to God's 4th commandment or any of the 10 commandments but to the laws in ORDINANCES from the MOSAIC book of SHADOW laws starting with the CONTEXT of CIRCUMCISION in v11 leading through to the ANNUAL JEWISH FESTIVALS and SHADOW sabbaths connected to feast days in v16-17.

The within scripture and chapter CONTEXT shows COLOSSIANS 2 is not talking about God's 10 commandments or there would be no KNOWLEDGE of sin and would contradict PAULS writings that through the LAW is the KNOWLEDGE of what SIN is *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7. The OLD TESTAMENT scriptures as shown earlier in the linked posts above show directly what PAUL is talking about and it is not God's 4th commandments or any of the ten but the sacrificial laws in ORDINANCES and the shadow sabbaths in feast days as shown in the linked scriptures of the OLD TESTAMENT and their links to their fulfillment in the NEW.

Sorry brother God's WORD disagrees with you.

 

[godenver1]

I agree that the law accuses us of sin. That is its chief purpose, to point us to Christ. I'm not disagreeing. I still don't see how Romans 3:20 or Romans 7:7 or Psalms 119:172 relate to Colossians 2:16. I can't see the clear connection you seem to see. I fully affirm the Scriptures above.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I agree that the law accuses us of sin. That is its chief purpose, to point us to Christ. I'm not disagreeing. I still don't see how Romans 3:20 or Romans 7:7 or Psalms 119:172 relate to Colossians 2:16. I can't see the clear connection you seem to see. I fully affirm the Scriptures above.

Those scriptures don't relate to COLOSSIANS 2 as COLOSSIANS 2 is not talking about God's 10 commandments. It is talking about the SHADOW laws in ORDINANCES from the MOSAIC BOOK of the COVENANT not God's 10 commandments. God's 4th commandment is one of the 10 commandments that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172. Also, out of interest God's 4th commandment cannot be a SHADOW sabbath as being referred to in COLOSSIANS 2:16-17 as it was a part of the FINISHED WORK of creation *GENESIS 2:1-3 that will be continued to be kept in the NEW EARTH *ISAIAH 66:22-23.

It cannot be a shadow if God's WORD tells us that it is a part of a FINISHED WORK BEFORE SIN entered the world and BEFORE God's plan of salvation was given for mankind.

The SHADOW laws were all a part of the MOSAIC BOOK OF THE COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7 outlining God's plan of salvation in the NEW COVENANT. So because the SEVENTH DAY Sabbath was a part of a FINISHED WORK, BEFORE SIN and BEFORE the MOSAIC BOOK was given, it cannot be a shadow law *GENESIS 2:1-3. It is a MORAL law as are all the ten commandments and outlines our duty of LOVE to God and man.

Hope this helps.

 

[godenver1]

Yes, and I'm asking you to prove why you think Colossains is referring to a "shadow Sabbath". That is all I want. I know the Sabbath was created before the Mosaic law, there's just no biblical evidence to believe it was observed before the Mosaic law (Nehiamiah 9:14).

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Yes, and I'm asking you to prove why you think Colossains is referring to a "shadow Sabbath". That is all I want. I know the Sabbath was created before the Mosaic law, there's just biblical evidence to believe it was observed before the Mosaic law (Nehiamiah 9:14).

Already proven in posts # 23 linked; post 24 linked and post # 25 linked. Sadly you simply choose to ignore God's WORD. Ignoring God's WORD does not make it magically disappear. It is forever and will be our judge come judgment day *JOHN 12:47-48. At that time however it will be too late to argue with God *HEBREWS 10:26-31. Ok my friend, I hope to see you in God's KINGDOM. Time for me to leave this between you and God as it is God's WORD not mine whom we all must answer to.

May God bless you as you seek him through his Word.

 

[godenver1]

Paul doesn't say "let no one pass judgment with regard to burnt offerings/blowing trumpets/sacrificing rams on a festival sabbath". He simply says "Sabbaths". I read the bible verses you provided, I don't see how that changes the context of Colossians 2:16.

 

[ace of hearts]

I don't think so because the term is plural and stated specifically as "shadows" -- the Lev 23 annual Sabbaths were based on animal sacrifices - and thus are shadows of the sacrifice of Christ - even Paul demonstrates this in 1Cor 5 "Christ our Passover has been slain".

I think it is because it's the same list appearing in Lev 23.

 

[BobRyan]

I think it is because it's the same list appearing in Lev 23.

yes Lev 23 has the annual Sabbaths and also annual feasts that are not Sabbaths.

 

[BobRyan]

Paul doesn't say "let no one pass judgment with regard to burnt offerings/blowing trumpets/sacrificing rams on a festival sabbath".

And Jesus said "do not judge" Matthew 7.

Same rule before the cross as after.