Does being a Synergist makes you "boast"?

[Not David]

I usually hear monergists saying that believing in faith alone makes you not wanting to boast on yourself or "on your works". Do you ever feel like this has happened to you?

 

[Jonaitis]

I usually hear monergists saying that believing in faith alone makes you not wanting to boast on yourself or "on your works". Do you ever feel like this has happened to you?

In that same line of thought, what about monergists that say that a synergist is claiming God only does part of the work in saving you?

 

[Not David]

In that same line of thought, what about monergists that say that a synergist is claiming God only does part of the work in saving you?

What about it?

 

[Jonaitis]

What about it?

Is it true?

 

[Monk Brendan]

I usually hear monergists saying that believing in faith alone makes you not wanting to boast on yourself or "on your works". Do you ever feel like this has happened to you?

I believe in Jesus, not a theory about how He saves me.

There is a big difference between them.

 

[JohnB445]

The works are just part of the new nature by which God transformed the believer to take on this new nature.

But I will never see the works as something one has to do in order to be saved or to maintain salvation, but just mere evidence one has been saved.

To be safe I prefer to give God all credit and none to myself. And consider it all to be God's work.

 

[Not David]

Is it true?

I believe God gives us grace and we cooperate with him to achieve theosis.

 

[Not David]

The works are just part of the new nature by which God transformed the believer to take on this new nature.

But I will never see the works as something one has to do in order to be saved or to maintain salvation, but just mere evidence one has been saved.

To be safe I prefer to give God all credit and none to myself. And consider it all to be God's work.

Paul always talk about remaining in the faith and not submitting to the desires of the flesh.

 

[ArmyMatt]

ideally it wouldn't, considering the freedom to synergize with God is a grace He gives anyways.

 

[~Anastasia~]

If it does, you're doing it wrong.




Seriously though ... we probably most of us go through stages of learning how to think and how to regard things. There are bumps on the way. Or if you like, a ditch on either side we could potentially fall into. (That's true with most things - at least I manage to find the ditches lol ... hopefully I sometimes avoid falling completely into them by the grace of God.)

Any Theology (true ones and false ones) has the potential to be misapplied or misunderstood. That doesn't make it true or false. What's true is true (and we believe in synergism). We just have to learn to think properly and avoid whatever pitfalls each of us may be prone to, in this or any other question. I think that's part of growing in our faith.

 

[Jonaitis]

I believe God gives us grace and we cooperate with him to achieve theosis.

How does that work when Jesus called regeneration, for an example, an act of being "born again" (John 3:5-8)? I don't understand the parallel if we cooperate with God. We don't necessarily choose to be born, so wouldn't rebirth capture this aspect of the new creation?

What about circumcision of the heart? This is another description for regeneration (Romans 2:28-29; Colossians 2:11 etc). If I recall, circumcision was normally performed when an infant was eight days old by their parents (Genesis 17:12). I see this as part of the imagery we are suppose to understand, besides the putting off the "foreskin" of our most private part (a heart is private too).

What about when regeneration is paralleled with a resurrection (Ephesians 2:1-6; etc)? I don't see people raising themselves from the dead; I don't recall Lazarus doing this. I don't understand the parallel if we cooperated with God.

What about the imagery of slavery (Romans 6:17-22)? I don't think slaves frees themselves, nor do they choose their preferred master. Where is the parallel of our cooperation with God in this?

Of course, I am a monergist that believes what Jesus clearly said,

"No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day" (John 6:44)

"This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father." (John 6:65)

"...you do not believe because you are not among my sheep. My sheep hear my voice and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish." (John 10:26-28).

Lost sheep don't look for their shepherd, that's another parallel. Interesting connection too, sheep are dumb (in the stupid sense) and cannot look out for themselves. We are sheep.

 

[ArmyMatt]

How does that work when Jesus called regeneration, for an example, an act of being "born again" (John 3:5-8)? I don't understand the parallel if we cooperate with God. We don't necessarily choose to be born, so wouldn't rebirth capture this aspect of the new creation?

What about circumcision of the heart? This is another description for regeneration (Romans 2:28-29; Colossians 2:11 etc). If I recall, circumcision was normally performed when an infant was eight days old by their parents (Genesis 17:12). I see this as part of the imagery we are suppose to understand, besides the putting off the "foreskin" of our most private part (a heart is private too).

What about when regeneration is paralleled with a resurrection (Ephesians 2:1-6; etc)? I don't see people raising themselves from the dead; I don't recall Lazarus doing this. I don't understand the parallel if we cooperated with God.

What about the imagery of slavery (Romans 6:17-22)? I don't think slaves frees themselves, nor do they choose their preferred master. Where is the parallel of our cooperation with God in this?

Of course, I am a monergist that believes what Jesus clearly said,

"No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day" (John 6:44)

"This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father." (John 6:65)

"...you do not believe because you are not among my sheep. My sheep hear my voice and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish." (John 10:26-28).

Lost sheep don't look for their shepherd, that's another parallel. Interesting connection too, sheep are dumb (in the stupid sense) and cannot look out for themselves. We are sheep.

and yet, Christ also says we are to keep His commandments, says that those who do the will of the Father, and we are commanded to work out our salvation with fear and great trembling.

the verses you quoted don't disprove synergy, they only prove that God is the initiator of it, and He gives the grace for it (which we of course agree with).

 

[Tigger45]

ideally it wouldn't, considering the freedom to synergize with God is a grace He gives anyways.

This is also the Lutheran position who consider themselves monergyst and for the life of me I don’t see the difference in real life practice.

 

[Jonaitis]

and yet, Christ also says we are to keep His commandments, says that those who do the will of the Father, and we are commanded to work out our salvation with fear and great trembling.

the verses you quoted don't disprove synergy, they only prove that God is the initiator of it, and He gives the grace for it (which we of course agree with).

Monergism doesn't negate responsibility.

You left out the rest of that verse, let me fully quote it:

"Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure." - Philippians 2:12-13

The disagreement comes from one party saying God's grace enables (thus ours to cooperate), and the other says God's grace efficaciously works in that person to perform what he is commanded to do.

 

[straykat]

I usually hear monergists saying that believing in faith alone makes you not wanting to boast on yourself or "on your works". Do you ever feel like this has happened to you?

No, if I bring up something like this, it's more out concern and wish others wouldn't be so carefree. But in my own case, one must "work out your own salvation with fear and trembling". I just don't understand why this isn't the same motto for all.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Monergism doesn't negate responsibility.

You left out the rest of that verse, let me fully quote it:

"Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure." - Philippians 2:12-13

The disagreement comes from one party saying God's grace enables (thus ours to cooperate), and the other says God's grace efficaciously works in that person to perform what he is commanded to do.

incorrect. we absolutely believe synergy is God working in and through man. I didn't leave off the part of that verse because we don't dispute it.

 

[straykat]

and yet, Christ also says we are to keep His commandments, says that those who do the will of the Father, and we are commanded to work out our salvation with fear and great trembling.

Ah, I should have read through the whole thread before posting. Not surprised we're on the same page, but it's still nice to see.

 

[Jonaitis]

incorrect. we absolutely believe synergy is God working in and through man. I didn't leave off the part of that verse because we don't dispute it.

If that's the case, you're not a synergist by definition...

 

[ArmyMatt]

If that's the case, you're not a synergist by definition...

incorrect. perhaps not how you define it, but that's irrelevant.

 

[Jonaitis]

incorrect. perhaps not how you define it, but that's irrelevant.

Okay. What do the terms mean?