DO YOU BELIEVE IN WATER BAPTISM ??

[Dan Perez]

With out a doubt , WATER BAPTISM is a big divider among believers .

Matt 3:15 that Jesus was WATER BAPTIZED to Fulfill ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS !

Why did Jesus have to be BAPTIZED ??

What say you ??

dan p

 

[Ligurian]

With out a doubt , WATER BAPTISM is a big divider among believers .

Matt 3:15 that Jesus was WATER BAPTIZED to Fulfill ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS !

Why did Jesus have to be BAPTIZED ??

What say you ??

dan p

John 1:29-34 The next day John seeth Ιησους coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.[30] This is He of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred before me: for He was before me.[31] And I knew Him not: but that He should be made manifest to Israel, therefore am I come baptizing with water.[32] And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from Heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.[33] And I knew Him not: but He that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending and remaining on Him, the same is He which baptizeth with the Holy Spirit.[34] And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.

Matthew 3:1-10 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,[2] And saying, Repent ye: for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand. ...[7] But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?[8] Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:

Matthew 4:12-17 Now when Ιησους had heard that John was cast into prison He departed into Galilee.[13] And leaving Nazareth, He came and dwelt in Capernaum, which is upon the sea coast, in the borders of Zabulon and Nephthalim:[14] That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying:[15] The land of Zabulon and the land of Nephthalim, by the way of the sea beyond Jordan, Galilee of the nations:[16] The people which sat in darkness saw great light, and to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is sprung up.[17] From that time Ιησους began to preach and to say: Repent, for the Kingdom of Heaven is at hand.

Matthew 11:16-19 But whereunto shall I liken this generation? It is like unto children sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows,[17] And saying, We have piped unto you and ye have not danced, we have mourned unto you and ye have not lamented.[18] For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, He hath a devil.[19] The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.

 

[eleos1954]

With out a doubt , WATER BAPTISM is a big divider among believers .

Matt 3:15 that Jesus was WATER BAPTIZED to Fulfill ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS !

Why did Jesus have to be BAPTIZED ??

What say you ??

dan p

When Jesus came up out of the water the Father was heard saying,

This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Matthew 3:17 NKJV

Keep in mind, when the Father was saying He was well pleased with His Son, His Son was representing the entire human race. So by accepting His Son, He was accepting the entire human race!

He made us accepted in the Beloved. Ephesians 1:6 NKJV

But the good news does not end there. What Jesus did for us He also wants to do through us.

Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin. Romans 6:4-6 NKJV

By baptism we die to self just like Jesus died to self. As Jesus was raised from the grave we are raised to a new life, and now Paul says that God,

raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus. Ephesians 2:6 NKJV

By baptism we confess our faith in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, and testify of our death to sin and of our purpose to walk in newness of life. Thus we acknowledge Christ as Lord and Savior, become His people, and are received as members by His church.

Baptism is a symbol of our union with Christ, the forgiveness of our sins, and our reception of the Holy Spirit. It is by immersion in water and is contingent on an affirmation of faith in Jesus and evidence of repentance of sin. It follows instruction in the Holy Scriptures and acceptance of their teachings.

Supporting Scripture:
Romans 6:1-6; Colossians 2:12, 13; Acts 16:30-33; Acts 22:16; 2:38; Matthew 28:19- 20.

The physical act of being baptized doesn't save a person (only Jesus saves), but that is not to say it's not important .... it is us affirming we have received Christ and will walk with Him in the newness of life.

It's a wonderful experience.

 

[HTacianas]

With out a doubt , WATER BAPTISM is a big divider among believers .

Matt 3:15 that Jesus was WATER BAPTIZED to Fulfill ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS !

Why did Jesus have to be BAPTIZED ??

What say you ??

dan p

Baptism is only "a big divider" amongst the followers of much later traditions. Christianity has always taught that through baptism we receive forgiveness of our previous sins.

 

[Guojing]

With out a doubt , WATER BAPTISM is a big divider among believers .

Matt 3:15 that Jesus was WATER BAPTIZED to Fulfill ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS !

Why did Jesus have to be BAPTIZED ??

What say you ??

dan p

Under the gospel of the kingdom preached to Israel only, water baptism is a requirement for salvation. Israel as a nation was commanded to accept Jesus as their Messiah and be ushered into their promised kingdom where Jesus will rule over them from David's throne in Jerusalem.

Then Israel will become a kingdom of priest, in order to be a priest, every Jew MUST be baptized (Exodus 19:4-6)

Once that happen, then every Jew will be responsible to spread the gospel to every Gentile nation under the Earth. There are a number of OT passages that talk about this prophetic timetable, the most beautiful to me is found in Zechariah 8

3 Thus saith the Lord; I am returned unto Zion, and will dwell in the midst of Jerusalem: and Jerusalem shall be called a city of truth; and the mountain of the Lord of hosts the holy mountain.

7 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; Behold, I will save my people from the east country, and from the west country;

8 And I will bring them, and they shall dwell in the midst of Jerusalem: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God, in truth and in righteousness.

20 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; It shall yet come to pass, that there shall come people, and the inhabitants of many cities:

21 And the inhabitants of one city shall go to another, saying, Let us go speedily to pray before the Lord, and to seek the Lord of hosts: I will go also.

22 Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the Lord of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the Lord.

23 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.
====

But as we can all see by Acts 7, Israel has rejected their King, they even stoned Stephen who was full of the Holy Spirit. When that happened, Jesus saved Saul and revealed to him a mystery, that because of Israel's rejection, all the Gentiles can now be saved without them (Romans 9 to Romans 11).

How does one get saved now? That is thru 1 Cor 15:1-4. Water baptism is no longer required for anything under this mystery grace dispensation.

 

[Dan Perez]

Under the gospel of the kingdom preached to Israel only, water baptism is a requirement for salvation. Israel as a nation was commanded to accept Jesus as their Messiah and be ushered into their promised kingdom where Jesus will rule over them from David's throne in Jerusalem.

Then Israel will become a kingdom of priest, in order to be a priest, every Jew MUST be baptized (Exodus 19:4-6)

Once that happen, then every Jew will be responsible to spread the gospel to every Gentile nation under the Earth. There are a number of OT passages that talk about this prophetic timetable, the most beautiful to me is found in Zechariah 8

3 Thus saith the Lord; I am returned unto Zion, and will dwell in the midst of Jerusalem: and Jerusalem shall be called a city of truth; and the mountain of the Lord of hosts the holy mountain.

7 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; Behold, I will save my people from the east country, and from the west country;

8 And I will bring them, and they shall dwell in the midst of Jerusalem: and they shall be my people, and I will be their God, in truth and in righteousness.

20 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; It shall yet come to pass, that there shall come people, and the inhabitants of many cities:

21 And the inhabitants of one city shall go to another, saying, Let us go speedily to pray before the Lord, and to seek the Lord of hosts: I will go also.

22 Yea, many people and strong nations shall come to seek the Lord of hosts in Jerusalem, and to pray before the Lord.

23 Thus saith the Lord of hosts; In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard that God is with you.
====

But as we can all see by Acts 7, Israel has rejected their King, they even stoned Stephen who was full of the Holy Spirit. When that happened, Jesus saved Saul and revealed to him a mystery, that because of Israel's rejection, all the Gentiles can now be saved without them (Romans 9 to Romans 11).

How does one get saved now? That is thru 1 Cor 15:1-4. Water baptism is no longer required for anything under this mystery grace dispensation.

Ex 19:6 and Rev 1:6 say the same , as Israel is a KINGDOM of Kings and Priest in the Kingdom of Heaven .

All Priest had to WASH their Hands and their FEET that they DIE NOT .or when they come to minister , to burn offering made by fire unto the Lord .

Christ had to be water baptize , as He was to be a HIGH PRIEST FOR EVER after the order of Melchisedec .

dan p

 

[Guojing]

Ex 19:6 and Rev 1:6 say the same , as Israel is a KINGDOM of Kings and Priest in the Kingdom of Heaven .

All Priest had to WASH their Hands and their FEET that they DIE NOT .or when they come to minister , to burn offering made by fire unto the Lord .

Christ had to be water baptize , as He was to be a HIGH PRIEST FOR EVER after the order of Melchisedec .

dan p

You are agreeing with my point?

 

[Dan Perez]

You are agreeing with my point?

I have to leave and will be back on Thursday and if you have a special verse , point it out to me and will comment on Thursday .

dan p

 

[Dan Perez]

You are agreeing with my point?

Are you referring to Zec 8:23 ?



dan p

 

[Guojing]

Are you referring to Zec 8:23 ?



dan p

Do you agree with the overall thesis of my post, that was my question.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Baptism is only "a big divider" amongst the followers of much later traditions. Christianity has always taught that through baptism we receive forgiveness of our previous sins.

How many sins is a baby forgiven of when it is baptized?

 

[HTacianas]

How many sins is a baby forgiven of when it is baptized?

In all likelihood none.

 

[bbbbbbb]

In all likelihood none.

Quite so. Thus, what purpose does baptism actually serve if it is not for the forgiveness of the past sins of a baby?

 

[HTacianas]

Quite so. Thus, what purpose does baptism actually serve if it is not for the forgiveness of the past sins of a baby?

As I said before, it imparts grace and brings a child into the Church. Christian parents bring their child to the priest for baptism and the child becomes a Christian. It's always been that way.

 

[bbbbbbb]

As I said before, it imparts grace and brings a child into the Church. Christian parents bring their child to the priest for baptism and the child becomes a Christian. It's always been that way.

In what sense does a baby become a Christian? Is his eternal destiny in heaven secured? Does he cease to be a sinner and thus a saint? Or does he just become another garden-variety sinner who can tick off the box for having been baptized?

 

[HTacianas]

In what sense does a baby become a Christian? Is his eternal destiny in heaven secured? Does he cease to be a sinner and thus a saint? Or does he just become another garden-variety sinner who can tick off the box for having been baptized?

The child becomes a Christian and his Christian parents raise him in the faith.

 

[bbbbbbb]

The child becomes a Christian and his Christian parents raise him in the faith.

What does that actually mean?

I have friends who are Bhuddists who were not taken to the temple when they were babies, but were raised as Bhuddists and self-identify as Bhuddists, but who, from all outward appearances, act in the very same way, and in some senses better, than Christians.

 

[HTacianas]

What does that actually mean?

I have friends who are Bhuddists who were not taken to the temple when they were babies, but were raised as Bhuddists and self-identify as Bhuddists, but who, from all outward appearances, act in the very same way, and in some senses better, than Christians.

The teachings of a person's personal conduct don't differ much between Buddhism and Christianity. Hinduism either for that matter. Buddhism comes from the examination of the conscience. And within that conscience is found the teachings and commandments of God. It's something that is universal among all people.

 

[bbbbbbb]

The teachings of a person's personal conduct don't differ much between Buddhism and Christianity. Hinduism either for that matter. Buddhism comes from the examination of the conscience. And within that conscience is found the teachings and commandments of God. It's something that is universal among all people.

You, as a Christian, might believe that, but Bhuddists, who do not believe in God in any sense that Christians do, will strongly dispute that idea. Would it help you to know that Bhuddists do not have any idea regarding resting one day out of seven or attending religious services at all as Christians do?

 

[HTacianas]

You, as a Christian, might believe that, but Bhuddists, who do not believe in God in any sense that Christians do, will strongly dispute that idea. Would it help you to know that Bhuddists do not have any idea regarding resting one day out of seven or attending religious services at all as Christians do?

I don't know that it would help me at all to know that. But I already did. The rules for gentiles are found in the laws of Noah. And those laws do not contain a sabbath day. The sabbath was given to the Israelites in Exodus.