Did Paul consider himself a "sinner", are we supposed to think of ourselves as sinners...?

[SBC]

I don't know if I really do sin against God now or not...? I may turn out to actually being obedient...? if it weren't for my won perspective on sin, who knows...?

A man who is NOT, conformed, forgiven, changed, with God......nothing he does glorifies God, even things observed by men that would be said, as "good"....and everything a man observes of such a man as "not good", is pointed out, as sin. He had a bad thought, awe, sin, sin, sin. He was mean to his neighbor, awe, sin, sin, sin. etc.

Why? It is all based on; He does not believe in God, and IS NOT, forgiven and changed By God. Thus everything he does, is sin, sin, sin!

So? Can a believer sin? Absolutely. Lots of people believe, WITHOUT committing and being forgiven or changed.

You can observe this every Sunday in a Church, filled with BELIEVERS, and watch, BELIEVERS, walk on down to the alter, and CONFESS to God, before witnesses.

And? Can a believer WHO has called on the Lords NAME, confessed, submitted, been forgiven, been changed By God, CONTINUE sinning, Sin any more? No.

WHY NOT?

Their body is dead IN CHRIST. It was forgiven of all sins, and cleansed of all unrighteousness, BY GOD then spiritually declared DEAD.

Can that spiritually DEAD body sin? No. It is declared washed, sanctified, and Kept in that condition, By Gods Power. It's are sins covered, remembered no more. It is dead. The dead body's can not sin, it is kept sanctified and anointed (holy), by Gods Power.

Can a soul that has been restored, sin? No. It is restored, by God, and kept restored, by Gods Power.

Can a spirit that has been born of Gods Seed, sin? No, it is born of Gods Holy pure Seed, and can not sin.

So now what about the PHYSICAL body, that remains ?

It can now do; one of two things.
It can now do works to Glorify God.
or
It can do works that DO NOT Glorify God.

The WORKS to Glorify God, are rewarded, as a good service TO God.
The WORKS that do not Glorify God, are opportunities lost to the man, to Glorify God.

Everything a man in his body does, shall be judged. The judgement is about his works.
Glorifying works to God, are rewarded.
Works that did not Glorify God are rewards not given the man....that is his punishment;
lost rewards for not glorifying God with works.

It is simple - A man can not be glorifying God and Not glorifying God at the same time.
It is simple - Men know themselves, which kind of works they do. Works that do not glorify God, will weigh heavy, and the man feel remorse, and try to be more attentive to doing what IS glorifying to God.

As well - Other men also born of God, may notice another man born of God, not doing works that are glorifying to God, and bring it to his attention. That is how one may edify another.

Jesus says edify in love.

Men however, like to dictate, accuse, humiliate, call names, make declarations, make charges (true or false), in a fashion, typically NOT well received by the other person.

And some men choose to give an oxymoron rendition of their belief -
Claiming to be born of God, while claiming they still commit sin.

And then they attempt to justify their position -

But what they ARE doing, IS, claiming God failed them, and lied.
Ya, ya, they will KEEP their belief they are saved and born again.
While, no, no, Christ's forgiveness, of ALL of their sins....didn't REALLY MEAN ALL -
how could He have meant ALL - they weren't done sinning yet!
And Christ's cleansing them from ALL of their unrighteousness....didn't REALLY MEAN ALL -
now could He have meant ALL - they weren't done sinning yet!

It is their ignorance. He did mean ALL. And what they now do, "that they want to announce, claim, and dwell on that they call sin".....is simply doing works that do not glorify God.

1 John 1
[9] If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Mark 3
[28] Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:

How does a man who has been forgiven of all sins, cleansed of all unrighteousness, born of God's Pure Seed, have the Spirit of God in Him..... thereafter sin?

What is TRUE? What men declare or what God has declared?

I stand in agreement with what God has declared.

1 John 3
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Matt 16
[27] For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

1 Corn 11
[15] Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Matt 5
[16] Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[SBC]

Yes absolutely. I wholeheartedly believe those verses. I am combating however the false doctrine that believers cannot sin or are sinless.

WHO has called themselves "SINLESS" ? QUOTE THEM!

You can't! Because those are your words.

WHO has said believers "CAN NOT SIN" ? QUOTE THEM!

You can't. Because those are you words.

Who has said, whosoever is born of God, CAN NOT SIN?

The Apostle John, who received his knowledge and understanding from Christ Jesus.
You think the Apostle John, taught a false doctrine?

1 John 3
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[SBC]

Ok let me see if I understand what you are saying. You are saying that you do sin,

No. I have said I was born in sin. I have sinned. I am forgiven all my sins and cleansed of unrighteousness, sanctified, anointed, dead with Christ, kept with Christ -

Now have the Seed of God. Now have the Spirit of God. Now I can sin no more.
I am not the same. I can not now sin. The Spirit of God, does not dwell in Sin.

but those sins have been forgiven already.

All my sins have been forgiven. Gods word is true. He doesn't wait to see. That is what men do....always waiting to see.

So if you tell a lie tomorrow (example only) that the sin has been already covered by Jesus.

You could call it a sin. However God says it is not.
It is my responsibility to focus on what is; And what is: is how I walk.
And how I walk reveals my works. And my works is what God judges me on.
The judgement of any "bad works" I do, are judged to not receive a reward from God.
Any "good works" I do, in MY NAME, I receive my reward from men.
Any "good works" I do, In Jesus' NAME, I shall receive a reward from God, because my "good words" done in Jesus' NAME, glorify God.

Pertaining to "my focus"; it is my job to "work" according to the thoughts of my heart.
And not "work" according to the thoughts of my mind.
That pertains to "spiritual things"...
and also CAN pertain to "natural things"... for example, helping another; without expectation or demand of anything in return; But doing so to glorify God....
and also have nothing to do with "natural things"....for example, deciding to; prepare peas for supper, work a logic problem, when to do the laundry, sketching landscapes;
etc.

I don't lie, cheat, steal, covet, sneak. I don't support and uplift what is against God.
I don't find speaking the truth prideful. Can I trespass against other men? Absolutely.
Do I try to intentionally? No. Is that a sin? No. It is a trespass against other men.
Is there a remedy for trespasses against other men? Absolutely. It is forgiveness between men, and reparations to amend.

Do I preach I continue to sin? And make God a liar? Absolutely not.

Have I got that right?

No.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[JLB777]

I personally believe - speaking Gods TRUTH, that a man, whose "spirit" HAS BEEN quickened BY GOD, that that "spirit", of the man, IS BORN OF GOD, and CAN NOT SIN.

Please post the scripture that's a born again man of God can not sin.


If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us. 1 John 1:8-10


JLB

 

[SBC]

Please post the scripture that's a born again man of God can not sin.

Actually what it says IS, "whosoever is born of God"...

1 John 3
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

And?
What is the relevance of you posting that to me?

9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Uh huh, I know. So, what is your point?

10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us. 1 John 1:8-10

And?
What is the relevance of you posting that to me?


God Bless,
SBC

 

[JLB777]

Actually what it says IS, "whosoever is born of God"...

1 John 3
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.




And?
What is the relevance of you posting that to me?




Uh huh, I know. So, what is your point?




And?
What is the relevance of you posting that to me?


God Bless,
SBC

The relevance is clear.

Born again Christians do in fact sin.

Those who confess their sins will be forgiven and cleansed of all unrighteousness.

Those who walk around "thinking" they have not sinned, and therefore never confess their sin, will be in for a shocking reality check on the Day of Judgement.

JLB

 

[HARK!]

Yes absolutely. I wholeheartedly believe those verses. I am combating however the false doctrine that believers cannot sin or are sinless.

I quoted from the CLV. The KJV paints a much more intense picture

1 John 3:9 King James Version (KJV) 9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

My knowledge of Greek isn't strong enough to proclaim which one of these two interpretations is more accurate; but I will say that one doesn't need to be a scholar of Greek to see that the CLV is very often more accurate than the KJV. I have yet to see one case where this doesn't hold true.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I quoted from the CLV. The KJV paints a much more intense picture

1 John 3:9 King James Version (KJV) 9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

My knowledge of Greek isn't strong enough to proclaim which one of these two interpretations is more accurate; but I will say that one doesn't need to be a scholar of Greek to see that the CLV is very often more accurate than the KJV. I have yet to see one case where this doesn't hold true.

The Greek here uses the word γεγεννημένος, used twice here in 1 John, and only two other places, in John 3:8 "born of the Spirit", and in Acts 22:3, "born in Tarsus".

Meyer's NT Commentary (1 John 3 Meyer's NT Commentary) seems to point toward language that indicates that the new man is meant here.

In this sense, perhaps, since being born of God and a new creation. That which is born of God, the new man, is indeed perfect for it is in Christ already--but we cannot say, therefore, that we are without sin; for the old man remains, thus if we say we are without sin we are liars; but that which is generated from God is perfect--and thus we see, perhaps, here the paradox of simul iustus et peccator as we also do in Romans 7.

And in St. Augustine's homily on the passage (CHURCH FATHERS: Homily 5 on First John (Augustine)) has him understanding it here that what is meant is not sin generally, but sin of a specific sort, namely the sin of not loving others. For Augustine the one born of God, therefore, loves; and the one who does not love shows himself to be apart from God, for the general context of this chapter concerns itself with the royal commandment of love.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[GenemZ]

.
Now I understand, you guys only believe your Declared to be Blameless, when it doesn't say that anywhere in the Bible.

You claim that you do not sin anymore.

I am not sure you even know what sins are. Can you name some sins you used to commit, but are no longer able to do since you are saved? Paul spoke openly about the sins he committed before he was saved.

 

[Neal of Zebulun]

"Did Paul Consider Himself a Sinner?"

The answer is yes, but only as an unwilling sinner.

He explains in Romans 7 that he is trying to obey the law of Yahweh, but he can't do it because he keeps unintentionally sinning. He even goes so far as to express the character of his own flesh as being separate from his inner self because he finds it so contemptible and opposed to what he wants to be, a sinless man.

In 1 Corinthians 15 he explains that all descendants of Adam suffer from this awful struggle with their natural bodies and that the fight against sin does not end until after the resurrection, when the saints receive their spiritual bodies.

He makes it clear in both chapters that the only way out of this mess is through Yahushua Christ, who is the Way to salvation which Yahweh has afforded for us, as detailed in the Holy Scriptures.

Praise Yahweh!

 

[SBC]

The relevance is clear.

Born again Christians do in fact sin.

Those who confess their sins will be forgiven and cleansed of all unrighteousness.

Those who walk around "thinking" they have not sinned, and therefore never confess their sin, will be in for a shocking reality check on the Day of Judgement.

JLB

Okay....Relevance clear. Your scriptures applied to yourself.

Born again Christians do in fact sin.

1 John 1
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Apostle John's facts, differ from your facts.

1 John 1
[1] That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

Some men are stubborn and stiffnecked.

1 Sam 15
[23] For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD,

Jer 17
[23] But they obeyed not, neither inclined their ear, but made their neck stiff, that they might not hear, nor receive instruction.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[JIMINZ]

but we cannot say, therefore, that we are without sin; for the old man remains,

.
This belief is the exact point of your misunderstanding.

You have a misconception that the Old Man Remains.

Gal. 5:24
And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Rom. 6:11
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

The Old Man is the Flesh, that is where sin resides in man, not in his fleshly body, but in his Human Nature, that is the flesh spoken of, not the physical flesh which covers our bones.

Rom. 8:3
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Rom. 8:10
And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Gal. 5:24
And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Rom. 6:6
Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Eph. 4:22

That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;

Col. 3:9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

Therefore Paul says.

Eph. 4:24
And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Col. 3:10
And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

 

[HARK!]

What Translation is the (CLV)?

Concordant Literal Version

 

[JIMINZ]

You claim that you do not sin anymore.

I am not sure you even know what sins are. Can you name some sins you used to commit, but are no longer able to do since you are saved? Paul spoke openly about the sins he committed before he was saved.

.
Well yes as a matter of fact I can, but seeing they have been Forgiven,
what is that to you, for forgiven sins are irrelevant to this conversation.

I am sure from the way you have expressed your beliefs, you do not know where it is you stand in Christ, nor do you understand how it is a Christian cannot sin, once they have been Born Again of God, for His seed remains in him, and he cannot sin because he is Born of God.

You have said you are a sinner, I therefore have to take you at your word.

Why is it you are so hostile towards those of us who profess, we have been Freed from Sin?

Are you of the belief.

You are not Dead to the Law?
You are not Dead to Sin?
You are not Dead to the Flesh?

However, if you are Dead to these as all Born Again Christians are,
How Do You Sin?

 

[HARK!]

I am curious as to why you quoted my post #21, are you of the belief the Definition of Sin is also a
non-sequitur?

Strawman argument...



sin
/sin/
noun

1. an immoral ACT considered to be a transgression against divine law:



sin·ner
/ˈsinər/
noun

1. a PERSON who transgresses against divine law by committing an immoral act or acts.



...Fact remains that there is a big difference between "sin" and a "sinner."

 

[SBC]

Sin is Standing Against God.
All men are born Standing Against God.
Thus, all men are born in sin.

No man by his own power, can Stand With God.
Thus men acting by their own power, sin, by Standing Against God.

A man has the ability to make choices.
A man can choose to hear about God, or not.
A man can choose to believe what he hears, or not.

IF a man chooses to believe, the Lord begins GIVING the man FAITH.
IF a man chooses to STOP believing, the man LOSES his FAITH.
IF a man LOSES his FAITH he remains in sin, Standing Against God.
IF a man remains Believing, the Lord INCREASES the mans FAITH.
IF a man chooses to SUBMIT to the Lord, the Lord EMPOWERS the man WITH THE LORDS POWER
FOR the man to forever Stand With God.

Men can argue and debate and accuse the topic of SIN.
However it appears men who ASK God for His FORGIVENESS,
Have no clue, what He has forgiven.

He has FORGIVEN a mans STANDING AGAINST HIM!

Further it appears men who ARE forgiven by God.
Have no clue, what He has given them.

He has GIVEN a man HIS POWER TO NEVER AGAIN STAND AGAINST HIM!
He has GIVEN a man HIS POWER for the man to FOREVER STAND WITH HIM.

Completely Amazing, that men argue, debate, dissect sin, categorize sin, compartmentalize sin, declare they continue to SIN, by identifying, something, they have concluded mindfully and "rationally" will be acceptable sin...

Announcing one SINS, regardless of the flowery words IS;
STANDING AGAINST GOD.

Amazing, men do not comprehend Gods forgiveness and His power.

1 John 3
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[JIMINZ]

Concordant Literal Version

.
Oh, Ok
Where is it you stand on the issue at hand?
Do you agree with the OP or not?

 

[SBC]

.
Oh, Ok
Where is it you stand on the issue at hand?
Do you agree with the OP or not?

Lip service and excuses!

God Bless,
SBC

 

[HARK!]

Oh, Ok
Where is it you stand on the issue at hand?
Do you agree with the OP or not?

I simply stand for truth.

The truth is that the OP simply presents a question.

How does one agree, or disagree, with a question?

 

[JIMINZ]

Strawman argument...
sin
/sin/
noun
1. an immoral ACT considered to be a transgression against divine law:
sin·ner
/ˈsinər/
noun
1. a PERSON who transgresses against divine law by committing an immoral act or acts.
...Fact remains that there is a big difference between "sin" and a "sinner."

.
I'm sorry you see the things written in the Bible as a Straw-man argument, and disagree with Scripture when it professes a truth.

But then again you take the definitions of words rather than what Scripture itself professes, and have used a secular dictionary to define the words found in the Bible.