Could this be the signing of the covenant?

Status
Not open for further replies.

sarahm12002

Active Member
Aug 4, 2004
270
14
41
✟481.00
Faith
Baptist
After you read the above article, take a look at this! Whether you believe in the rapture or not isn't what I'm getting at - but this is a good article about the EU from Rapture Alert.



The European Approach to Middle East Peace

by Michael G. Mickey

(10-12-04)

By the time I got home from work today, my mailbox had a number of e-mails referring me to a Haaretz story detailing Dr. Javier Solana's plan to unveil a possible European Union approach to the international Quartet's roadmap to peace on November 2, 2004. Why? Because a European approach to securing peace in the Middle East is precisely what I've been telling the readers of my website to be watching for.​

From day one of hearing about the Quartet, I've suspected the group, which consists of Russia, the European Union, the United States and the United Nations, could be the many of Daniel 9:27. In Daniel 9:27, we see the Antichrist - a man of Roman descent I believe will be a European Union leader - will confirm a seven-year covenant of peace between Israel and her enemies in cooperation with the many the Scripture makes reference to.​




Daniel 9:27: And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week:










Dr. Javier Solana -- the European Union's top diplomat -- isn't giving out any details concerning what his Middle East strategy proposals consist of, but is saying he will present them to EU foreign ministers when they meet on November 2, 2004. His plans will not, according to Solana, deviate from the road map, insuring the Quartet will remain intact under his plan.

"Nothing will take us away from the road map," Solana is quoted as saying in the article. "That is a fundamental matter."

An EU Observer article entitled 'EU to unveil plan to help Palestinian state' states Solana's EU peace plan is expected to focus on four areas:​
  • Security -- The EU is said to be considering a police mission on the ground. The use of peacekeeping forces, if this comes to pass, could be a way to confirm peace!
  • Facilitating elections
  • Economic development
  • Reforms
The Haaretz story stresses the European Union isn't going to accept anything short of a two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. If true, this will involve mankind taking away lands God has given the Jewish people and redistributing them to their enemies in the interest of peace -- a move which will plummet rebellious mankind into the Tribulation Period.

Psalms 2:1-4: Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing? The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, [saying], Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us. He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision. Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure.

God has only established the borders of one nation -- Israel! In spite of this, mankind, in all its wisdom, believes it can best govern in the affairs of man. How utterly foolish! The Antichrist's peace plan isn't going to bring peace to the Middle East for any significant period of time before it all goes wrong.

1st Thessalonians 5:3: For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

Because the final global empire which will rule the earth prior to the visible, physical, bodily return of Jesus Christ at the battle of Armageddon is rising to global prominence in the form of today's European Union, I'll be sitting on the edge of my seat waiting to see what will take place on November 2nd, whether my enthusiasm that the return of Jesus Christ could be very near is warranted or not.

Could a European approach to Middle East peace signal we're nearing the time of the Antichrist's rise or will this latest proposal be nothing other than another stab at peace which will only add to the legend of the Antichrist when he actually does arrive on the world's diplomatic stage in the future?

Because I've been expecting the EU to step into a leadership role in the Quartet's efforts to secure Middle East peace for some time, I know many of my readers are going to write and ask me to guess how long it'll be until the Rapture of the Church takes place. My answer to that question? I don't know! It could be today, tomorrow, five years from now, or twenty years from now. Do I believe it will be twenty years from now? Absolutely not, but I could be wrong. Only the Father knows the answer to that question.

No one knows precisely when the Lord is coming, but we can be certain He will come before the Antichrist's peace plan, whenever it may arrive, is confirmed or He will come simultaneously, as the peace plan of Antichrist is in the process of being confirmed. We know this because the Church is not appointed to God's wrath which will fall in abundance as soon as the Antichrist makes his move to grab global power and prestige through the securing of Middle East peace.

Recently, I heard one of my favorite Bible prophecy teachers (whose name I won't quote as my fear is I'm not going to do justice to his words) say something along the following lines, concerning us attempting to guess the timing of the Lord's return for us:

Don't waste your time trying to guess the time of the Lord's return.​

Be ready all the time as He could come anytime!​

That's great advice, especially at a time when the revived Roman empire - the European Union - may be about to take the lead in securing Middle East peace here in the end times, potentially opening the door for the prophesied Antichrist to make his move to global prominence.​

Be ready all the time as our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, could come anytime! What great advice!​
 
Upvote 0

NumberOneSon

The poster formerly known as Acts6:5
Mar 24, 2002
4,138
478
49
Pennsylvania
Visit site
✟22,170.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
sarahm12002 said:
From day one of hearing about the Quartet, I've suspected the group, which consists of Russia, the European Union, the United States and the United Nations, could be the many of Daniel 9:27. In Daniel 9:27, we see the Antichrist - a man of Roman descent I believe will be a European Union leader - will confirm a seven-year covenant of peace between Israel and her enemies in cooperation with the many the Scripture makes reference to.
I'm curious how you interpret the "seven-year covenant" part. Why do you think Israel or Palestine would sign a peace deal that had a built in expiration date? I can't think of any treaty in history that said in essence "let's make peace, but only for a few short years". I think the governing bodies in Israel or Palestine want a lasting peace, not one that ends at a predetermined time.

What's your take on this, Sara?

In Christ,

Acts6:5
 
Upvote 0

sarahm12002

Active Member
Aug 4, 2004
270
14
41
✟481.00
Faith
Baptist
Acts6:5 said:
I'm curious how you interpret the "seven-year covenant" part. Why do you think Israel or Palestine would sign a peace deal that had a built in expiration date? I can't think of any treaty in history that said in essence "let's make peace, but only for a limited time". How do you see it, Sara?

In Christ,

Acts6:5
Actually, I haven't studied the time length of the covenant very much, but I do believe that the tribulation will start at the time the covenant is signed. It will look like the AC can bring "peace" to the world for a short time - I haven't studied the tribulation much because I'm not going to be here.;) But I DO believe that the signing of the covenant will begin the trib, which means (for me) that the rapture is very soon!

What do you think?
 
Upvote 0

Dad Ernie

Well-Known Member
Nov 28, 2003
2,079
142
78
Salem, Oregon, USA
Visit site
✟2,980.00
Faith
Protestant
sarahm12002 said:
Daniel 9:27: And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week:
Greetings Sarahm,

You will be surprised to learn that the word "he" above refers to the Messiah in the previous verse. You may wish to investigate the use of pronouns and their antecedents used in English.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie
 
Upvote 0

Big Mouth Nana

Post Tribulationist
Sep 9, 2003
6,812
246
73
Bakersfield,California
Visit site
✟15,590.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
sarahm12002 said:
Actually, I haven't studied the time length of the covenant very much, but I do believe that the tribulation will start at the time the covenant is signed. It will look like the AC can bring "peace" to the world for a short time - I haven't studied the tribulation much because I'm not going to be here.;) But I DO believe that the signing of the covenant will begin the trib, which means (for me) that the rapture is very soon!

What do you think?
Dan 9:25-27 ~ Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 And he shall confirm the COVENANT with many for one week (7 Years): and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.
Dan 12:11 ~ And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the ABOMINATION THAT MAKETH DESOLATE set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. Tribulation/AC
 
Upvote 0

Big Mouth Nana

Post Tribulationist
Sep 9, 2003
6,812
246
73
Bakersfield,California
Visit site
✟15,590.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Dad Ernie said:
Greetings Sarahm,

You will be surprised to learn that the word "he" above refers to the Messiah in the previous verse. You may wish to investigate the use of pronouns and their antecedents used in English.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie
Hi DadErnie. How can the word "he" be referring to the Messiah, when it says in the preceeding verse, it says that Messiah is cut off, but not for Himself? Since He is cut off, He isn't making covenants here. This is the antichrist. He stops the daily sacrifices 3-1/2 years into the tribulation, not Jesus.
 
Upvote 0
I

In Christ Forever

Guest
Greetings Sarahm,
You will be surprised to learn that the word "he" above refers to the Messiah in the previous verse. You may wish to investigate the use of pronouns and their antecedents used in English.
Blessings,
Dad Ernie
Big Mouth Nana said:
Hi DadErnie. How can the word "he" be referring to the Messiah, when it says in the preceeding verse, it says that Messiah is cut off, but not for Himself? Since He is cut off, He isn't making covenants here. This is the antichrist. He stops the daily sacrifices 3-1/2 years into the tribulation, not Jesus.
It depends on your doctrine, beliefs and interpretation. Daniel is even complicated to me at times because all his different prophecies have to be harmonized with the rest of the bible. DE is right on his interpretation though. God bless.:preach:


http://www.awitness.org/lostmess/daniel.html
"You can experience the same jarring sensation by reading the false prophecies in chapter 9. An 'anointed prince' would be 'cut off' and then the end would come swiftly like a flood. You can well imagine the early church reading such prophecies, and feeling that the end was near at any moment. The evil prince who kills the Anointed one will enter into a 'seven year covenant' and wars and abominations were decreed, this being the end of the world after all. (By the way, if there was ever a time to consult every possible translation under the sun, it is when you are reading the 9th chapter of Daniel, which appears in an array of different wordings, depending on where you look. As I have noticed while comparing translations of different verses in the Bible, even the most literal translations can suddenly depart from literalism, perhaps visit the Greek Septuagint and abandon the Hebrew translation for a single verse, whenever some highly cherished doctrine might be threatened by a truly literal translation. Rule of thumb : you should never, ever rely exclusively on one single translation.) "

16 "And the ten horns which you saw on the beast, these will hate the harlot, make her desolate and naked, eat her flesh and burn her with fire. 17 "For God has put it into their hearts to fulfill His purpose, to be of one mind, and to give their kingdom to the beast, until the words of God are fulfilled. 18 "And the woman whom you saw is that great city which reigns over the kings of the earth."
 
Upvote 0

NumberOneSon

The poster formerly known as Acts6:5
Mar 24, 2002
4,138
478
49
Pennsylvania
Visit site
✟22,170.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Big Mouth Nana said:
Hi DadErnie. How can the word "he" be referring to the Messiah, when it says in the preceeding verse, it says that Messiah is cut off, but not for Himself?
Because that's how the passages are structured in the language in which they were originally written.

In Christ,

Acts6:5
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
I

In Christ Forever

Guest
Big Mouth Nana said:
Ya think? I don't.
Besides revelation, no other book in the bible is more difficult to interpret than the book of Daniel. Anyone that thinks they know what Daniel is representing can just go to this site and see why this scholar feels Daniel is a "false prophet". I wonder why he thinks that;) Even I haven't studied Daniel deeply yet and won't untill I translate the more "troubling" chapters and harmonize them.[may take a year or more though]. God bless.

http://www.awitness.org/lostmess/daniel.html

You can experience the same jarring sensation by reading the false prophecies in chapter 9. An 'anointed prince' would be 'cut off' and then the end would come swiftly like a flood. You can well imagine the early church reading such prophecies, and feeling that the end was near at any moment. The evil prince who kills the Anointed one will enter into a 'seven year covenant' and wars and abominations were decreed, this being the end of the world after all. (By the way, if there was ever a time to consult every possible translation under the sun, it is when you are reading the 9th chapter of Daniel, which appears in an array of different wordings, depending on where you look. As I have noticed while comparing translations of different verses in the Bible, even the most literal translations can suddenly depart from literalism, perhaps visit the Greek Septuagint and abandon the Hebrew translation for a single verse, whenever some highly cherished doctrine might be threatened by a truly literal translation. Rule of thumb : you should never, ever rely exclusively on one single translation.)
 
Upvote 0

Big Mouth Nana

Post Tribulationist
Sep 9, 2003
6,812
246
73
Bakersfield,California
Visit site
✟15,590.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
In Christ Forever said:
Anyone that thinks they know what Daniel is representing can just go to this site and see why this scholar feels Daniel is a "false prophet".
I won't bother going to this site, knowing that this guy thinks that Daniel is a false prophet. He sounds like a nut to me, and I wouldn't give him the title of scholar for thinking this.
 
Upvote 0

sarahm12002

Active Member
Aug 4, 2004
270
14
41
✟481.00
Faith
Baptist
Big Mouth Nana said:
I won't bother going to this site, knowing that this guy thinks that Daniel is a false prophet. He sounds like a nut to me, and I wouldn't give him the title of scholar for thinking this.
Yeah, I don't think I want to waste my time reading that kind of junk.:D

BTW, ICF - I don't think that Daniel IS the most difficult book to translate!;)
 
Upvote 0
I

In Christ Forever

Guest
sarahm12002 said:
Yeah, I don't think I want to waste my time reading that kind of junk.:D

BTW, ICF - I don't think that Daniel IS the most difficult book to translate!;)
Hmmm. I will be translating anyway when I start deeply studying it. John Calvin appears to know the hebrew very well, but I will be using Hebrew bible study sites also.
http://www.ccel.org/c/calvin/comment3/comm_index.htm
If Daniel isn't difficult, then why are there so many different interpretations of it? This person brings out some excellent points in Daniel. I know he is wrong and Daniel is indeed a True Prophet and inspired. Maybe the churches need to get together and study that book a little more deeply for the TRUTH in it:cool: . God bless.:preach:

QUOTE===="You see if you read Daniel's prophecy it states that 'an anointed prince' would be swept away and then the one who killed him would 'enter a seven year covenant' and practice all sorts of abominations, and, as it states in an even more jarring and incongruous fashion, 'the end of the world would come swiftly like a flood.' All this is rather 'jarring' to read, and does leave a person scratching their heads, wondering what is wrong with this picture. A doctrine of the 'revived Roman empire' was then concocted, and at the time this happens, the clock will start ticking again and that last bit of prophecy will finally be fulfilled. This might explain chapter nine, if you choose to accept such nimble interpretation, but another excuse would have to be cooked up for chapters 10 to 12, for it is self evident that in this source (written in the second century in response to Antiochus IV) the world did not end immediately after Antiochus despoiled Jerusalem and the temple, Michael was not outraged enough to promptly end the world. This 'clock' must have 'stopped ticking' as well, awaiting the awakening and the rise of the 'revived Selucid Greek empire' at which time it will finally be fulfilled. This would, of course, require ending the world twice (once to Revive the Romans and thus salvage chapter 9, and a second go at it to revive the Greeks and salvage chapter 12. Whether or not we can all tolerate suffering through two ends of the world is a good question, but this would be required to salvage the doctrine of 'Biblical inerrancy.'
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Screamin'Eagle

Fighting communism...one mermaid at a time.
Jul 4, 2004
13,811
138
37
✟29,765.00
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
OhhJim said:
Daniel 8 says that the AC will come from Alexander's Empire. Rome was not part of that empire, nor was Spain, where Solana is from.


i cant imagine the united states letting someone not from our country rule our country...heh, thats what makes me think the united states will be one of the countries to fight back and lose. OR im probobly wrong...its just americans have alot of pride :)
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Andy D

Andy D
Jun 4, 2004
537
15
Melbourne
✟8,303.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Single
Big Mouth Nana said:
Hi DadErnie. How can the word "he" be referring to the Messiah, when it says in the preceeding verse, it says that Messiah is cut off, but not for Himself? Since He is cut off, He isn't making covenants here. This is the antichrist. He stops the daily sacrifices 3-1/2 years into the tribulation, not Jesus.
I see ti this way too although I have heard the other theories put forward
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.