Cordoba Initiative FAQ

[leftjohn]

Yes, I know what an axiom is, do you?

If you are saying they could have defeated the Romans goes without saying, then why did Jesus say anything at all about perishing by the sword if it is drawn? What was His point?

 

[Auburn88]

Yes, I know what an axiom is, do you?

Yep.

If you are saying they could have defeated the Romans goes without saying, then why did Jesus say anything at all about perishing by the sword if it is drawn? What was His point?

I already answered this one.

 

[leftjohn]

Answered it how?????


Was the “idiot, these guys will kill you” your answer? I thought you said that Jesus could have protected them? Where was the axiom you referred to? Are you saying he obviously would not have protected them and would have let them perish?


Or are you saying that He obviously would have protected them? If He would have protected them, why did He talk about perishing by the sword if it is drawn?

 

[Auburn88]

Answered it how?????

Was the “idiot, these guys will kill you” your answer? I thought you said that Jesus could have protected them?

That Jesus can do something doesn't mean that it's normative for Jesus to do something, or that it is within God's will to do that thing.

For instance, I could jump off the Delaware Memorial Bridge and Jesus could send angels to catch me, but the Bible also says that we are not to test God and that we're not exempt from the consequences of our actions just because we're Christians.

Remember, when the Jews thought that Jesus would be a military leader, He told them that His kingdom isn't of this world and that if it were, His followers would be under orders to fight for Him. So Jesus' purpose is not to defeat the Romans, but to defeat sin by dying on the cross.

Where was the axiom?

The axiom is that when people practice violence, they are met with violence.

Are you saying he obviously would not have protected them and would have let them perish?

Or are you saying that He obviously would have protected them? If He would have protected them, why did He talk about perishing by the sword if it is drawn?

See above.

 

[leftjohn]

"The axiom is that when people practice violence, they are met with violence."

My point exactly!!!

Now, how do you feel about bringing a gun to church?

 

[Auburn88]

"The axiom is that when people practice violence, they are met with violence."

My point exactly!!!

Now, how do you feel about bringing a gun to church?

I feel pretty good about it, actually. But, of course, the mere act of having a gun is not violent.

 

[leftjohn]

Why would you have a gun if you never planned on shooting it?

 

[kiwimac]

Are you ever going to reply to my points?

 

[Yarddog]

I feel pretty good about it, actually. But, of course, the mere act of having a gun is not violent.

I agree that the act of having a gun is not violent but it does make a statement about the person.

Why would a person need a gun in Church? Not one in your vehicle or at home, but in Church?

What statement are you making to Jesus Christ by carrying a gun into Church?

 

[Auburn88]

Why would you have a gun if you never planned on shooting it?

Why would you wear seatbelts if you don't plan on getting into a wreck?

Who says I never planned on shooting it. I shoot it all the time.

But, in any event, your point is moot, since the mere act of carrying a weapon is not violent.

 

[Auburn88]

Why would a person need a gun in Church? Not one in your vehicle or at home, but in Church?

Because the church door is not a magical barrier that keeps danger out. There have been a number of church shootings in the last couple of years.

What statement are you making to Jesus Christ by carrying a gun into Church?

None.

 

[leftjohn]

If you are not willing to shoot a gun, no need to have the gun. If you are willing to shoot a gun in church, you are inviting violence into God's house. I am absolutely amazed that any Christian could feel "pretty good" about doing that.

 

[Auburn88]

If you are not willing to shoot a gun, no need to have the gun.

Again, who said that I'm not willing to shoot it? Like I said, I shoot it all the time.

If you are willing to shoot a gun in church, you are inviting violence into God's house.

How so? Are you telling me that there's somebody out there who says, "Boy, I sure would like to get shot in the chest. Hey, I hear there are a couple of guys over at Georgetown Baptist who carry guns! Maybe I should ride over there and attack somebody!"

 

[leftjohn]

Are you telling me that you don't believe God can provide all the protection you need in HIS HOUSE!!!

Are you saying that He is so week, you need the ability to shoot someone in HIS HOUSE????

 

[Auburn88]

Are you telling me that you don't believe God can provide all the protection you need in HIS HOUSE!!!

Of course I do. I just happen to believe that God uses men to do so.

 

[leftjohn]

God wasn’t going to use man in the garden when Peter drew his sword, but He will use you and your pistol in His house to have a shootout. Incredible.

Jesus says put away the sword because those that draw the sword will die by the sword, and you still see nothing wrong with bringing a weapon into the Lord’s house. That amazes me.

 

[Yarddog]

Because the church door is not a magical barrier that keeps danger out. There have been a number of church shootings in the last couple of years.

You are so scared of a couple of shootings in Churches, across the US, that you feel the need to bring a gun into worship service with you?

None.

You may not recognize it, but you are. What that is, we may eventually find out.

I am not one who is against gun ownership. They can be necessary, in a few cases in the US, but that is rare. Usually, there is a psychological reason why a person feels impelled to carry a gun.

 

[leftjohn]

Adding when I said I wouldn’t
Saying you getting it when you don’t
We both look ridiculous at this point

 

[Yarddog]

Nope. Not scared at all.

Then why do you feel the need to carry a gun into Church because of Church shooting, which are considerably rare.

Are you so scared of car crashes that you feel the need to wear a seatbelt?

I am not concerned about car crashes but it is the law, here, and we are required to where seat belts. Car crashes, too, are quite rare even though the possibility that they may occur are 100's of times more likely than church shootings. Which brings us back to why one would feel the need to protect themselves in Church as you have implied.

Yeah, it's called self defense.

Sometimes, but most of the time it is not really about self defense. It may be because of an inordinate fear that one needs protection, which your answer in the prior post denotes. In that case it is the fear that is the reason not the protection. It may be the power which comes from carrying a gun which reveals an insecurity issue. We see this in a "cop want to be" or the macho type. It may be a protest issue, etc..

There are other reasons as well, such as a requirement by an employer, or something else which doesn't reveal an underlying psychological problem.

We may find what causes you to do this if we continue.

 

[Yarddog]

I've explained this a couple dozen times now. Most people will never be in a car crash and yet, they wear seatbelts. Most people's homes will never burn down and yet, they have smoke detectors. Most people will never face serious illnesses or injuries and yet, they have medical insurance...

None of the items that you mention equate to carrying a gun into a place of worship. You were the one who said that you took it into a place of worship because of Church shootings. This may be a case of a phobia caused by operant conditioning. This can be seen in many conservatives and is noticeably more frequent the more conservative the personality.is.

If you notice you try to validate your phobia by comparing it to events which occur much more frequently and are a major cause of household financial problems. People who fail to have insurance are hit by great losses when accidents occur, or they have a house fire or health issues.

You say that most people never face serious illness, yet the frequency may be thousands of times greater than a Church shooting.

A person protecting themselves from the items you mention are not considered to be a phobia unless the fear of one of those items causes them to act against the extreme norm, while carrying a gun into a place of worship is considered acting against the extreme norm.

Less than one half of one percent of Americans would carry a gun to Church.

Because the doors to our church are not magic barriers that keep danger outside.

Have you asked your Church to lock the doors during service?

Childish personal attack duly noted.

What is childish about a Christian caring enough for another Christian? I am trying to help you find out why you have a need to fear something which very rarely occurs.

Or you could just read my posts and see the explanation I've already given.

Your explanations show that there is deep seeded psychological issue at hand which we can help you with. But you need to let us help. If you look within yourself, you can find a way to release your fear.