Contraception is moral

[Speedwell]

Well there have been people assuming the anti abortionists would punish the woman including the death penalty for having an abortion. That is extreme and baseless for most anti abortionists.

with all due respect, I think you are underestimating their number and influence.

 

[VirOptimus]

Seems like you really don't care what others believe, you have decided that you are right so the opposition must be wrong and anti women.

Pretty much, and I have never seen any argument convincing me that thats not the truth.

 

[VirOptimus]

I am not at all dismissing the oppression of women. I am simply saying that there are reasons to be anti abortion that have nothing to do with oppressing women. They want to paint the opposition as extreme so they can just dismiss us.

I havent seen any such reasons.

And it always ends up as women opression when abortion rights are hindered.

 

[Astrid]

Pretty much, and I have never seen any argument convincing me that thats not the truth.

I am not anti woman. Not an argument, a fact.

 

[VirOptimus]

I am not anti woman. Not an argument, a fact.

So you say.

 

[Astrid]

So you say.

I don't do self loathing

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Nonetheless the stereotypes are there.

And they are stereotypes.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

I havent seen any such reasons.

And it always ends up as women opression when abortion rights are hindered.

There is a difference between having a goal of oppressing women and what you perceive as oppression because abortion is limited. I assume you believe that any abortion restriction oppresses women. I believe unrestricted abortion oppresses the unborn.

 

[VirOptimus]

There is a difference between having a goal of oppressing women and what you perceive as oppression because abortion is limited. I assume you believe that any abortion restriction oppresses women. I believe unrestricted abortion oppresses the unborn.

You can belive whatever you want, doesnt make it worth considering.

Dont like abortions, dont have one. But dont force women to live by your rules.

 

[Astrid]

There is a difference between having a goal of oppressing women and what you perceive as oppression because abortion is limited. I assume you believe that any abortion restriction oppresses women. I believe unrestricted abortion oppresses the unborn.

"Kills".

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

with all due respect, I think you are underestimating their number and influence.

If they have all this influence why are abortion restrictions being overturned by the courts in conservative states such as Louisiana and Texas? I acknowledge they are out there, but they have not had enough influence to come close to abolishing abortion in this country for the last 50years. But maybe you are right.

 

[Speedwell]

If they have all this influence why are abortion restrictions being overturned by the courts in conservative states such as Louisiana and Texas? I acknowledge they are out there, but they have not had enough influence to come close to abolishing abortion in this country for the last 50years. But maybe you are right.

They are being overturned by the courts because they are unconstitutional, not because only a few people support them.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

You can belive whatever you want, doesnt make it worth considering.

Dont like abortions, dont have one. But dont force women to live by your rules.

Where have I said I would force women to live by my rules? I am for doing whatever we can to reduce abortions but I am not convinced making it illegal is the best way to do that.

 

[Speedwell]

"Kills".

Not always. It is against the law to destroy a viable fetus, which means that abortion from at least late in the second trimester does not kill.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

They are being overturned by the courts because they are unconstitutional, not because only a few people support them.

I agree. So why are you concerned they will get their way?

 

[VirOptimus]

Where have I said I would force women to live by my rules? I am for doing whatever we can to reduce abortions but I am not convinced making it illegal is the best way to do that.

No, you are arguing for restricting womens rights.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

No, you are arguing for restricting womens rights.

And you are talking about restricting the rights of the unborn. You don't have any idea of what my thoughts are about the issue. You are assuming many things.

 

[Speedwell]

I agree. So why are you concerned they will get their way?

I'm not concerned that they will get their way. I'm concerned that they taint opposition to abortion with religious bigotry. Look at the pushback you are experiencing in this very thread as a non-religious opponent to abortion.

 

[VirOptimus]

And you are talking about restricting the rights of the unborn. You don't have any idea of what my thoughts are about the issue. You are assuming many things.

I can only argue what you post and my points stand.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

I'm not concerned that they will get their way. I'm concerned that they taint opposition to abortion with religious bigotry. Look at the pushback you are experiencing in this very thread as a non-religious opponent to abortion.

This is a good point.