Conservative Supreme Court Justice transcript lied, then corrected itself.

[FireDragon76]

I would compare this to Justice Sotomayor suggesting that 100,000 children are in serious condition. Except Sotomayor's comment is deemed a lie. If her's is a lie, so is this. I know all about the flu. I have posted multiple times here in the past on the subject. Flu deaths are catagorized and recorded as Influenza/Pneumonia. Most people do not die from the flu, but rather from the complications from the flu, which is Pneumonia. You really think he was talking globally? really?

Pneumonia is not a disease with a specific etiology, it can be caused by both bacteria and viruses, including influenza, as well as chemical exposure.

 

[Subduction Zone]

He must listen to the same right-wing influencers my dad does, who says the same sort of nonsense.

In all fairness it appears that the "hundreds of thousands" quote was in error. If you listen to the transcript it sounds like he did say "hundreds, thousands".

 

[disciple Clint]

Please read my post again carefully. The point I was making was that the article that was linked in the opening post was changed to say the article was wrong when originally saying Gorsuch said "hundreds of thousands" when he actually said "hundreds, thousands". Neither I nor the article said anything to defend the "hundreds of thousands" claim, rather the point was that it seems Gorsuch didn't say that to begin with.

there are people who are so unwilling to accept facts that do not support their view that nothing will satisfy them. They will ignore any facts and even call them lies just because they cannot accept the truth.

 

[JustOneWay]

We are privy to the audio. The Supreme Court has audio of the oral arguments on their website. The audio for the case in question is available right here:
https://www.supremecourt.gov/oral_arguments/audio/2021/21A244

Gorsuch gives his statement about 1:51:50 in.

Well done, good job. Yes the Supreme Court Justice did in fact not lie, and a faulty transcript was to blame. This is a perfect example of why we should hold back for such accusations before hitting the attack button.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Okay, I listened. It sounded like "hundreds, thousands". So it appears that the premise of the thread is incorrect.

In all fairness it appears that the "hundreds of thousands" quote was in error. If you listen to the transcript it sounds like he did say "hundreds, thousands".

I have neither a dog in the fight nor any particular animus against Justice Gorsuch, but I listened to the audio and I'm calling shenanigans on this transcript update. Absent any other context, the audio alone is ambiguous at best, but the conversation in which Gorsuch was engaging was about why COVID is a special case that justifies OSHA's mandating a vaccine when it doesn't for other diseases. The litigant claims that what makes COVID special is the "unprecedented" magnitude of the risk it poses and Gorsuch pushes back by giving examples of polio and flu, which are also serious and large in magnitude, but for which vaccines aren't mandated. It's in this pushback that Gorsuch says passage in dispute. In the context of the exchange, the supposed correction of "hundreds, thousands" doesn't make any sense. A disease that kills only hundreds or maybe thousands of people a year would be a silly example to bolster his point.

 

[JustOneWay]

I have neither a dog in the fight nor any particular animus against Justice Gorsuch, but I listened to the audio and I'm calling shenanigans on this transcript update. Absent any other context, the audio alone is ambiguous at best, but the conversation in which Gorsuch was engaging was about why COVID is a special case that justifies OSHA's mandating a vaccine when it doesn't for other diseases. The litigant claims that what makes COVID special is the "unprecedented" magnitude of the risk it poses and Gorsuch pushes back by giving examples of polio and flu, which are also serious and large in magnitude, but for which vaccines aren't mandated. It's in this pushback that Gorsuch says passage in dispute. In the context of the exchange, the supposed correction of "hundreds, thousands" doesn't make any sense. A disease that kills only hundreds or maybe thousands of people a year would be a silly example to bolster his point.

I believe he corrected himself from hundreds to thousands, but your comment has validity considering Covid has killed hundreds of thousands where flu/pneumonia has killed just thousands

 

[FireDragon76]

Gorsuch's argument is the same that denialists on the Right all make about COVID-19. And it's factually wrong.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I have neither a dog in the fight nor any particular animus against Justice Gorsuch, but I listened to the audio and I'm calling shenanigans on this transcript update. Absent any other context, the audio alone is ambiguous at best, but the conversation in which Gorsuch was engaging was about why COVID is a special case that justifies OSHA's mandating a vaccine when it doesn't for other diseases. The litigant claims that what makes COVID special is the "unprecedented" magnitude of the risk it poses and Gorsuch pushes back by giving examples of polio and flu, which are also serious and large in magnitude, but for which vaccines aren't mandated. It's in this pushback that Gorsuch says passage in dispute. In the context of the exchange, the supposed correction of "hundreds, thousands" doesn't make any sense. A disease that kills only hundreds or maybe thousands of people a year would be a silly example to bolster his point.

I will agree that it was a poor argument on Gorsuch's part. But I do think that he honestly said the phrase with a comma, rather than with an "of". He was wrong either way. There were 800,000 deaths in a year compared to an average of around 30,000 making Covid19 just a wee bit more serious.

 

[iluvatar5150]

I believe he corrected himself from hundreds to thousands, but your comment has validity considering Covid has killed hundreds of thousands where flu/pneumonia has killed just thousands

I will agree that it was a poor argument on Gorsuch's part. But I do think that he honestly said the phrase with a comma, rather than with an "of". He was wrong either way. There were 800,000 deaths in a year compared to an average of around 30,000 making Covid19 just a wee bit more serious.

Yeah, either way it's screwy. If he meant to say "hundreds of thousands," then at least his argument makes sense, even if his data is wrong by a factor of ~10. But if he meant to say "thousands," then his data is still wrong by a factor of ~10, but in the direction that undermines his argument, which now doesn't make much sense.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yeah, either way it's screwy. If he meant to say "hundreds of thousands," then at least his argument makes sense, even if his data is wrong by a factor of ~10. But if he meant to say "thousands," then his data is still wrong by a factor of ~10, but in the direction that undermines his argument, which now doesn't make much sense.

True. it was a poor argument no matter how one cuts it. I was merely correcting what the claim about his number.

And as a Supreme Court justice he has to know that there were laws and mandates that passed Supreme Court scrutiny back during the Spanish Flu. OSHA of course did not exist at that time, but that does not mean that other agencies did not try to mandate behavior.