Christian morals

[Montalban]

No, I just learned that humans are not trustworthy, and they prove it to me everyday.

I'd like to believe that but I don't trust you

 

[Catherineanne]

I can't see the word submit. I guess that what they teach you in British new-age liberal churches

I don't attend a new age anything. I am very much traditional Anglo Catholic, and what I am saying is completely in line with traditonal Anglo Catholicism. Husbands and wives submit to one another, and love one another.

Sounds very similar to what Muslims say.

Good for them.

 

[Catherineanne]

I thought the holy spirit would make him a very good Christian especially that he's a saint. Where was the holy spirit when that saint murdered people?

Paul was not a Christian when he took part in the persecution of the Christians in Jerusalem. Any deaths carried out under that persecution were not carried out by Paul, and would be more in the line of state executions than murder. After he became a Christian he didn't persecute anyone.

God does not prevent any of us from doing evil things; we have free choice. Anyone in Christ will hopefully understand that evil is no longer a valid option for us, and if we inadvertantly go astray, we have to immediately return to the cross, and repent.

 

[razeontherock]

Again, this thread is about Christian morality, it is not about faith vs work.

Again, you cannot separate the two, which is why I asked you to explain what your understanding of the Sabbath is.

 

[razeontherock]

It seems like these Christ-like are actually infallible, since the holy spirit changes their wants. What if one of them suddenly wanted to walk naked in public? The holy spirit won't allow them to have such thoughts? Infallible.

What you described is someone with a switch on the back of their head so that at a certain point, that switch gets flipped and we no longer sin. Since you raised Constantine, it was common in his time to view this "time" as when you got Baptized. Christianity becomes VERY easy to understand if you look at it so simply that before Baptism = sinner, at Baptism = forgiveness of past sins, and after Baptism = no longer sin. Constantine certainly wished this were true, which is why he waited until as close to his death as possible to get Baptized, did you know that?

This approach is filled with problems, not the least of which is none of us have any such switch on the back of our head. Many of us Christians object to Constantine being heralded as a Saint, but I also understand that at the time it would've been difficult / impossible to object. Still, that doesn't mean he "held to his Paganism" or however you put it. Again, it's not quite as simple as all that.

 

[Catherineanne]

It seems like these Christ-like are actually infallible, since the holy spirit changes their wants. What if one of them suddenly wanted to walk naked in public? The holy spirit won't allow them to have such thoughts? Infallible.

If we truly allowed the Spirit to rule our hearts and minds to the same extent as it did in Christ himself, no doubt we could be infallible. However, that is not possible, because we remain human and therefore prone to making mistakes, and even to sinning.

It is not necessarily a sin to walk naked in public; that would depend on where you were and why you were doing it. But certainly the Holy Spirit is part of the reason why most Christians will try to reflect their faith in the way they dress and behave. No Christian can ever claim to be infallible all of the time, however. Most of us might have flashes of being right some of the time, but nowhere near as right as Christ himself was.

The Holy Spirit does not take away free will.

 

[Catherineanne]

Again, this thread is about Christian morality, it is not about faith vs work.

Morality is related to faith and work; they cannot be separated. Look again:

There is no amount of morality or good works that is sufficient in the Christian faith to achieve our own salvation. Our best good work is pretty well rubbish to God, compared with his own perfection. Therefore, the only way our salvation can be effected is if he reaches to us, rather than us trying to reach him.

 

[drich0150]

Morals are like norms, a set of beliefs on what is right and what is wrong.

Does one have to act on said beliefs in order for them to truly believe?

 

[Mahammad]

I don't attend a new age anything. I am very much traditional Anglo Catholic, and what I am saying is completely in line with traditonal Anglo Catholicism.


Husbands and wives submit to one another, and love one another.

I wonder why you didn't say the NT, hmmm.

 

[Catherineanne]

I wonder why you didn't say the NT, hmmm.

I am not sure what you mean. Anglo Catholicism is grounded in Scripture, Reason and Tradition. All three. The NT comes in under Scripture.

You accused me of being a liberal, and I told you that I am Anglo Catholic, for the simple reason that Anglo Catholics are among the least liberal of all Anglicans. I happen to be on the liberal side of Anglo Catholicism, but that is still very liturgically and theologically conservative.

 

[Mahammad]

Paul was not a Christian when he took part in the persecution of the Christians in Jerusalem. Any deaths carried out under that persecution were not carried out by Paul, and would be more in the line of state executions than murder. After he became a Christian he didn't persecute anyone.

God does not prevent any of us from doing evil things; we have free choice. Anyone in Christ will hopefully understand that evil is no longer a valid option for us, and if we inadvertantly go astray, we have to immediately return to the cross, and repent.

I wasn't talking about Paul, I was talking about that emperosaint, he was no different than any self proclaimed "the great".

 

[Catherineanne]

I wasn't talking about Paul, I was talking about that emperosaint, he was no different than any self proclaimed "the great".

You meant Constantine? I have already commented on him. I don't think I have anything else to add.

 

[Mahammad]

Constantine certainly wished this were true, which is why he waited until as close to his death as possible to get Baptized, did you know that?

Isn't that what hypocrites do? Reminds me of pharoah who repented in the sea.

 

[Mahammad]

I am not sure what you mean. Anglo Catholicism is grounded in Scripture, Reason and Tradition. All three. The NT comes in under Scripture.

You accused me of being a liberal, and I told you that I am Anglo Catholic, for the simple reason that Anglo Catholics are among the least liberal of all Anglicans. I happen to be on the liberal side of Anglo Catholicism, but that is still very liturgically and theologically conservative.

How is it an accusation when you say it yourself?

Are you a conservative or a liberal "conservative"?

 

[Mahammad]

You meant Constantine? I have already commented on him. I don't think I have anything else to add.

You forgot to tell me where was the holy spirit when Constantine The Great was murdering people? I thought the holy spirit is the source of morals, and with faith in Jesus you get morals. He was a saint, he must had a lot of faith.

 

[drich0150]

So no love for me? or did you simply over look my little post?

 

[Mahammad]

So no love for me? or did you simply over look my little post?

Oh, sorry I must missed it. I'll check it and replay. ;p

 

[Mahammad]

Does one have to act on said beliefs in order for them to truly believe?

Sometimes if they are good believers. For example would a good Christian ignore helping a falling elder on the ground because he has accepted christ as his Savior and works is not important to him?

 

[Mahammad]

Morality is related to faith and work; they cannot be separated. Look again:

If you wanna discuss faith, it should be related to the topic( faith being a/the source of morals) not the off-topic(faith is important and work is not)

 

[Catherineanne]

Isn't that what hypocrites do? Reminds me of pharoah who repented in the sea.

You have a habit of making very negative comments about what you do not understand. Can you ask questions without the snide remarks, do you think?

It was a very common practice for the early church for people to delay baptism until late in life, because they believed that after baptism it was important never to sin. If they did happen to sin, they thought that their salvation would be lost, and because nobody can be re-baptised, they would be damned. The problem was, of course, if they died suddenly without being baptised, that was just as bad.

The church eventually realised that we can repent of sin, even after baptism, and that our salvation is not lost. Because of this, far more people were happy to be baptised into the faith at an earlier stage.