Christ erased away the condemnation of the laws!

[Hishandmaiden]

In this passage, I learnt that Christ's death on the cross had erased away the law's condemnation of us, Christians.


Here is the passage that supports this:


John 8: 10-11


"Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?"


"No one, sir," she said.


In this instance, the accusers of the woman had disappeared. They used to be there, accusing her, condemning her. But thanks to what Jesus done on the cross, these accusers were erased away.


The woman is no longer accused. Christ had taken away all the accusations. What a wonderful victory Christ had given us through His death on the cross.


Here is another passage that supports this:


John 8:5


"In the law Moses commanded us to stone such woman. NOW what do you say?"


Notice the difference between the old covenant and new covenant. In the old covenant, the sinner is condemned to be stoned to death. In the new covenant, it all depends on Jesus and what Jesus says. And Jesus says what He want to say when He died on the cross for us.


Praise be to God! We are set free from our sins!

 

[Faulty]

If you think that's good, I'll tell you that it's just a topping on the sundae. Slowly read through the entire book of Romans every day for a month and I promise you will not be disappointed.

 

[zaksmummy]

If you want to understand what was going on in this story you need to understand the Jewish culture.

Jesus could not sentence the woman to death, only the Sanhedrin could do that, and at this time period only a Roman court could do it. So really the only reason Jesus was asked about it was because they wanted to see what his answer would be.

If the Sanhedrin had had its powers, the chances of the woman dying would have been negliagible as the Rabbis of Jesus' time deemed that a court who put anyone to death was itself murderous.

As for the "new" covenant verse "old" covenant stuff, the covenants build up upon each other, a newer covenant does not cancel out an older covenant, and Gods covenants are eternal.

We are all saved through faith, just like our Father Abraham, whether that is as physical descendants or spiritual descendants, no one come to God ecept through faith in Messiah, this covenant was made with Abraham. This is one of the oldest covenants.

 

[ai3theanswer]

zaksmummy you seem to view Jesus in this story as just another man not God in the flesh. Remember the book of John represents Jesus as eternal Lord without beginning.
I do not consider myself a theologian at all but I remember what Jesus said when he said "if you have seen Me you have seen the Father", so if Jesus didn't condemn her then no power on earth could have condemned her.

To say that "As for the "new" covenant verse "old" covenant stuff, the covenants build up upon each other, a newer covenant does not cancel out an older covenant, and Gods covenants are eternal." means you don't understand the new covenant at all. God said He blotted out the hand writing that was against us. The hand writing was the law, so if God blotted it out means that they were not built up on each other. Remember God's covenants are eternal unless something significant happens like Jesus going to cross and canceling a lesser covenant to give us the greater. Only God can blot out His own hand writing.

It says in Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
8:13- In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Just like if you buy a new pair of sneakers, you don't put them on over your old ones, you toss the old ones out. I am not comparing the old covenant and new with sneakers, only an example.

This is pretty clear that the old means old and gone and new means new....

To say we are all saved through faith is not entirely true. Although we receive by faith, we are actually saved by His grace. His grace is always there for everyone and only the ones that believe it are called righteous by faith. Instead of thinking that its your faith that saved you, see that its Jesus' grace that saved you. In response to something so great you only believe and God calls that righteous!
Definition of faith " I believed therefore I speak" 2 Cor 4:13

 

[Source Scripture]

If you want to understand what was going on in this story you need to understand the Jewish culture.

Jesus could not sentence the woman to death, only the Sanhedrin could do that, and at this time period only a Roman court could do it. So really the only reason Jesus was asked about it was because they wanted to see what his answer would be.

If the Sanhedrin had had its powers, the chances of the woman dying would have been negliagible as the Rabbis of Jesus' time deemed that a court who put anyone to death was itself murderous.

As for the "new" covenant verse "old" covenant stuff, the covenants build up upon each other, a newer covenant does not cancel out an older covenant, and Gods covenants are eternal.

We are all saved through faith, just like our Father Abraham, whether that is as physical descendants or spiritual descendants, no one come to God ecept through faith in Messiah, this covenant was made with Abraham. This is one of the oldest covenants.

However, the Mosaic cov, was not built off the oldest covenant, Abraham. Paul clearly shows how the blessing of Abraham, was just that, a blessing in Galatians 3:9, then in 10, he said those under the law, were under a curse.

Also, due note verse 15, one can not add to that covenenant. The covenant mentioned, was Abraham.

15 Brethren, I speak in the manner of men: Though it is only a man’s covenant, yet if it is confirmed, no one annuls or adds to it.

Galaltians 3:18 and Romans 4;14, both stress, that the promise is not of law, the Mosaic covenant. Thank you.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

This is pretty clear that the old means old and gone and new means new....

....and eternal means eternal

 

[NaLuvena]

This is how I understand it.

There is a Law.

If you break the Law (disobey), there is a punishment to be meted out upon said lawbreaker.

Jesus took this punishment upon Himself, in essence freeing the lawbreakers from the punishment of the Law. This is His offer to us. He is offering exemption from the punishment of breaking the Law, if we accept His sacrifice for us, and His Lordship over us.

The Law is still in existance. The punishment is still applicable to all lawbreakers. Somebody has to undergo the punishment if you break the Law.

Oh, and the punishment for breakng the Law is death.

 

[Simon_Templar]

....and eternal means eternal

according to the book of Hebrews, the old covenant passed away. (old meaning the 'mosaic' covenant received at sinai)

 

[Simon_Templar]

This is how I understand it.

There is a Law.

If you break the Law (disobey), there is a punishment to be meted out upon said lawbreaker.

Jesus took this punishment upon Himself, in essence freeing the lawbreakers from the punishment of the Law. This is His offer to us. He is offering exemption from the punishment of breaking the Law, if we accept His sacrifice for us, and His Lordship over us.

The Law is still in existance. The punishment is still applicable to all lawbreakers. Somebody has to undergo the punishment if you break the Law.

Oh, and the punishment for breakng the Law is death.

What does it mean then in Romans chapter 5 when Paul tells us that Death came into the world before the law?

 

[cyberlizard]

according to the book of Hebrews, the old covenant passed away. (old meaning the 'mosaic' covenant received at sinai)

technically, according to the book of Hebrews the old covenant is in the process of passing away. (old meaning the covenant God made with Israel after the golden calf event).


Steve

 

[NaLuvena]

What does it mean then in Romans chapter 5 when Paul tells us that Death came into the world before the law?

Romans 5:13

To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law.

Humans were sinning before the Law was given, it doesn't mean that the Law didn't exist before this point, only that God had not given it to anyone before then.

Note that there cannot be any sin without the Law, which is logical. The Law defines what sin (essentially wrong behaviour) is. That's what the 2nd half of that verse is saying. If the Law began with Moses, then everyone before then couldn't have been a sinner.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

according to the book of Hebrews, the old covenant passed away. (old meaning the 'mosaic' covenant received at sinai)

GOD said "eternal" therefore, you must be misunderstanding something. Only the Holy Spirit can reveal to you what that is but to conclude that the writer of Hebrews undid what God said is incorrect.

The law of sin and death has no hold on nor will it be applied on a believer (we are freed from it) but that law does still exist.

 

[zaksmummy]

zaksmummy you seem to view Jesus in this story as just another man not God in the flesh.

No I know exactly who Jesus is, I just like to put him in his cultural and historical context.

The thing is most of us dont know how that affects what he did.

For example he was using the Oral law and traditions of the Jewish people in this story when he said "Let anyone who is without sin cast the first stone".

In the Sandedrin when a person was brought in for a crime and the witnesses came with them, these witnesses were examined throughly. Not just in their eye witness testimony, but whether they lived righteous lives, pleasing to God. When Jesus says this to them, they obviously realised that actually they werent as righteous as they made out, had unrepented sins of their own, and therefore could not stand in judgement of her.

You see Jesus doesnt need to "do away with the Law" because his is the Law, or more correctly translated "Torah" meaning instruction or mark (as in archery mark).

He is the living Torah, he was the One who was present as its giving at Mount Sinai, and the One who writes it on our hearts, the One who is eternal.

 

[Source Scripture]

Romans 5:13

To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law.

Humans were sinning before the Law was given, it doesn't mean that the Law didn't exist before this point, only that God had not given it to anyone before then.

Note that there cannot be any sin without the Law, which is logical. The Law defines what sin (essentially wrong behaviour) is. That's what the 2nd half of that verse is saying. If the Law began with Moses, then everyone before then couldn't have been a sinner.

Not really, the scripture is clear, that the Mosaic law, entered at a certain time in History. Rom 5;13, 5;20, Gal 3:17, came 430 years later. It was by the one mans, one sin, it does not say the sins of the Mosaic law.

 

[Source Scripture]

The Old Covenant was made obsolete, the only reason it said passing away, is because they knew what Jesus said, that the temple was going down soon, nearing the 40 year mark, left desolate, as per leprosy.

New International Version
Then he said, "Here I am, I have come to do your will." He sets aside the first to establish the second.


New Living Translation
Then he said, "Look, I have come to do your will." He cancels the first covenant in order to put the second into effect.

 

[Source Scripture]

No I know exactly who Jesus is, I just like to put him in his cultural and historical context.

The thing is most of us dont know how that affects what he did.

For example he was using the Oral law and traditions of the Jewish people in this story when he said "Let anyone who is without sin cast the first stone".

In the Sandedrin when a person was brought in for a crime and the witnesses came with them, these witnesses were examined throughly. Not just in their eye witness testimony, but whether they lived righteous lives, pleasing to God. When Jesus says this to them, they obviously realised that actually they werent as righteous as they made out, had unrepented sins of their own, and therefore could not stand in judgement of her.

You see Jesus doesnt need to "do away with the Law" because his is the Law, or more correctly translated "Torah" meaning instruction or mark (as in archery mark).

He is the living Torah, he was the One who was present as its giving at Mount Sinai, and the One who writes it on our hearts, the One who is eternal.

Well, if he did not do away with the law, how could Jew and Gentile be reconciled, and most importantly, be reconciled to God? The law created the hostility.

15by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace,
16and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity.

 

[NaLuvena]

Not really, the scripture is clear, that the Mosaic law, entered at a certain time in History. Rom 5;13, 5;20, Gal 3:17, came 430 years later. It was by the one mans, one sin, it does not say the sins of the Mosaic law.

The Law was given to Moses then, but before that, where was it? Did God create it on the spot up on Mt. Sinai, or has it always been with Him?

The second half of that verse alludes to this. Without the Law, THERE IS NO SIN. We all know that beginning with Adam, there was sin, therefore there must have been a Law somewhere to define what this sin is. If there wasn't any Law, then there couldn't have been any sin.

Sin was being "charged" to the accounts of people who lived before the Law entered, that's why they died.

 

[NaLuvena]

Well, if he did not do away with the law, how could Jew and Gentile be reconciled, and most importantly, be reconciled to God? The law created the hostility.

15by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace,
16and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity.

Matthew 5:17

17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

In the words of Jesus Himself. He did not come to abolish the Law, but to fulfill it, to keep it.

The hostility does not come from the Law, it comes from what Paul calls the "natural man". The Law merely states what is right, and what is wrong, and most importantly, how one can move from "wrong" to "right". This requires a sacrifice, which Jesus was sent to be for us. Without the giving of the Law, we wouldn't have known how to atone for our sins.

 

[Source Scripture]

The Law was given to Moses then, but before that, where was it? Did God create it on the spot up on Mt. Sinai, or has it always been with Him?

The second half of that verse alludes to this. Without the Law, THERE IS NO SIN. We all know that beginning with Adam, there was sin, therefore there must have been a Law somewhere to define what this sin is. If there wasn't any Law, then there couldn't have been any sin.

Sin was being "charged" to the accounts of people who lived before the Law entered, that's why they died.

Because of the event in Hebrews 12, as recorded, and because of these afirmative verses, I think it best that you post scripture, to show contrary. Thanks.

Rom 5:13 for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law.


5:20 Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more,


Gal 3:17 This is what I mean: the law, which came 430 years afterward, does not annul a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to make the promise void

2nd Corinthians 3:7 Now if the ministry of death, carved in letters on stone, came with such glory that the Israelites could not gaze at Moses' face because of its glory, which was being brought to an end,

 

[Source Scripture]

Matthew 5:17

17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them."

In the words of Jesus Himself. He did not come to abolish the Law, but to fulfill it, to keep it.

The hostility does not come from the Law, it comes from what Paul calls the "natural man". The Law merely states what is right, and what is wrong, and most importantly, how one can move from "wrong" to "right". This requires a sacrifice, which Jesus was sent to be for us. Without the giving of the Law, we wouldn't have known how to atone for our sins.

It says, the enmity, which is the law. What else causes divisions between Jew and Gentile? Besides, it says also, to be reconciled to God. Was not man under judgment from Law?

New American Standard Bible
by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace,


King James Bible
Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, [even] the law of commandments [contained] in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, [so] making peace;


Why this?

John 7:49 But this crowd that does not know the law is accursed.”