CF Vision

[Nadiine]

Someone could try the "No true Scottsmen" fallacy

I wonder the same thing sometimes

any forum claiming to be of any group or religion has
every right to set definitions, policy and standards for
itself and its members.

A tigher SOF could be made to stop alot of what goes
on, but since that isn't wanted, fighting & division is what you
get.
(and by division, I don't mean that division is necessarily bad -
the Bible calls Christians to divide from some who bring
certain gospels).

There will always be disagreement in any religion or group, we see it
in scripture, but it would be significantly lessened.

My point earlier was that I did not view this thread as any
debate thread. So I was steering away from specific debates.
I don't see what's wrong with that

With that said, I'm not using this thread to engage in debate.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

This has been an interesting discussion and I will again just lurk for awhile to see what may "become"

http://www.scripture4all.org/

Luke 21:28 Beginning yet these-things to be becoming, up-bend! and lift-up! the heads of ye, thru-that is nearing the loosing/deliverence/apo-lutrwsiV <629> of ye. [Hosea 13:14/1 Corin 1:30]]

1 Corinthians 1:30 Out of him yet, ye are in Christ Jesus, who was become wisdom to us from God, righteousness besides, and hallowing, and loosing/deliverence/apo-lutrwsiV <629>:

 

[PT Calvinist]

as i have been praying over the last few weeks, this was the only thing that kept coming back to me.

As pertaining to Christ:
i try to think of CF as church, and i thought of the character of Christ and what he would want his people to be like. i want CF to be a place where Christians have a place to discuss the things of Christ...even amongst all the different denominations out there. it would be a place where all who claim to have a personal relationship with Christ can come to talk about Him and worship Him.

Sounds good to me...Though the church is being invaded...

As pertaining to Life:
i would want people to develop deep relationships with each other and be able to walk with each other both in the bright and dark times of life...share in both bliss and sorrow...joy and heartache....in essence live life and grow together

Furit of the Spirit. Good point.

As pertaining to those that dont know Christ:
i want those that are not believers to be able to interact amicably with believers on the board. i would hope that the believers on CF would welcome non-believers with open loving arms and for the believers to show them the light of Christ in their interactions with them in speech and attitude.

We do...though it is hard to do such on the interent. What I mean to say is...when in person and talking to a non-believer....you & the non-believer don't have an array of websites and links at your disposal to use against eachother, so that makes it easier to talk to them. When in person...you use the knowledge that you have at the present time or Words given to you by the Holy Spirit. Though on the interent....the Holy Spirit may do as He will though I find it hard for someone to accept words when they can look up a rubuttal....

however, let's say CF was a ford mustang forum. if someone really loved chevy camaros, and started to say how camaros were better than ford and fords suck and constantly caused trouble with other members, they are not here to be friends nor are they here to find out more about ford mustangs...hence they would no longer be welcome on the boards. i think you all get the picture.

Amen.

may it never be said that someone, whether christian or not, did not find gracious love here on CF at some point.

I'm pretty sure it has been said....either that or they had a thorn in their side...

 

[Tissue]

A tigher SOF could be made to stop alot of what goes on, but since that isn't wanted, fighting & division is what you
get. (and by division, I don't mean that division is necessarily bad -
the Bible calls Christians to divide from some who bring
certain gospels).

A tighter SOF would either cripple the member base and flatten conversation or create even more arguments.

I would, however, be interested in seeing your reaction to a tighter SOF that was not based upon your personal viewpoints at all. I'm certain that's not the direction you mean.

 

[Nadiine]

A tighter SOF would either cripple the member base and flatten conversation or create even more arguments.

At this late stage of it? Ya, you could be right.
But cripple the member base? . . . Let's remember what it used to be when
the boards leaned alot more Conservative. I remember seeing 1000-1200
active members all thruout the daytime. Thriving.

As soon as Erwin's ecumenism thrust hit, the forum dwindled
away to what you see left today.

I've always thought people were pinpointing the wrong issues as
the problems for the mass exodus's.
There are other issues stacked on it as well that I won't
go into.

I would, however, be interested in seeing your reaction to a tighter SOF that was not based upon your personal viewpoints at all. I'm certain that's not the direction you mean.

I've asked for just that!
Well over a year ago I asked that they just go liberal or
conservative but to pick one direction and go there.
Pitting the 2 together isn't a recipe for success imo, the 2 will
never mesh; they're naturally oil and water; there's a split
in the USA btwn the 2 also (secularly).

But everybody wants to think it's about being nice and smiling
while you duke out doctrine in the boxing rings.
oh well

 

[Tissue]

Ah, but to call the two 'oil' and 'water' implies that there is truly no overlap.

There is a lot of argument on CF, to be sure. A lot of it is fruitless. But there's also some of it that is worthwhile. To pick a position and lean on that position would create an environment of uniformity, where those who think differently (indeed, the most valuable sort of person, insofar as he/she can allow us to rethink our position) would be ostracized.

Ecumenism is a beautiful thing, and though it can be chaotic, out of that chaos arises beauty.

 

[Nadiine]

Ah, but to call the two 'oil' and 'water' implies that there is truly no overlap.

There is a lot of argument on CF, to be sure. A lot of it is fruitless. But there's also some of it that is worthwhile. To pick a position and lean on that position would create an environment of uniformity, where those who think differently (indeed, the most valuable sort of person, insofar as he/she can allow us to rethink our position) would be ostracized.

Ecumenism is a beautiful thing, and though it can be chaotic, out of that chaos arises beauty.

I have to disagree with that.

There are plenty of disagreements within liberalism and conservativism
both to keep people busy.
The problem is, we don't ahve to negatively counter everything.
I think people are SO programmed to debate, that they actually
THRIVE on disagreement and have a real hard time knowing
what to do with agreement and regular fellowship.

I think that should be explored; why we thrive so much on
the negative and NEED IT to keep our interest.
Not that only agreement is ideal - just saying there's a
spirit of controversy that people thrive on here.
You see it in threads that get heated & involved - all of a sudden
you see 10 people's names up there salivating to read all the
juicy conflict.
What is it with that?

 

[PreachersWife2004]

<snip>
You see it in threads that get heated & involved - all of a sudden
you see 10 people's names up there salivating to read all the
juicy conflict.
What is it with that?

Basically because the soap operas are either really getting ridiculously out of hand. CF sometimes offer better drama than Jerry Springer.

 

[Nadiine]

Basically because the soap operas are either really getting ridiculously out of hand. CF sometimes offer better drama than Jerry Springer.

which is why I've adopted this appropriate smiley



I personally enjoy the long discussions I have with my sister,
mom & brothers - 2 of my brothers are heavy into
apologetics and both are as conservative (if not more) than
myself.
One brother is a reformed Pastor & went to Seminary.

I much prefer hours of discussion with him in agreement
and exploration than what I get here in constant
fighting for just the simple basics of what Christianity is!

MUCH prefer it. It's a joy vs. yanking teeth.
(thinking of smiley graphic for that one) heh =)~

 

[PreachersWife2004]

One of our family friends is a very liberal Lutheran. VERY. We have some of the greatest debates ever...and then when it's all said and done we sit down and have a beer together.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

A tighter SOF would either cripple the member base and flatten conversation or create even more arguments.

I would, however, be interested in seeing your reaction to a tighter SOF that was not based upon your personal viewpoints at all. I'm certain that's not the direction you mean.

I would say that most members, including staff, have a least some personal/religious bias, but I also would like to see your point addressed. God bless

 

[PreachersWife2004]

well, if CF ever adopted a SoF that was not what I accepted, I wouldn't post here anymore.

Pretty simple.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

well, if CF ever adopted a SoF that was not what I accepted, I wouldn't post here anymore.

Pretty simple.

Some man's junk can sometimes be another man's treasure.
To me you sound like you are giving an unltimatum based on what YOU would accept. What if all members felt like that on CF?

 

[PreachersWife2004]

I'm not giving anyone an ultimatum. Someone asked about a SoF tightened away from what I believe and I answered what I would do if that happened.

Here is the statement that I am referring to:

I would, however, be interested in seeing your reaction to a tighter SOF that was not based upon your personal viewpoints at all. I'm certain that's not the direction you mean.

 

[Nadiine]

I'm not giving anyone an ultimatum. Someone asked about a SoF tightened away from what I believe and I answered what I would do if that happened.

Here is the statement that I am referring to:

My reply to that was that yes, I'd rather they went
to either side more predominantly and then there would
at least be an understanding and foundation set in
how people would post here.

My concern is other people; visitors & guests & brand
new Christians seeing the utter chaos by people with
the same Christian icons that don't even arrive at
the very basics of this faith.

While it's not helpful to be in a wrong theology altogether,
it's just as harmful to have chaos and no direction but
"all of the above and everything's right".

Plus, nonChristians seeing the complete lack of ANY
agreement in 1 faith would be very disturbing to me!
And leave me very skeptical at best.

As a Christian, I feel the point should be TRUTH.
Not unity - becuz there really is no spiritual unity outside
truth

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

My reply to that was that yes, I'd rather they went
to either side more predominantly and then there would
at least be an understanding and foundation set in
how people would post here.

My concern is other people; visitors & guests & brand
new Christians seeing the utter chaos by people with
the same Christian icons that don't even arrive at
the very basics of this faith.

While it's not helpful to be in a wrong theology altogether,
it's just as harmful to have chaos and no direction but
"all of the above and everything's right".

Plus, nonChristians seeing the complete lack of ANY
agreement in 1 faith would be very disturbing to me!
And leave me very skeptical at best.

As a Christian, I feel the point should be TRUTH.
Not unity - becuz there really is no spiritual unity outside
truth

Well, Jesus warned that would happen among Jews, Christians and non-Christians and I have the dove and olive branch in me siggy to help sow peace, love and charity everywhere I can on CF.....

1 Corinthians 14:33 for not is of tulmuts/akatastasiaV <181> the God but of Peace as in all the Outcalleds of the Saints.

Luke 21:9 Whenever yet ye should be hearing battles and tumults/akatastasiaV <181> no may be being dismayed for is binding these to be becoming but not immediately the End

 

[InkBlott]

any forum claiming to be of any group or religion has
every right to set definitions, policy and standards for
itself and its members.

A tigher SOF could be made to stop alot of what goes
on, but since that isn't wanted, fighting & division is what you
get.
(and by division, I don't mean that division is necessarily bad -
the Bible calls Christians to divide from some who bring
certain gospels).

There will always be disagreement in any religion or group, we see it
in scripture, but it would be significantly lessened.

My point earlier was that I did not view this thread as any
debate thread. So I was steering away from specific debates.
I don't see what's wrong with that

With that said, I'm not using this thread to engage in debate.

Considering that the SoF is now the Nicene Creed, I'm curious as to how you would suggest tightening it up. What characteristic(s) of the Nicene Creed as it now stands, allow(s)s for fighting & division here at CF? What changes would you make to alter it so as to disallow the particular fighting & divisions that it now allows?

 

[Bombila]

I'm bemused by the idea put forward that possible new members might be driven off by a little looseness in accepting people of varying Christian belief sets while various sections of the site are home to a frightening number of people with really aberrant views. A quick skim through Christian Current Affairs (and none of us dirty agnostics and atheists are allowed to sully the waters there!) would be enough to convince many sane and prudent people not to join.

In the past few days there have been members hinting by use of hebrew homophones with his name that Barack Obama may be the antiChrist, people insisting that the works of well-known Chicano artist Leo Tanguma are full of horrifying symbolism revealing dark plots (I'm sure this would interest Mr. Tanguma, and I may contact him in this regard out of courtesy -I wouldn't want my own paintings discussed in this way), people suggesting the US military will exercise martial law in the fall (this included ignoring the protest and informative words of an actual member of the armed forces), as well as many wild accusations of evil intent on the part of the government of the US.

Pauler et al are worried about a little Universalism when outright and possibly dangerous in some sense tinfoil hat-ism runs rampant through some of your boards.

 

[Nadiine]

Pauler et al are worried about a little Universalism when outright and possibly dangerous in some sense tinfoil hat-ism runs rampant through some of your boards.

Yes there should be concern over Universalism; I'm not who's into
throwing out the baby with the bathwater so to speak.
Why allow more error than necessary?
Several other Christian boards refuse to let any Universalist
content anywhere on their boards.

 

[higgs2]

None of this matters. Christ is calling us to be new creations. We need to love and serve the Lord, not quibble about this silliness. There is so much to do in RL!