CF Vision

[LittleLambofJesus]

Thank you, LLoJ!

I tend, in short, to think of historic Christian creeds as concise little stories we tell ourselves about what the Bible says (or in their earliest forms should say). Most (if not all) of these concise little stories were written with the agenda of combating heresies. As such, they are useful as far as they go, but are always going to be less interesting than the full sweep of the biblical narrative, the richness of Christian history (heresies, orthodoxy and all) or the immediacy of one's interaction with any particular Christian.

The Nicene Creed is actually not unlike the free map of my town produced by the local chamber of commerce. It's a rather concise little story about the town, produced for a particular purpose, quite accurate as far as it goes. But it will never tell me what I will see this afternoon on and about the creek as I take my walk across the three footbridges it highlights, much less describe for me in full sensual detail and serendipitous whimsy the experience of visiting our local music festival (or even our local Wal-mart ).

That's why I asked katallasso how her living out of the creed will look here on CF, not to pick on her but because that's really what is in question here. Iisn't it? Pauler has his vision. Katillasso has hers. I have mine. How is this all going to work together: the rules, the staff, Pauler's vision, the creed, all of us and our individual wants and needs and hopes (large or small) brought to this virtual place? What will emerge from this amalgum?

Whether we imagine the result as being led by the Holy Spirit or emerging out of forces and eddies of a more naturalistic nature, I don't imagine any of us are wise enough to predict or even perceive in its fullness the unfolding of it all. That has been a difficult lesson for me to learn. In fact I do not know if I have actually learned it yet. I hope I have and thus my return here after a one year hiatus.

I suppose what I am winding up to say is that I hope we can all be as gentle with one another and this process as we are able. We are all human beings, sometimes fragile and always of inestimable worth. The map is not the town. The creed is not Christianity being lived out. Mythos is not Logos.

I see some dissatisfaction in this last page as to how this topic is progressing. I hope I have not added to that sense of dissatisfaction.

Thank you for your response and input.

The Apostle Paul gives us a lot of detail on how Christians should be working out our salvation.
We are judged indiviually on how we work it out, not a whole Denomination within Christiandom, and no Creed can possibly explain salvation as much as the Scriptures themselves can, as Creeds are not INSPIRED Scripture but more of a "commentary" on Scripture.

I would love to hear more input on this

Scripture4All - Greek/Hebrew interlinear Bible software

[ISA interlinear] Philip 2:12 asbeside beloved ones! of me according as always ye obey, no as in the presence/parousia of me only, but now much rather in the absence of me in fear/fobou <5401> and trembling/tromou <5156>, of yeselves salvation be ye workingout/affecting!

Search for 'Genesis 1:1' in the version

Luke 21:26 men fainting at heart from fear/fobou <5401> and expectation of the things coming on the world, for the powers of the heavens shall be shaken.

Reve 1:17 And when I saw Him I fall toward the feet of Him as dead and He places the right of Him [*hand] on me saying "No be fearing!/fobou <5399> (5737) I AM the first and the last

Strong's Number G5399 matches the Greek &#966;&#959;&#946;&#8051;&#969; (phobe&#333, which occurs 110 times in 90 verses in the Greek concordance of the KJV
Strong's Number G5401 matches the Greek &#966;&#8057;&#946;&#959;&#962; (phobos), which occurs 47 times in 44 verses in the Greek concordance of the KJV

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon
5399. phobeo fob-eh'-o from 5401; to frighten, i.e. (passively) to be alarmed; by analogy, to be in awe of, i.e. revere:--be (+ sore) afraid, fear (exceedingly), reverence.
5401. phobos fob'-os from a primary phebomai (to be put in fear); alarm or fright:--be afraid, + exceedingly, fear, terror.

 

[Lindon&#160; Tinuviel]

Hello again, arborvita. Long time, no see! So, how're things? But enough with the smalltalk. Some of your former compadres would like a word with you. Amazingly enough, not all of those words are four-lettered. You actually have supporters... imagine!



Come as you are. You can bring Hentenza, too, if you want. The more, the merrier. Carry on.

 

[CaDan]

Watching the detectives.

 

[Lindon&#160; Tinuviel]

Watching you watch the detectives watching the usual suspects....

 

[arborvita]

Hello Lindon.... I am surprised to see you. If people want to talk to me they can do so here on CF. I am available via the S/C Box, QACF, or via PM. Best of Luck and God Bless.

 

[CaDan]

Questions are a burden to others.
Answers are prison for oneself.

 

[Chaplain David]

So are things getting any better around here? I know a lot of changes have been made. I still visit occasionally. There are still some nice people here.

 

[Hisbygrace]

Some of MY personal thoughts....


1. Of course, all Christians are embracing of The Great Commandment and Great Commission. As are all Christian websites. I think what we need to clearly KNOW is: What is the vision/purpose/mission of THIS site?


2. There is a plethora of Christian websites out there that are either denominational/faith community oriented (Lutheran or Methodist or Catholic or whatever) OR are generic "whatever" sites. The latter refers to those that are fundamentally relativistic or minimalistic in nature, the "won't you be my neighbor" Mr. Rogerisms that appeal to relativists and minimalists (and occasionally liberals). There are a LOT of those out there - some of them very good. There's no need to be yet another example of such. I admit, since I'm not a relativist or minimalist (or even a Mr. Rogerist, lol), I avoid those sites like the plague. I think they do more harm than good.



3. IMHO, what made CF into the largest Christian website on the net was a DIFFERENT focus. Erwin seemed to desire to build an ECUMENICAL, interdenominational site where a DIVERGENT community of Christians would come TOGETHER for the purposes of mutual fellowship, support and discussion. OPEN, honest, real discussion - about issues we share and issues where we don't. Coming here was a very broad, diverse group of informed, articulate, intelligent posters. Many of us THRIVED in this enviroment - learning and growing, both in faith and in mutual understanding. But I admit, it could be challenging. Sometimes long held assumptions got challenged! More than a few of us changed our minds about some things! In my 21 years, I have twice changed my fundamental faith community affiliation: from rather liberal mainstream Protestant (that of my father - a pastor), to Catholic to Lutheran. I may not be done yet! I HOPE and PRAY I never stop learning and growing, that I never stop being open to things. CF was (is?) a great place for that. As such, it was/is very rare! IMHO, it's what made this site the largest and most talk about site on the internet.


4. I've been a part (WAY too much so) of two Christian websites that died. In both cases, the reason was the same. They lost their sense of purpose/mission and became focused on self and the preservation and promotion of self. IMHO, it happens to some congregations, too. I hope it hasn't/doesn't happen here. I LOVE this site.


5. For several years, I was very active in BOTH a Protestant and Catholic parish - and in those two communities, with MANY friends in each. I learned - first hand - that misunderstandings ABOUND (about equally on all "sides"), and that these tend to continue because each listens only to it's own side, assuming it knows the other better than the other does. CF was one of the very, precious FEW opportunities we had to come together - face to face - with that other. And talk. Ask. Share. Openly, honestly, frankly. Do we end up agreeing? Hardly ever! Do we leave advancing mutual understanding, destroying false concepts? Often. Some of us leave changed and with renewed and expanded respect.


6. It's been nearly 2 1/2 years since I was on staff here and at least partly "in the loop" about the inner working and struggles of CF. I left for awhile and came back about a year ago - just as a lowly poster, lol. Erwin built this site up until it was just too big for him (and life called him elsewhere). As he moved away, the "void" got filled with those with different agendas and the WAR took over. Some wanted to protect their point of view, some wanted to turn CF into an apologetics site, and still others wanted to keep the site open and real. It took on a Protestant vs. Catholic bent. And it was not good. Many became victims of the war. The place turned nasty. Many left (and not all voluntarily). Staff (especially upper) became polerized and demoralized amid a flurry of firings and re-suffeling and a plethora of constant changes of protocol and staff and rules as the "front" seemed to move one way or the other. Many of us just wanted CF to return to a place of open, honest real discussions, a place of bridges not walls. Many of us were sent packing along with those at the front. On both sides. There was an attempt at a truce - with a call for balance and fairness but let's just say it didn't go well. Paul, MANY here have scars and wounds that are still raw. MANY websites are populated with former CF posters and staffers, victims of this time.


7. In some ways, I think CF is still trying to rebuild from that, still looking for the answer to the question of this thread: What are we doing here? Can we? Does it matter? Will CF become a place of meaningless games and animals and chatter; entirely moot? Will it TRY to become yet another church of relativism, minimalism and Mr. Rogerism in spite of other sites already doing this better than CF ever will? Or can we rebuild the largest, most popular, most important Christian website on the net? One dedicated to open, honest, real discussion in an atmoshere of love and respect? I don't know. I honestly don't know. But I hope. And I pray. Every day.


Thank you for reading my thoughts.


Pax


- Josiah


.

Wow Josiah, thank you so much for puting into words the way that most of us still here at CF feels In the time that I have been a member of CF I have found so much love, guidance, inspiration and encouragement.
I'm not saying that everything here through the years has been a bed of roses. There certainly have been times of indecision, hurt feelings and uncertainty of even staying here, but all those feelings are part of everything in life. I pray also for CF, the staff, the members and visitors that pass our way. IMHO I truly believe that CF can remain a Christian site which with love, grace and compassion for all fellowman can survive.
God bless you Josiah and everyone else here at CF

 

[GigageiTsula]

I feel the same way about CF, HBG.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

So are things getting any better around here? I know a lot of changes have been made. I still visit occasionally. There are still some nice people here.

I would say most everything is still the same since the new owner took over, and some of it not such a good thing in my most humble view.

Defining the different brands of "Preterists" for example is one that comes to mind

 

[Larry Michael]

Mathew 22... Great verse.

 

[Davidnic]

Questions are a burden to others.
Answers are prison for oneself.

The Prisoner, one of my all time favorite shows. Remake coming soon.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

The Prisoner, one of my all time favorite shows. Remake coming soon.

Reve 2:10 Nothing be thou fearing! which-things thou are being about to be suffering.
Behold! Is being about to be casting out ye, the Devil, into a prison, that ye may be being tried.

YouTube - The Prisoner