CEO are not that highly paid

Umaro

Senior Veteran
Dec 22, 2006
4,497
213
✟13,505.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
I depends on where you live. I make more than 75% of people yet I am by no means rich.

Is that really an argument though, since no one is forcing you to live in a neighborhood of million plus dollar homes? You could make more than 9/10 people you could find in the country, but if you live in Beverly Hills you're not "rich" by their standards.

We need to define "rich" only by how much you make compared to other Americans, since that way though averages we get a standard reading. Picking out expensive to live places is no different than anecdotal evidence, and it's not like they can't commute like poor people have to.
 
Upvote 0

TheNewWorldMan

phased plasma rifle in 40-watt range
Jan 2, 2007
9,362
849
✟28,775.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
CEO's are not paid based on anyone's personal opinion. The captialist marketplace and supply and demand dictate it. Hey, I'm not a rich CEO but I don't begrudge the person who is. His/her wealth does not make me any poorer or richer.

"Capitalist marketplace"=those with capital=rich.

Of course they're going to skew the system to select...themselves. :wave:
 
Upvote 0

kermit

Legend
Nov 13, 2003
15,477
807
49
Visit site
✟27,358.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Democrat
Is that really an argument though, since no one is forcing you to live in a neighborhood of million plus dollar homes? You could make more than 9/10 people you could find in the country, but if you live in Beverly Hills you're not "rich" by their standards.

We need to define "rich" only by how much you make compared to other Americans, since that way though averages we get a standard reading. Picking out expensive to live places is no different than anecdotal evidence, and it's not like they can't commute like poor people have to.
My point is not what neighnbor hood you choose, but what region. At the same income a person can be rich in Tulsa but middle class in NYC.
 
Upvote 0

Sketcher

Born Imperishable
Feb 23, 2004
38,984
9,401
✟380,259.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
I do not care what these people make. I just don't. What I care about is whether they're creating jobs or not, and whether they're gaming the system or not (hello, Goldman Sachs). Want to buy a yacht? That's great for the people who make yachts. Want to buy a new car every year? That's great for the rest of us, the "old" one will still be in good shape and sold for a much lower price than what you bought it for so someone not as well off as you can have it for less. And when he trades his car in, which would be serviceable but not as nice, that similarly helps out someone not as well off as him, and so forth.
 
Upvote 0

kermit

Legend
Nov 13, 2003
15,477
807
49
Visit site
✟27,358.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Democrat
I do not care what these people make. I just don't. What I care about is whether they're creating jobs or not, and whether they're gaming the system or not (hello, Goldman Sachs). Want to buy a yacht? That's great for the people who make yachts. Want to buy a new car every year? That's great for the rest of us, the "old" one will still be in good shape and sold for a much lower price than what you bought it for so someone not as well off as you can have it for less. And when he trades his car in, which would be serviceable but not as nice, that similarly helps out someone not as well off as him, and so forth.
I am concerned less with whether they are creating jobs than they are adding value to the company they work for. Too many CEOs are rewarded for failure and for damaging companies.
 
Upvote 0

Sketcher

Born Imperishable
Feb 23, 2004
38,984
9,401
✟380,259.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
I am concerned less with whether they are creating jobs than they are adding value to the company they work for. Too many CEOs are rewarded for failure and for damaging companies.
But whose responsibility is it to make sure they're doing that? How about the board, the investors, and so forth?
 
Upvote 0

Umaro

Senior Veteran
Dec 22, 2006
4,497
213
✟13,505.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
My point is not what neighnbor hood you choose, but what region. At the same income a person can be rich in Tulsa but middle class in NYC.

That might be true to a point, like if you make 50k instead of 60k, but is that really the case when you start reaching the 90th percentile of wealth and such? I'm going to wager no.

Besides that, taking it as a whole population averages it out. If you make more than 95% of Americans, you can live pretty much anywhere and be rich.

So where could we draw the line of "rich" in your opinion? Wpiman, I want to hear from you on this too.
 
Upvote 0

kermit

Legend
Nov 13, 2003
15,477
807
49
Visit site
✟27,358.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Democrat
That might be true to a point, like if you make 50k instead of 60k, but is that really the case when you start reaching the 90th percentile of wealth and such? I'm going to wager no.

Besides that, taking it as a whole population averages it out. If you make more than 95% of Americans, you can live pretty much anywhere and be rich.

So where could we draw the line of "rich" in your opinion? Wpiman, I want to hear from you on this too.
How about this. My buddy just moved from Arkansas and he was telling me that at my income I could live in the rich neighborhoods and would be concidered rich. Here in PA I am considered middle-class and live in a nice, but fairly average home. Yes, when you get into the 90% rich is rich anywhere, but where the divide is really depends upon more factors than income.
 
Upvote 0

Umaro

Senior Veteran
Dec 22, 2006
4,497
213
✟13,505.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
How about this. My buddy just moved from Arkansas and he was telling me that at my income I could live in the rich neighborhoods and would be concidered rich. Here in PA I am considered middle-class and live in a nice, but fairly average home. Yes, when you get into the 90% rich is rich anywhere, but where the divide is really depends upon more factors than income.

Which is why a country wide average helps fix the issue. If its out of all Americans, it counts everyone. If you make more than 8/10 people overall, you make more than 8/10 people in any town statistically. Sure, it might only be middle in New York, but it's also living like a king in Alaska. By averaging we get a decent readout.

It's the same as weight. You might be more or less heavy comparatively in a city wide population, but as a country there would be one scale model. It's most of the basis of statistics.

I know there are problems with it, but really I want to just test something. I have a theory that most well off people underestimate how high up the ladder they are, and I would appreciate it if people here would play along.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

wpiman2

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2007
2,778
61
Godless Massachusetts
✟18,251.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Libertarian
That might be true to a point, like if you make 50k instead of 60k, but is that really the case when you start reaching the 90th percentile of wealth and such? I'm going to wager no.

Besides that, taking it as a whole population averages it out. If you make more than 95% of Americans, you can live pretty much anywhere and be rich.

So where could we draw the line of "rich" in your opinion? Wpiman, I want to hear from you on this too.

Rich in income or rich in assets? Are we talking about money earning potential of work + assets?

I'd say once you are netting $1 million -$2 million a year; you are probably rich in my book. That would be over a sustained people of time-- not a one year fluke.
 
Upvote 0

Umaro

Senior Veteran
Dec 22, 2006
4,497
213
✟13,505.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
Rich in income or rich in assets? Are we talking about money earning potential of work + assets?

I'd say once you are netting $1 million -$2 million a year; you are probably rich in my book. That would be over a sustained people of time-- not a one year fluke.

No, I don't want a salary number.

If someone walked up on the street and asked you to say "You are rich when you make more than X%," what would you say? I don't care if you do it by assets, I don't care if you do it by income. Just flat out what would you say generally speaking.
 
Upvote 0

wpiman2

Senior Member
Oct 6, 2007
2,778
61
Godless Massachusetts
✟18,251.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Libertarian
No, I don't want a salary number.

If someone walked up on the street and asked you to say "You are rich when you make more than X%," what would you say? I don't care if you do it by assets, I don't care if you do it by income. Just flat out what would you say generally speaking.

Top .1%
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

TheNewWorldMan

phased plasma rifle in 40-watt range
Jan 2, 2007
9,362
849
✟28,775.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
US-Others
I think its obvious that 'rich' is 'dem whos gots more than us.

A fair observation. "Rich" is relative.

Myself, I would use a rubric that was about one-third salary, one-third investments and savings, and one-third property. But that's not etched in stone.

There's a top 0.0005% or so that own the country. What they say, goes. The Forbes 500. They're the ones that groom Presidents, give the orders, have people whacked, and so forth.

The top 0.001% or so are their most favored servants, their coterie. They are the bagmen of the elite. You don't get here without the direct permission of the elite.

Between them and 0.1%, you've got what almost everyone would call "super-rich." But not the owners of America. More like the most favored vassals of the elite that are not formally part of the elite's court. A few manage to get here independently (movie stars and other entertainers, inventors who manage to patently something hugely popular, etc.). Since this level does not grant any real access to the "machinery" that runs the country, the rulers of America don't police it...much.

Between the top 2% and 0.1%, you've got the garden-variety rich. You're too low on the food chain for the elite to really care about you.

Between the top 10% and 2%, you've got people some would call "rich," and others merely upper middle class. Most small businessmen and professionals come in here.

Between the top 25% and 10%, you're in the upper to mid reaches of the middle class.
 
Upvote 0
Aug 24, 2008
2,702
168
✟18,742.00
Faith
Agnostic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
AU-Greens
If you look at full time wages in the US, the median is $754 a week, while the ninth decile (that is, the point where 90% are below and 10% are above) is $1774.

I think it would be fair to say that if you are in one of the richest countries in the world and are in the top 10% of full-time wage earners, which means you are earning at least 235% of the median full-time wage, you are rich.

This really needs to be put in a global perspective, though. It is hard to find statistics that cover the full breadth of the world in terms of median wages, but the world bank has Gross National Income Per Capita statistics - http://siteresources.worldbank.org/DATASTATISTICS/Resources/GNIPC.pdf

The US is at $47580. The world figure is at $8579. That means the US average GNI is 550% of the world figure.

So, if the US average income is 550% of the world average income, and the top 10% of US earners are earning more than 250% of the US median wage... well, I struggle to see how anyone could consider someone that earns somewhere around 1500% of the global average income is anything other than rich.
 
Upvote 0

Umaro

Senior Veteran
Dec 22, 2006
4,497
213
✟13,505.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
The point I was trying to bring up was that if you make $250,000 annually, you are in the top 2%, meaning you make more than 98% of other Americans, the people of the richest nation in the world. Why are people arguing some make "only" $250,000 a year? They make more than 98/100 people at that point, why should we be giving them the tax breaks? And what's that say about those CEOs that are making 50 times that much in bonuses per year?
 
Upvote 0