Can you marry a divorced woman?

[SeventhFisherofMen]

I'm sure this question isn't a new one, but can I marry a divorced woman who's ex-husband is still alive? To be honest I don't think it's such a big deal, but the Bible seems to say otherwise.

“It was said, ‘Whoever sends his wife away, let him give her a certificate of divorce’; but I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except for the reason of unchastity, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
— Matthew 5:31-32

And if you have married a divorced woman, are you to file for divorce? Sounds crazy to me.

The only way I'd marry a divorced woman is if her husband committed adultery. Otherwise no.

 

[zoidar]

The only way I'd marry a divorced woman is if her husband committed adultery. Otherwise no.

Ok! What is considered adultery? Some say the spouse looking at x-rated movies is adultery.

 

[ZephBonkerer]

Ok! What is considered adultery? Some say the spouse looking at x-rated movies is adultery.

Where did we get the notion that adultery is the only valid ground for divorce? I've heard people claim those were the "clear words of Jesus". Oh really? So are we expected to believe the following?

Domestic violence is not a valid ground for divorce.
Abandonment is not a valid ground for divorce.
Drug use is not a valid ground for divorce.
Gambling the next three mortgage payments away is not a valid ground for divorce.
Refusing sexual intimacy is not a valid ground for divorce.
Attempted murder is not a valid ground for divorce.

But adultery - and only adultery - is a valid ground for divorce.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

Ok! What is considered adultery? Some say the spouse looking at x-rated movies is adultery.

I think we all know what God would consider adultery, if you get to Heaven and try to explain you divorced your wife or husband because they had an adulterous thought and that was it, chances are you're in the wrong. God doesn't want quitters. That being said if they slept with another person that is what is meant by "I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery." Matthew 19:9

 

[ZephBonkerer]

I think we all know what God would consider adultery, if you get to Heaven and try to explain you divorced your wife or husband because they had an adulterous thought and that was it, chances are you're in the wrong. God doesn't want quitters. That being said if they slept with another person that is what is meant by "I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery." Matthew 19:9

There's a lot more to being a faithful spouse than simply refraining from sleeping with another person.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

There's a lot more to being a faithful spouse than simply refraining from sleeping with another person.

I'm literally agreeing with you when you said:

But adultery - and only adultery - is a valid ground for divorce.

keep in mind when it came to my divorce my wife was using drugs and she was leaving me alone until 2 am on the daily. I still wanted to stay with her, but when she told me her plan to cheat on me that was it.

Not only do I agree with your statement but I lived it out.

Too easily do people give up on marriage these days especially.

 

[zoidar]

I'm literally agreeing with you when you said:

keep in mind when it came to my divorce my wife was using drugs and she was leaving me alone until 2 am on the daily. I still wanted to stay with her, but when she told me her plan to cheat on me that was it.

Not only do I agree with your statement but I lived it out.

Too easily do people give up on marriage these days especially.

People today file for divorce way too easily, but hopefully Christians aren't letting go that easily. I think those who want to be faithful to Christ also work hard to fix their marriage.

 

[Lost Witness]

Where did we get the notion that adultery is the only valid ground for divorce? I've heard people claim those were the "clear words of Jesus". Oh really? So are we expected to believe the following?

Domestic violence is not a valid ground for divorce.
Abandonment is not a valid ground for divorce.
Drug use is not a valid ground for divorce.
Gambling the next three mortgage payments away is not a valid ground for divorce.
Refusing sexual intimacy is not a valid ground for divorce.
Attempted murder is not a valid ground for divorce.

But adultery - and only adultery - is a valid ground for divorce.

Not sure how refusing to have intercourse with someone would be a good enough reason to divorce

 

[Hazelelponi]

The reason I don't think marriage or singleness is something to do with calling, is because I think that may be a misunderstanding of calling. And that external pressure often comes from others in the church as I had church people suggesting to me maybe I am not called to marriage, because I wasn't particularly sure about getting married at that point, having never had a serious relationship at that point in my life, and also to be honest, I don't like it occuring too much under the scrutiny of some people I have met in some churches. Really sometimes we are mature enough to not need the chaperone.

I was the person who originally called marriage a calling.

It's not that I misunderstand what callings from God are, it's because I believe marriage is as much a ministry as is standing on a pulpit or doing numerous other things that God calls us to do.

Probably more so because this is the person you're taking your Christian walk with, all the way through life. Through every high and every low, while raising up the next generation, marriage is a covenant, and it's ministry.

That's how I see marriage. It's a calling in my mind, though the Bible doesn't use the exact phrase. I do believe Paul calls it a gift though.

So I said - it you're not called to marriage...

You can phrase it however you like.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Not sure how refusing to have intercourse with someone would be a good enough reason to divorce

Even the Bible suggests it's wrong to refuse marital relations except by mutual consent.

1 Corinthians 7:5 Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

So unless there's a health concern, there should be... You know. Marital relations.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

People today file for divorce way too easily, but hopefully Christians aren't letting go that easily. I think those who want to be faithful to Christ also work hard to fix their marriage.

true this should be the case and i hope it is

 

[ZephBonkerer]

Not sure how refusing to have intercourse with someone would be a good enough reason to divorce

Hopefully you will never have the misfortune of experiencing something like this. What would you expect someone in such a position to do? Be celibate?

Edit: I consider this an egregious violation of the marital covenant. If you read the line before and the line after, you get a sense.

 

[ZephBonkerer]

People today file for divorce way too easily, but hopefully Christians aren't letting go that easily. I think those who want to be faithful to Christ also work hard to fix their marriage.

I've never been one for the disposable spouse ethic. But the problem I see isn't that divorce is too easy to get. It is that people are pressured into staying in bad marriages regardless of how their toxic spouses behave.

"For better or for worse" was supposed to mean "no matter what life throws at us", not "no matter what evil you do to me". Too many Christians seem to treat marital vows as some kind of suicide pact. I consider such behavior idolatrous and an embarrassment to the Faith.

Edit: none of this is intended to say you or anyone on this forum is doing this. But I've seen it a lot in churches. I myself was even excommunicated from a church assembly because of my divorce.

 

[zoidar]

I've never been one for the disposable spouse ethic. But the problem I see isn't that divorce is too easy to get. It is that people are pressured into staying in bad marriages regardless of how their toxic spouses behave.

"For better or for worse" was supposed to mean "no matter what life throws at us", not "no matter what evil you do to me". Too many Christians seem to treat marital vows as some kind of suicide pact. I consider such behavior idolatrous and an embarrassment to the Faith.

Edit: none of this is intended to say you or anyone on this forum is doing this. But I've seen it a lot in churches. I myself was even excommunicated from a church assembly because of my divorce.

I know nothing about your situation, and won't give any comment. You know the Christian singer Sarah Kelly? She was beaten by her husband. I don't know how long this was going on before she finally divorced him. You can't stay in such marriages. Of course she did the right thing to leave him. God is not holding her responsible. She is now remarried to a nice guy. A swede btw.

 

[ZephBonkerer]

I know nothing about your situation, and won't give any comment. You know the Christian singer Sarah Kelly? She was beaten by her husband. I don't know how long this was going on before she finally divorced him. You can't stay in such marriages. Of course she did the right thing to leave him. God is not holding her responsible. She is now remarried to a nice guy. A swede btw.

There are people who would condemn this singer for her divorce and remarriage. I have no respect at all for such idolators.

 

[Stephen3141]

I'm sure this question isn't a new one, but can I marry a divorced woman who's ex-husband is still alive? To be honest I don't think it's such a big deal, but the Bible seems to say otherwise.

“It was said, ‘Whoever sends his wife away, let him give her a certificate of divorce’; but I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except for the reason of unchastity, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.
— Matthew 5:31-32

And if you have married a divorced woman, are you to file for divorce? Sounds crazy to me.

More precision is needed, in Christian thinking.

Jesus forbids this, even though the law of Moses allows this ("due to the sinfulness of your hearts").

What Jesus is saying, is that the lifelong bond that we call "marriage" in English, is not broken by some human certificate of divorce. So a legally divorced person, is not "single", and commits adultery if they marry some other "single" person.

Some Christians confuse getting a legal divorce, with the destruction of the lifelong marriage bond. (Some Reformed congregations take this view.) But Jesus' prohibition is not necessarily against getting a legal divorce (there are valid reasons for doing this), but a prohibition on thinking that getting a legal divorce makes you "single". Jesus is prohibiting divorce-and-remarriage.

Christians need to seriously study what the Bible says about basic states, that are relevant to "marriage". This includes, "single", "married", "divorced", and how one enters or exits each of these states. On the surface, this may seem to be a simple thing to do. But once you get into the biblical language, its anything but easy. And the biblical definitions don't necessarily line up with expectations in modern American culture.

 

[ZephBonkerer]

More precision is needed, in Christian thinking.

Jesus forbids this, even though the law of Moses allows this ("due to the sinfulness of your hearts").

What Jesus is saying, is that the lifelong bond that we call "marriage" in English, is not broken by some human certificate of divorce. So a legally divorced person, is not "single", and commits adultery if they marry some other "single" person.

Some Christians confuse getting a legal divorce, with the destruction of the lifelong marriage bond. (Some Reformed congregations take this view.) But Jesus' prohibition is not necessarily against getting a legal divorce (there are valid reasons for doing this), but a prohibition on thinking that getting a legal divorce makes you "single". Jesus is prohibiting divorce-and-remarriage.

Christians need to seriously study what the Bible says about basic states, that are relevant to "marriage". This includes, "single", "married", "divorced", and how one enters or exits each of these states. On the surface, this may seem to be a simple thing to do. But once you get into the biblical language, its anything but easy. And the biblical definitions don't necessarily line up with expectations in modern American culture.

Actually, that's not true. Jesus was emphatic at Matthew 5:17-18 and Luke 16:17 that He was not abolishing any part of the Law of the Prophets. It is reasonable to expect that "one jot, one tittle, the least stroke of a pen" would include Deuteronomy 24:1-4, which clearly allows for both divorce and remarriage. If getting remarried after a valid divorce was adultery per se, it would have never been lawful even under the Mosaic Law. If getting remarried after a valid divorce was not adultery in those days, when did it become adultery?

One man dumped a faithful wife just so he could get with some OnlyFans model. This is disgusting behavior that Jesus rightly condemned as tantamount to adultery. Another man put up with years of abuse, neglect, lies, etc before divorcing his wayward wife - then married a better woman five years later. Nowhere in Scripture is remarriage condemned in this context. The moral difference between the men in these two scenarios is patently obvious even to pagans.

Divorce ends a marriage just as death would. There is nothing in Scripture to indicate that one can be legally divorced but "still married in God's eyes". You are either married or you are not. It's that simple.

It was the abuse of the divorce provision for selfish or trivial reasons that Jesus had a problem with, not divorce and remarriage per se. The divorce provision was intended to provide relief for people who have the misfortune of being married to some bum who refuses to honor their marital vows. It was not intended to give an excuse to some perv who wants out of their marriage just to pursue another relationship. I must admit I get frustrated when I hear other Christians talk of marital vows as if they were some kind of suicide pact. And yes, there are valid grounds for divorce other than adultery - that they are not explicitly mentioned in the New Testament means nothing here.

I have heard some people claim that Jesus' use of the word "adultery" proves that they are "still married in God's eyes". This is nonsense. He also uses that word at Matthew 5:28 to describe looking upon a woman with lustful intent. Neither the man nor the woman he is lusting after need to be married to anyone for this offense to occur.

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

Actually, that's not true. Jesus was emphatic at Matthew 5:17-18 and Luke 16:17 that He was not abolishing any part of the Law of the Prophets. It is reasonable to expect that "one jot, one tittle, the least stroke of a pen" would include Deuteronomy 24:1-4, which clearly allows for both divorce and remarriage. If getting remarried after a valid divorce was adultery per se, it would have never been lawful even under the Mosaic Law. If getting remarried after a valid divorce was not adultery in those days, when did it become adultery?

One man dumped a faithful wife just so he could get with some OnlyFans model. This is disgusting behavior that Jesus rightly condemned as tantamount to adultery. Another man put up with years of abuse, neglect, lies, etc before divorcing his wayward wife - then married a better woman five years later. Nowhere in Scripture is remarriage condemned in this context. The moral difference between the men in these two scenarios is patently obvious even to pagans.

Divorce ends a marriage just as death would. There is nothing in Scripture to indicate that one can be legally divorced but "still married in God's eyes". You are either married or you are not. It's that simple.

It was the abuse of the divorce provision for selfish or trivial reasons that Jesus had a problem with, not divorce and remarriage per se. The divorce provision was intended to provide relief for people who have the misfortune of being married to some bum who refuses to honor their marital vows. It was not intended to give an excuse to some perv who wants out of their marriage just to pursue another relationship. I must admit I get frustrated when I hear other Christians talk of marital vows as if they were some kind of suicide pact. And yes, there are valid grounds for divorce other than adultery - that they are not explicitly mentioned in the New Testament means nothing here.

I have heard some people claim that Jesus' use of the word "adultery" proves that they are "still married in God's eyes". This is nonsense. He also uses that word at Matthew 5:28 to describe looking upon a woman with lustful intent. Neither the man nor the woman free is lusting after need to be married to anyone for this offense to occur.

The sad thing is a lot of Christians take what Jesus said to mean that only for sexual immorality can you divorce, yet if someone was abused physically or verbally or deprived of their marital intercourse or just plain treated like garbage by their spouse you're stuck. There is a lot of Jesus that people ignore when citing rules, like how gentle Jesus was regarding sinners and how He is understanding. Jesus is truly loving and each case is different. You gave two examples of divorce and I believe Jesus knows His children and why we do what we do.

There is no fooling Jesus, He knows every intention, "They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them" Romans 2:15

We all stand by Jesus and he who is humble and true will indeed stand before Jesus. The most important thing is that if you intend to marry someone you talk to Jesus about everything on your mind and He will either allow or prevent it.

 

[ZephBonkerer]

The sad thing is a lot of Christians take what Jesus said to mean that only for sexual immorality can you divorce, yet if someone was abused physically or verbally or deprived of their marital intercourse or just plain treated like garbage by their spouse you're stuck. There is a lot of Jesus that people ignore when citing rules, like how gentle Jesus was regarding sinners and how He is understanding. Jesus is truly loving and each case is different. You gave two examples of divorce and I believe Jesus knows His children and why we do what we do.

There is no fooling Jesus, He knows every intention, "They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them" Romans 2:15

We all stand by Jesus and he who is humble and true will indeed stand before Jesus. The most important thing is that if you intend to marry someone you talk to Jesus about everything on your mind and He will either allow or prevent it.

I believe God is blasphemed whenever anyone in the Church pressures a spouse to stay married to someone who flagrantly refuses to honor their marital vows. I have heard people say things like "separate, but don't divorce" to a battered spouse. Really!? Why!? And where is that written?

What I find even more damning to the marriage permanence heresy is what Jesus said on other matters. If He didn't show much patience to the Pharisees who made an idol out of the Sabbath day (Luke 13:14-16), then He probably would not be very charitable to those who do so with respect to marriage.

He also didn't have much good to say to those who imposed heavy burdens on people (Matt 23:4). If the demand to stay married to someone who is vile, dissipated, abusive, etc or suffer permanent celibacy isn't an unreasonable and unconscionable burden, then pray tell what is?

 

[SeventhFisherofMen]

I believe God is blasphemed whenever anyone in the Church pressures a spouse to stay married to someone who flagrantly refuses to honor their marital vows. I have heard people say things like "separate, but don't divorce" to a battered spouse. Really!? Why!? And where is that written?

What I find even more damning to the marriage permanence heresy is what Jesus said on other matters. If He didn't show much patience to the Pharisees who made an idol out of the Sabbath day (Luke 13:14-16), then He probably would not be very charitable to those who do so with respect to marriage.

He also didn't have much good to say to those who imposed heavy burdens on people (Matt 23:4). If the demand to stay married to someone who is vile, dissipated, abusive, etc or suffer permanent celibacy isn't an unreasonable and unconscionable burden, then pray tell what is?

ya the scary thing is pharisees back then used the law of moses, pharisees today use Jesus' own words to burden those very people Jesus is trying to help