That would make a family no?
What do you think? Can a person that believes Jesus is the Son, but not God be saved?
Perhaps you can show the logic more explicitly, of how Titus 3:15 shows that repentance CAUSES regeneration. I don't see it there. I would also like to know how the notion of repentance uncaused by regeneration is possible in those who are slaves to sin, dead in sin, unable to submit to God's law and unable to please God. Reformed theology chimes right in with Titus 3:15.
Romans 10:9-13 (NASB)
9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;
10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.
11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."
12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him;
13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."
Colossians 1:13-20 (NASB)
13 For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,
14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.
17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.
18 He is also head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything.
19 For it was the Father's good pleasure for all the fullness to dwell in Him,
20 and through Him to reconcile all things to Himself, having made peace through the blood of His cross; through Him, I say, whether things on earth or things in heaven.
Colossians 2:8-9 (NASB)
8 See to it that no one takes you captive through philosophy and empty deception, according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary principles of the world, rather than according to Christ.
9 For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form,
To believe in Jesus as Saviour but not as God, is to believe in another Jesus, a Jesus not of Scripture, who, not being God, cannot serve as the perfect once-for-all atonement for the sin of all mankind. There is salvation only in the Jesus revealed to us in the Bible (John 14:6; Acts 4:12; 1 Timothy 1:25). No other version of Jesus will do; not the prophet-Jesus the Muslims put forward, nor the created-Jesus of the cults (JWs, Mormons, SDAs, etc.), nor the good-teacher-Jesus of the humanist/atheist. Only God incarnate in the Person of Christ can save. And he does, as we put our trust in him - not some lesser counterfeit.
I knew someone would chime in with Romans 10, that’s why I specifically pointed out that LORD in the NT is Kurios, not YWHW.
In the Old Testament they chose to translate the Tetragrammaton as LORD instead of YHWH, or Yahweh.
In the NT the word LORD is Kurios, not YHWH.
Kurios can mean master, or sir, or even mister - that word does not prove Jesus is God in Romans 10.
Once again, show us one place where Jesus taught salvation by faith that He is God.
Quoting non salvational passages in the Bible that prove Jesus is God such as Colossians 2, does not prove that a brand new believer has to understand His divinity to be saved.
A new believer is a baby, and can only feed at first on the milk of the word, said Paul.
[STAFF EDITED DELETED QUOTE]
I know how I was saved. I'm not clear about how we stay saved. I think we should admit we are sinners still, in need of grace and forgiveness.
I believe we must overcome mortal sin in order to be saved. Do you believe that we are sinners in the sense of committing mortal sin all the time (even in our continued walk with God)? If so, do you have Scripture verses to support your conclusion on this?
Sorry for not replying to your previous post. I was going to, just wanted to think it through. I will give you a reply tomorrow. See you then! God bless!
1. Repentance is part of conversion so that our sins can be forgiven:
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
Above, note that repentance precedes sins being forgiven.
Same passage in ISV:
Act 3:18 This is how God fulfilled what he had predicted through the voice of all the prophets—that his Messiah would suffer.
Act 3:19 Therefore, repent and turn to him to have your sins blotted out,
2. Jesus said He came to call sinners unto repentance.
He certainly thought sinners were capable of repenting when they were yet sinners:
Luk 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
3. John the Baptist, who came to prepare the way of Jesus, the Lord, taught the principle that repentance is for the remission of sins, and didn’t teach that the remission of sins causes repentance:
Mar 1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
Mar 1:5 And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins.
4. In addition to the fact that Jesus came to call sinners unto repentance, in point number 2, He also said this after His resurrection:
Luk 24:46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
Luk 24:47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
Reformed theology is chiming in with a warped chime.
FWIW, In good ways and bad, what is called "Calvinism" is not identical to Calvin's belief and teachings. If, as you claim, "whosoever" means everyone without exception (i.e. that out of everyone that did, does or will exist whosoever believes will have eternal life) I have no objections --after all, I don't see how you (or Calvin himself) could have meant that absolutely everyone believed, believes or will believe-- but to use that to imply that John 3:16 says that Jesus has died for the sins of the whole human race is more than is warranted. Nevertheless, what does "for" mean? It is rather obvious in all Scripture, that there is only one way for ANYONE (of the whole human race) to be saved, so in that sense "for" can be used to say that he died for the world; but the question is moot here --that verse does not say he died for the whole world, but that he loved the world.Reformed theology rejects the Bible's position on salvation, by changing the meaning of passages like John 3:16, where even John Calvin says, that "whosoever" means "everyone without exception", which is hardly "Calvinistic" language! If, as here the Bible says, that Jesus Christ has died for the sins of the whole human race, then it is obvious to those who don't hold to Calvinistic theology, that Jesus' blood is available for the "whosoever" that He has died for! It is only by the "limitations" placed on Jesus' death by your "theology", that says that Jesus only died for "His sheep". This is unbiblical rubbish!
I wondered the same thing. It was not I who brought that verse into the argument.Titus 3:15?
What does that have to do with faith and regeneration? Maybe you quoted the wrong verse?
I prefer God over your post.
FWIW, In good ways and bad, what is called "Calvinism" is not identical to Calvin's belief and teachings. If, as you claim, "whosoever" means everyone without exception (i.e. that out of everyone that did, does or will exist whosoever believes will have eternal life) I have no objections --after all, I don't see how you (or Calvin himself) could have meant that absolutely everyone believed, believes or will believe-- but to use that to imply that John 3:16 says that Jesus has died for the sins of the whole human race is more than is warranted. Nevertheless, what does "for" mean? It is rather obvious in all Scripture, that there is only one way for ANYONE (of the whole human race) to be saved, so in that sense "for" can be used to say that he died for the world; but the question is moot here --that verse does not say he died for the whole world, but that he loved the world.
You didn't say it, but I think you meant to say that "whosoever" implies the elect and non-elect are equally likely to believe. It does not. It is true that whosoever believes will have everlasting life, but just who is that "whosoever"? Only those to whom God has granted mercy, and faith through regeneration --those he chose. Nobody else will come to believe in Christ.
I am sure that a person can believe in the full Deity of Jesus Christ, and have an unbiblical view of His Death.
but to use that to imply that John 3:16 says that Jesus has died for the sins of the whole human race is more than is warranted
Bond-servant,
Could you please give a couple examples of this theology from published authors?
Thanks,
Oz
very simple. the so called "reformed" theology teaches that Jesus Christ died only for the "elect", and the Holy Bible is clear, that Jesus died for "the whole human race", something that even John Calvin, who these claim to follow, teaches, that the "whosoever" in John 3:16, means, "everyone without exception", and that the "many" in Mark 14:24, is, "Which is shed for many. By the word many he means not a part of the world only, but the whole human race; for he contrasts many with one; as if he had said, that he will not be the Redeemer of one man only, but will die in order to deliver many from the condemnation of the curse.".
Bond-servant,
In my further investigation of Calvin on his view of the atonement, I discovered he was a fence-sitter. Sometimes he believed in universal atonement for the whole world and at other times it was limited to the elect. See my further research at: Was John Calvin a TULIP Calvinist?
Oz
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?