• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Status
Not open for further replies.

ladodgers6

Know what you believe and why you believe it
Site Supporter
Oct 6, 2015
2,324
791
Los Angeles
✟251,002.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Thank you for honoring my request and answering this question.Okay we in the Reformed position do not deny this.That God's commands us to preach the Gospel to every creature.This is what we call the Universal announcement.But who are the ones who will hear Christ's voice in this Gospel call? Who are the ones who will believe and repent of their sins? Because all of us are dead zombies walking.We walk according to the course of this world before God saves us from it.John 3 states that everyone HATES the LIGHT,and LOVES the darkness.I know you will disagree with me,and that's okay.Because people just do not know HOW FAR WE HAVE FALLEN FROM GOD'S GLORY! One will not understand Grace,because they do not understand how great sin really is! And this is the problem when presenting the Gospel to people,because they have no clue why they need a Savior in the first place.The common consensus among the average Joe,is that people are good enough to go to heaven.Not that they need a Redeemer to save them from their horrible predicament before a Holy God who will judge us for every sin we have done! Do I believe people understand the Gospel,yes.But do they believe in it ,is another matter all together. The marvelous news of the Gospel,that people refuse to believe is that God gives us freely in Christ everything we need to be saved.There is no stipulation or a fine print obligation that we overlook in order to be saved.It is finished in Christ,and offered to everyone,but applied only to those who believe in Christ!
I guess when questions get tough skip over them.This is the problem I encounter when I discuss crucial matters.Face them and answer these questions.Do not make remarks of going off on tangents! If you believe in what you believe,then you will not have a problem facing these tough questions! You keep accusing me by judging me.But you make no rebuttal to disprove what I have written! Just empty words and accusations.This is not a debate? I would rather you make a argument in defense of your position,instead of constantly throwing rocks.

Christ secured and sealed our Redemption at the Cross.Christ did not die in vain,in hoping we would complete what he could not! God is a God of Promise who will and did save his people from their sins.Its by Christ's finished work and resurrection that secured our salvation.

1 Corinthians 1:30

30 But by His doing you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, and righteousness and sanctification, and redemption,

By whose DOING????????????????????????????????????
 
Reactions: nobdysfool
Upvote 0

sdowney717

Newbie
Apr 20, 2013
8,712
2,022
✟117,598.00
Faith
Christian
"In Galatians 2,Paul says that NO FLESH will be justified through the Law." because by works of the law no one will be justified." (Galatians 2:16)"
Exactly true.
There are a few who believe and teach works righteousness. And justification by works of the law. This is an antichrist spirit at work in their life.
Such persons will also display other heresies, such as Paul is a false apostle.

James 2:10 "For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all."

Ecclesiastes 7:20 "For there is not a righteous man upon the earth, that does good and does not sin."

Hebrews 10:1-4 "For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make those who come to it perfect.
For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.
But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.
For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins."

The just shall live by his faith.

ROMANS 3:20
20 Therefore by the works of the law1 there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

ROMANS 3:27-28
27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? No: but by the law of faith.
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the works of the law.

Habakkuk 2
4 “Behold the proud,
His soul is not upright in him;
But the just shall live by his faith.


ROMANS 9:31-32

31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were by the works of the law1. For they stumbled at that stumbling-stone;


ROMANS 10:3-4 (Paul)

3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves to the righteousness of God.
4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one who believes.

Clearly those who teach otherwise to scripture are deceived and very much so. Not being submitted to the righteousness of God, they pursue their own sanctification by works, and where their destiny will be if they do not repent will be hell. They are not trusting in Christ for their righteousness, but their own obedience. They fall into the curse, just like those in Israel who pursued righteousness by works of the law and not by faith. Another thing, anyone who desires to be justified by works of the law, well there is no more animal sacrifices, so they can never follow the law can they, an instant fail. How deceived they are.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

jimmyjimmy

Pardoned Rebel
Site Supporter
Jan 2, 2015
11,556
5,727
USA
✟257,503.00
Country
United States
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married

Brother, you are brave, naive and a bit crazy to think that a well-stated rational explanation of these things would have any other result than people, at best misunderstanding you, and at worst wishing you burned at the stake.

I'm on your side, and I'll be holding the fire extinguisher, but I hope that I don't have to use it. . .
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

sdowney717

Newbie
Apr 20, 2013
8,712
2,022
✟117,598.00
Faith
Christian

The topic does serve as a discussion vehicle to present the truth and people are free to object or agree with God writing down in His book what people have said. Jesus said by your words you will be justified or condemned so that is evidence for and against them on the judgement Day.

A Tree Known by Its Fruit
Matthew 12

33 “Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or else make the tree bad and its fruit bad; for a tree is known by its fruit. 34 Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. 35 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth good things, and an evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth evil things. 36 But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment.
37 For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”

I like this passage, it points out God makes the tree, which is you and me, either good or bad by its nature. And points out the evil heart speaks from itself evil things and can not do anything good, unless God makes the nature of the tree, a good tree.
There exists no good trees bearing bad fruit, which is what the works righteousness people teach. Those people are against Christ and God, so then antichrists..
Matthew 7
15 “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them.
 
Upvote 0

ladodgers6

Know what you believe and why you believe it
Site Supporter
Oct 6, 2015
2,324
791
Los Angeles
✟251,002.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Amen! Its only by the perfect finished work of the Last Adam that we are saved!
 
Reactions: sdowney717
Upvote 0

ladodgers6

Know what you believe and why you believe it
Site Supporter
Oct 6, 2015
2,324
791
Los Angeles
✟251,002.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Why do people talk like this? Really is this display of poor behavior necessary? If you have a rebuttal to the point,then just present it.There is absolutely no need for this anti-christian talk! In these words there is no argument or a point to offer to the discussion.Only malice,hatred,slander and judgment that you should not do,correct?
 
Upvote 0

jimmyjimmy

Pardoned Rebel
Site Supporter
Jan 2, 2015
11,556
5,727
USA
✟257,503.00
Country
United States
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married

A bit of an overly dramatic reply, no? Which only serves to prove my point.

My comment was a bit tongue in cheek, which many here would not understand, which also explains my point.

Stick around here long enough, and you will see the insanity first-hand. Until then, cut a brother some slack, please.

I have tee shirts with Calvin's picture on them, so I'm on your side. Try to understand humor when you see it, and in the immortal words of Sergeant Hulka, "Lighten up Francis".
 
Last edited:
Reactions: Marvin Knox
Upvote 0

ladodgers6

Know what you believe and why you believe it
Site Supporter
Oct 6, 2015
2,324
791
Los Angeles
✟251,002.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Why would anyone wish this," and at worst wishing you burned at the stake." And think its okay,its just humor? Then you say that I am overly dramatic? No,Sir! This is not okay! People are so quick to hurl a insult at someone,that a kind word.That in the world,does this statement bring than malice? Saying to someone that they wish they burn at the stake,is not in any way Humorous! But you will not see the non-sense in it,will you?
 
Upvote 0

jimmyjimmy

Pardoned Rebel
Site Supporter
Jan 2, 2015
11,556
5,727
USA
✟257,503.00
Country
United States
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married

I have no idea what you are saying. Are from the US? Maybe there is a language barrier. I did not wish ANYONE burned at the stake. Either English is your second language or you have too literal an understanding of things. If neither of these is the case, I will refrain from replying to you to avoid further misunderstandings.

You've completely missed my point, which was that debates on this subject often digress into name calling and mud slinging even when one is trying to be reasonable and rational in his arguments. Often one is misunderstood, and even hated because of his Calvinistis views. This is the context of my comments, which hopefully helps you to understand what I was saying.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

jimmyjimmy

Pardoned Rebel
Site Supporter
Jan 2, 2015
11,556
5,727
USA
✟257,503.00
Country
United States
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
The topic does serve as a discussion vehicle to present the truth and people are free to object or agree with

Yes. I understand. What I was saying (with humor) was that I've read many of these threads, and I've seen how they end up. There are many very hostile people here, many of them on the Arminian side of the issue. They can be very unreasonable, and often resort to personal attacks rather than a reasonable exchanges of ideas. I've seen the futility of trying to reason with certain people who always seem to show up for these threads.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

GillDouglas

Reformed Christian
Dec 21, 2013
1,117
450
USA
Visit site
✟36,925.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
God does not compel anyone to be saved, so that's the second false teaching coming from Gill.
I'm curious why you've contradicted yourself from post #67?

Who does compel them? Who has the Father given them to? Who draws them? Who is powerful and perfect? If your answer is men, you're the false teacher.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

ladodgers6

Know what you believe and why you believe it
Site Supporter
Oct 6, 2015
2,324
791
Los Angeles
✟251,002.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Look Brian,thanks for your side of it.And I personally what you are saying here.What better way to refute such behavior that these people present us,than with the truth,gentleness,understanding,patience,love,kindness? What purpose do we achieve by hurling insults back? Again believe me I know first hand what you mean,because I have been called almost every name under the sun.But will I do with it? What will I profit from attacking back? Instead we must present the truth,and that's it.
 
Upvote 0

jimmyjimmy

Pardoned Rebel
Site Supporter
Jan 2, 2015
11,556
5,727
USA
✟257,503.00
Country
United States
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married

Point taken, but I would say it's overstated. I don't see my comment as attacking. I'll leave as to not derail the thread.
 
Upvote 0

GillDouglas

Reformed Christian
Dec 21, 2013
1,117
450
USA
Visit site
✟36,925.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
Point taken, but I would say it's overstated. I don't see my comment as attacking. I'll leave as to not derail the thread.
I appreciate the comments you've provided to impress upon the Biblical Truth on the Salvation of men, brother.
 
Upvote 0

ToBeLoved

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jan 3, 2014
18,705
5,818
✟368,235.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
You must admit even your interpretation does not benefit unbelievers, which is what I had asked earlier.
Christ dying for believers accomplishes their eternal salvation. What does it do for unbelievers?
Until each person has died there is still time for their salvation.

It's not over until death.
 
Upvote 0

ladodgers6

Know what you believe and why you believe it
Site Supporter
Oct 6, 2015
2,324
791
Los Angeles
✟251,002.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Until each person has died there is still time for their salvation.

It's not over until death.
By Christ's death and resurrection,he has sealed and secured our Justification,Sanctification and Redemption (1 Cor. 1:30).Its by God's Promise that he will save his people!
 
Upvote 0

ToBeLoved

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jan 3, 2014
18,705
5,818
✟368,235.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
By Christ's death and resurrection,he has sealed and secured our Justification,Sanctification and Redemption (1 Cor. 1:30).Its by God's Promise that he will save his people!
I agree.

My premise was that as long as a human being is alive, there is a chance that they will accept Jesus CHrist as savior. Which is why we share the gospel, to bring unsaved people to Christ.
 
Upvote 0

ladodgers6

Know what you believe and why you believe it
Site Supporter
Oct 6, 2015
2,324
791
Los Angeles
✟251,002.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
I agree.

My premise was that as long as a human being is alive, there is a chance that they will accept Jesus CHrist as savior. Which is why we share the gospel, to bring unsaved people to Christ.
The Gospel is for the ungodly,not for the righteous.Keep preaching the Gospel,for it is the power of God unto Salvation for those who believe.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

ToBeLoved

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jan 3, 2014
18,705
5,818
✟368,235.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
TOkay we in the Reformed position do not deny this.That God's commands us to preach the Gospel to every creature.This is what we call the Universal announcement.

Why would anyone further confuse things by calling the gospel, the universal announcement? That is the most confusing thing I have almost ever heard. Take something as simple as the gospel that most people understand what it means and rename it something as vague as the 'universal announcement'? Are you kidding me?
 
Upvote 0

ToBeLoved

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jan 3, 2014
18,705
5,818
✟368,235.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
The Gospel is who the ungodly,not for the righteous.Keep preaching the Gospel,for it is the power of God unto Salvation for those who believe.
What?

Can you please rewrite your sentence so I can answer what ever your trying to say (above)?
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.