Calvin quote

[redleghunter]

Sure, the wings would become part of its new nature. And the willful refusal to use them could be justly punished.

So everyone gets a new nature but some wings work and others don’t? How is that just?

 

[redleghunter]

Now you are insinuating that God learns things.

Which is open theism.

 

[redleghunter]

So which is it... do we chose to sin or is it simply our nature and we cannot do otherwise?

We choose according to the master we serve. Romans 6 is clear on this.

 

[redleghunter]

He can’t be just if they were incapable of complying with His commandments.

I guess the Pharisees, Pilate and Judas just got a special “raw deal.”

 

[redleghunter]

Bob determines what God knew before time.

Bob chooses what God needs to know?

 

[JSRG]

In the future, could you combine all of these various replies into just one or two posts? By making a separate post for each one, you're cluttering up the topic a lot more, and it seems especially unnecessary given some of the posts aren't even 10 words long.

 

[redleghunter]

Or maybe we do not understand what he means by nature. But I agree that is seems so far that he is either knowingly or unknowingly believing in a logical contradiction.

Seems pretty clear the OP argument follows the clear logic of St Paul’s epistle to the Romans.

 

[redleghunter]

How do you define the term "nature" itself? What is it?

Ephesians 4:

20But this is not the way you came to know Christ. 21Surely you heard of Him and were taught in Him, in keeping with the truth that is in Jesus, 22to put off your former way of life, your old self, which is being corrupted by its deceitful desires;23to be renewed in the spirit of your minds; 24and to put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness.

 

[redleghunter]

No God had that knowledge before time began.

Which means God waited for Bob to make his “decision”

 

[redleghunter]

They have the ability to repent and God will grant them grace if they repent.

Where does this ability come from and Who exactly grants repentance?

 

[redleghunter]

That sounds an awful lot like Pelagianism.

At least semi-Pelagian

 

[redleghunter]

So our nature is constantly changing?

When somebody desires to do something good, his nature is good in that moment and when the same person desires to do something evil, his nature is evil in that moment?

Depends on Who or who is master.

 

[redleghunter]

No it’s synergism. The calling is already there for everyone to accept.

How does that work exactly?

 

[redleghunter]

So that God could justify their punishment on judgement day.

God is already just in condemning sinners. He owes us nothing. You seem to think He does.

No one can come to Me unless The Father draws him. Why would The Father allow people whom He knows will not abide in Christ to come to Him?

Quite a distortion of the text. This states no one will come to Christ unless the Father draws them. Putting aside your personal litmus test of God having to be “fair”, have you considered not all are drawn? You know “many are called but few are chosen.”

 

[redleghunter]

I do not want to get into splitting hairs.

An orchard laborer pruned a peach tree. A peach tree put out more branches than it needed. With too many branches and leaves, none of the branches get a full amount of sun. They all need sap and nutrients. It is not efficient. The pruner was trained to see what ones to cut off and what ones to keep. This was done to make the peach tree produce more peaches.

God will decide what to give and to whom to give it to.

Is that from a Joel Osteen book?

 

[redleghunter]

In the future, could you combine all of these various replies into just one or two posts? By making a separate post for each one, you're cluttering up the topic a lot more, and it seems especially unnecessary given some of the posts aren't even 10 words long.

Welcome to CF.

 

[renniks]

Whatever God does is just.

Ah, but the question then is what does he do? He doesn't condemn people to destruction. They do that to themselves. I would not agree with the quote for several reasons. We don't know how God planned the creation. There's too much speculation involved. We only have our theories.

 

[redleghunter]

Ah, but the question then is what does he do? He doesn't condemn people to destruction. They do that to themselves. I would not agree with the quote for several reasons. We don't know how God planned the creation. There's too much speculation involved. We only have our theories.

Was this accidentally posted in the CT forum?

 

[renniks]

Was this accidentally posted in the CT forum?

Don't know what you mean.

 

[GraceBro]

“he arranges all things by his sovereign counsel, in such a way that individuals are born, who are doomed from the womb to certain death, and are to glorify him by their destruction.”

Calvin’s Institutes, Book 3 Chapter 23 paragraph 6.

Assuming that the doctrine of Open Theism is false (which we must do in this forum), is this a true or false statement, and why?

Calvin was heavily influenced by Augustine, who was most known for using the pagan, Greek philosophy of Plato and Aristotle to interpret the Bible. This is false in my opinion.