Bishop calls for pope francis to convert or step down

[mea kulpa]

Wow how far has this thread been derailed... this is crazy

 

[ChristianFromKazakhstan]

this is crazy

"For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God". 1 Corinthians 1:18

Jesus Christ is the LORD!!!

No other name to be saved by.

 

[SnowyMacie]

.

 

[paul becke]

I have to say i totally agree with the bishop francis is a fundamental danger to the faith and the souls he is supposed to care for

Bishop Schneider: “Convert” or “renounce the papacy”

Schneider seems very confused, accusing Francis' progressive followers, rather than his own 'traditionalist' clan, of clericalism. He makes a shibboleth out of receiving the Sacred Host in the hand, in the same way that the Pharisees in the Gospel made a shibboleth of an exaggerated observance of the sabbath, ironically in a curiously related context, i.e. when his men ate ears of corn, growing in the fields they had passed through.

That exaggerated prioritisation of the Sabbath duties would, in reality, have been, by way of claiming an exaggerated reverence for themselves that they sought from the people ; and I fear clericalists of the 'bitter-ender' Tridentine persuasion among the clergy of all ranks of the hierarchy would be motivated by the same 'aspiration'.

The ovine metaphor is just that - a metaphor. It is adopted, 'other Christs', 'priests after the order of Melchisedek, we hope, who receive Holy communion, not hapless myrmidons, required to imitate barnyard animals - mythical, at that, since farm animals do not need to be hand-fed.

Clericalism at its worst. 'Know ye not that ye are gods ?' Fat chance of seeing other people as figures of Christ, if we ignore Christ's own words on the subject, for fear of detracting from the lustre of the hierarchical priesthood. No wonder it has been so easy to marginalise the poor more than ever, and throw them out of their homes onto the streets.

Both Peter, arguably, the Prince of the church par excellence and an angel in the Apocalypse told people to get up of their knees, since they were themselves merely servants of God, like themselves.

 

[mea kulpa]

Schneider seems very confused, accusing Francis' progressive followers, rather than his own 'traditionalist' clan, of clericalism. He makes a shibboleth out of receiving the Sacred Host in the hand, in the same way that the Pharisees in the Gospel made a shibboleth of an exaggerated observance of the sabbath, ironically in a curiously related context, i.e. when his men ate ears of corn, growing in the fields they had passed through.

That exaggerated prioritisation of the Sabbath duties would, in reality, have been, by way of claiming an exaggerated reverence for themselves that they sought from the people ; and I fear clericalists of the 'bitter-ender' Tridentine persuasion among the clergy of all ranks of the hierarchy would be motivated by the same 'aspiration'.

The ovine metaphor is just that - a metaphor. It is adopted, 'other Christs', 'priests after teh ordermof Mechisedek, we hope, who receive Holy communion, not 'nobodies', required to imitate barnyard animals - mythical, at that, since farm animals do not need to be hand-fed. Clericalism at its worst.

Difference is the law of the church says no one other than the ordained minister ( priest) should touch the eucharist. Handling the eucharist started in holland after V2 The holy see granted an exception in their case then everybody piled in asking for this exception

The prefered and really what they mean is the correct way of recieving is kneeling and on the tongue

 

[paul becke]

Difference is the law of the church says no one other than the ordained minister ( priest) should touch the eucharist. Handling the eucharist started in holland after V2 The holy see granted an exception in their case then everybody piled in asking for this exception

The prefered and really what they mean is the correct way of recieving is kneeling and on the tongue

Yes, the law of the church is not inviolable, and must have undergone many changes over the centuries.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Question: the Popes are supposed to be chosen by God, right? It must be that way if he's all knowing, all powerful, and determines everything. Even discounting that though, why would God put a Pope in power who could change the faith unless He wanted it that way?

Plus, if the Pope is supposedly infallible on matters of faith, then must what he officially says in terms of faith-matters be seen as God-given fact? If not, how can we tell? Are we cherry-picking? If Popes aren't infallible in matters of faith, how can we know what is true of our faith if God doesn't give signs and messages like he used to?

Are they calling for the pope to step down?

 

[mea kulpa]

Yes, the law of the church is not inviolable, and must have undergone many changes over the centuries.

Somethings are somethings are not.

 

[paul becke]

Somethings are somethings are not.

Precisely.

 

[JacksBratt]

Question: the Popes are supposed to be chosen by God, right? It must be that way if he's all knowing, all powerful, and determines everything. Even discounting that though, why would God put a Pope in power who could change the faith unless He wanted it that way?

Plus, if the Pope is supposedly infallible on matters of faith, then must what he officially says in terms of faith-matters be seen as God-given fact? If not, how can we tell? Are we cherry-picking? If Popes aren't infallible in matters of faith, how can we know what is true of our faith if God doesn't give signs and messages like he used to?

The Pope is not chosen by God. Nor is he put in power by God...

This is all the work of man's hand. God knows it's going to happen and nothing surprises Him. God allows it to happen but doesn't control it.

All the leaders of the past and the ones to be chosen in the future are known to God and He will use their decisions for His will.

 

[ChristianFromKazakhstan]

troll?

Since when proclaiming Jesus Christ is trolling?

End times...

 

[SolomonVII]

There is only one Heavenly Father

And, where is the answer to my question?

 

[Armoured]

I've thought about it, but the Anglican church seems to be a better fit for what I believe.

Fair enough. I like the Anglos, too.

 

[Armoured]

Wow how far has this thread been derailed... this is crazy

Considering the starting point...

 

[fide]

All I know about Catholic church is inquisition and burning multitudes beautiful smart women of Europe as witches and also selling indulgentias for sins and worshiping human gods like Mary or saints. Also forced conversions of muslims and judaists to Catholics and killing of Gugenots etc protestants by 100s of thousands in one night.

All of that and perhaps more is far away from Jesus like the east from the west. Papa of Rome is like god, all he says is final divine authority. This is like robbing God of His throne. I have Spirit of God in me, no need in external sinful erroneous papas

You have been given a one-dimensional, biased "history" - Such is not real history: it is more accurately called propaganda, not history. The Catholic Church has enemies who profit from this mis-education, such that they can gather people into their own "christianity", to support their own agendas and plans and goals. It is sad, it is untrue, it is deceitful.

Look for a Catholic version of history! If it is a good history, it will bring out both the good and the bad in the organized Church.

 

[CrystalDragon]

The Pope is not chosen by God. Nor is he put in power by God...

This is all the work of man's hand. God knows it's going to happen and nothing surprises Him. God allows it to happen but doesn't control it.

All the leaders of the past and the ones to be chosen in the future are known to God and He will use their decisions for His will.

It's said though 1. that God controls everything, even the roll of the die, and 2. all governments/those in power are put in power by God. So yes, they are all chosen by God including the Pope. Either "God is in control" of everything according to his divine plan or he's not.

 

[ChristianFromKazakhstan]

And, where is the answer to my question?

I gave it to you. I can elaborate. True parent is one. It's our God. It's answer from the Lord Jesus Christ. And it's very true.

 

[ChristianFromKazakhstan]

It's said though 1. that God controls everything, even the roll of the die, and 2. all governments/those in power are put in power by God. So yes, they are all chosen by God including the Pope. Either "God is in control" of everything according to his divine plan or he's not.

It's more comicated that that... There is also Satan...

 

[CrystalDragon]

It's more comicated that that... There is also Satan...

But especially in the Old Testament God was in control of all things both good and evil. Satan wasn't "in charge of evil" until the New Testament. And in any case, if God is in control and everything happens according to his plan, then whatever influence Satan has must be part of it too for some reason.

 

[ChristianFromKazakhstan]

You have been given a one-dimensional, biased "history" - Such is not real history: it is more accurately called propaganda, not history. The Catholic Church has enemies who profit from this mis-education, such that they can gather people into their own "christianity", to support their own agendas and plans and goals. It is sad, it is untrue, it is deceitful.

Look for a Catholic version of history! If it is a good history, it will bring out both the good and the bad in the organized Church.

I understand. But I disagree. It wasn't a nice history. And the facts I give are only the tip of the iceberg. I do not even mention involvement of Catholic church in a bad way in the world politics throughout her history.

Well, Jesus did not create the Catholic or Orthodox or Baptist or whatever church organisation. They are all but human creations, of blind proud humans far from Jesus. Our Lord created a global body of true believers and followers of His. They exist in all so-called "churches" and apart from them. All human churches are full of imposters. The true worldwide ecclesia is built on the rock of Peter that will withstand the attack of the gates of hell.

Jesus didn't teach to pray to His mother or to "saints". Only to Heavenly Father, who is God. But only once I was at a Catholic mass, and before its commencement they chanted Hail Mary a few dozens times... It's very sad.