Atheists go to hell even if they are good!?

[b&wpac7]

Indeed I probably would. I have watched every debate I have found of Rabi Wolpe, and I have much respect for Jewish ethics and tradition.

And, believe it or not, I have respect for atheists who refuse to believe until evidence is presented. I used to be one of you until I found evidence good enough to convince me. I don't try to convince others though.

 

[kittycat7]

I didn't have time to read the whole thread but it really depends on who you ask. A lot of Christians believe all non-believers will end up in hell. Personally, I believe in hell but I don't think whether you end up there or not is entirely dependent on what you do or don't believe. Beliefs and philosophies only determine your eternal destiny as far as they influence your actions, thoughts, character, life...

 

[CaliforniaSun]

And, believe it or not, I have respect for atheists who refuse to believe until evidence is presented. I used to be one of you until I found evidence good enough to convince me. I don't try to convince others though.

Yes, I can believe it. I have many friends of faith, and TBH, this topic doesn't come up too much, and when it does, both positions are respected.

 

[Rajni]

Oh, I love it when people claim to be prophets.

Oh yes... if there's one thing I have learned in all the years I have been involved in these sorts of exchanges, it's that the Pope definitely has some serious competition on his hands!

 

[Rajni]

Perhaps this explains the differences between many? Children reach a stage where they are not within their parent's reach, and must be responsible for themselves. I think they call that maturity

Is there ever an age at which we are out of an Omnipresent, Omnipotent God's reach? I think not. We're never too mature to need Him, are we?

 

[Rajni]

Except "love me or else" is not an accurate portrayal of the Gospel, while the Bride-Groom relationship found in Scripture IS.

Yes, I agree. Now if only those who believe that Gospel would preach accordingly, lol!

 

[Rajni]

It hinges upon "who" we believe/trust. If we believe the wrong god we are surely doomed.

However it still seems to hinge on our believing/trusting correctly, regardless of whether it's a Who, What, Where, When, How, or Why that is the focus of that belief/trust.

 

[Rajni]

"Free from constraints" is just plain silly. We can each do whatever we're big and bad enough to do ...

Not quite. We have limited ability to choose, based upon divinely-established constraints. We are not omnipotent.

 

[Doveaman]

Nope. But the general concensus among Christians is that hell is eternal torture.

Well, I'm an annihilationist, so the only "torment" I'm aware of is the one Christ mentioned here:

"This is how it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come and separate the wicked from the righteous and throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." - Matt 13:49-50.

 

[CaliforniaSun]

Well, I'm an annihilationist, so the only "torment" I'm aware of is the one Christ mentioned here:

"This is how it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come and separate the wicked from the righteous and throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth." - Matt 13:49-50.

I can handle weeping and teeth gnashing... bring it.

 

[The Beautiful Heresy]

This is a process baby Christians go through, until realizing there is no switch on the back of the head to make us automatically obey G-d. As faas as G-d being a nut, that is what He says with "it repented me that I made man," re: Noah. Also, hell was not created for man, but for the devil and his angels. Account for these differences and see what you come up with ...

What exactly is the process that baby Christians go through? I'd like to hear your version.

I personally believe baby Christians go through a process ( usually ) of believing in eternal torment and then they ( some ) mature into hearing God for themselves and not what 'they' were commanded or demanded to believe about God.

Baby Christians usually do believe in eternal torment.

 

[Doveaman]

Whoa... Time out! I seem to have lost the track.

Yeah, me too.

May we start anew?

So if I am in Hell, I am lost for God.

You end up in Hell because you are lost, so yes.

He cannot achive his goal of having me reconciled with him any more. Correct?

According to my knowledge, yes He cannot.

And now I asked you whether it is better for God not to achive this goal than to achive it. New question. Can you give a new answer?

If you are in hell then it is better for God not to achieve His goal with you. And that's why you are in hell. Because it is better.

 

[razeontherock]

So every single Non-Christian then is both aware and is consciously and deliberately rejecting God's gift?

That's quite the lapse in both logic and conversation

 

[razeontherock]

The argument is accurately that God sending or allowing people to go to hell purely for not believing in him is immoral and indefensible.

Which means what, exactly?

 

[Ampersand]

So then your god deliberately allows people to never hear of him?

 

[razeontherock]

If you don't believe in your religion and believe in God then you won't have the possibility of pain and torture after death. Yet if you trust in your religion, or any other, then you do have the possibility of going to hell and being tortured for eternity.

Um, wut? Where does this idea come from?

 

[razeontherock]

Oh yes... if there's one thing I have learned in all the years I have been involved in these sorts of exchanges, it's that the Pope definitely has some serious competition on his hands!

Does anyone claim the Pope is any sort of Prophet?

 

[razeontherock]

Is there ever an age at which we are out of an Omnipresent, Omnipotent God's reach? I think not. We're never too mature to need Him, are we?

Needing Him and being responsible for our own actions are 2 different things. Quite a lot came with His giving man dominion, and included in that is your in front of a mack truck scenario.

 

[razeontherock]

Yes, I agree. Now if only those who believe that Gospel would preach accordingly, lol!

But that would be ... hard. (Not a laughing matter though)

It's not "love me or else." It's that Love burns out the other options. We see this throughout Scripture.

 

[Skavau]

That's quite the lapse in both logic and conversation

Yes it is. But it is what you said.

I earlier said, in response to Zaac smearing all Non-Christians:

This is simply untrue. The 'some' that you are referring to are simply unaware of God's 'giving his life' and are unaware even of God existing. The fact that you would make excuses for that groups eternal torture is both troubling and nonsensical.

Your response was:

This is not only untrue, but silly. Those being referred to are those that are aware, and choose to reject.

Zaac was referring to all Non-Christians. Does this mean, if what I said was untrue that all Non-Christians are willfully rejecting God? Because that is precisely what Zaac believes and he has been doggedly consistent about getting that through.