Atheism Disproven?

[Estrid]

not a riddle in the sense to mislead ... but yes its the mystery of the ages ... albet it is seen in everything ... truth hidden in plain sight thing ...

Misuse of elipses is a class b misdemeanour.

 

[honey badger]

Which does not change the point that the absence of a theism is not itself a theism.

it is a belief and therefor a perception none the less ... or why else would you be posting on this forum !

 

[Estrid]

Deletrd

 

[Larniavc]

Anything that takes the place of God in your life is considered to be false worship.

But this is the myopia of the religious when it comes trying to think like an atheist. There is no god shaped hole in our lives that needs to be substituted with something else.

We are just like you except we do not believe in gods. There is no other difference.

 

[honey badger]

Misuse of elipses is a class b misdemeanour.

when something is scribed on a rock or hung on a tree it is in picture a lie ... truth havng no measure to it ...

edit: removed the word "it"

 

[Estrid]

when something is scribed on a rock it or hung on a tree it is in picture a lie ... truth havng no measure to it ...

Unresponsive, circular file, off to ig city

 

[Larniavc]

not a riddle in the sense to mislead ... but yes its the mystery of the ages ... albet it is seen in everything ... truth hidden in plain sight thing ...

Dude, this is a debate forum. The mysterious stranger explains all forum is that way >>>>

 

[Larniavc]

it is a belief and therefor a perception none the less ... or why else would you be posting on this forum !

So I don’t live in an echo chamber. If you don’t believe that atheism is not a theism why are you here?

 

[honey badger]

Unresponsive, circular file, off to ig city

the law ( not kept) of our mind forbids us entry into truth/the city because it measures/names everything ...

 

[Estrid]

But this is the myopia of the religious when it comes trying to think like an atheist. There is no god shaped hole in our lives that needs to be substituted with something else.

We are just like you except we do not believe in gods. There is no other difference.

Not sure it's so simple.
Belief in God is the concept on which
everything depends.
They are binary thinkers.
Yes / no, if/or.
The Great Divides are good v evil,
and, is there or is there not a god.
Nothing is more important.

I just don't think that way, at all.

 

[honey badger]

So I don’t live in an echo chamber. If you don’t believe that atheism is not a theism why are you here?

to share my thoughts which are not caught between two fruits of a tree ...

 

[Ken-1122]

You may not consider it a god or worship in the traditional/Christian sense, but something in your life is a god to you (by Christian definition) and takes precedence above all other things. You're worshiping (by secular definition) something without recognizing it as worship.

For me, for the longest time, it was a number of addictions. Over-eating, coffee, gaming, etc. Those were my world and my gods.

ETA: Parentheses added for context.

My familuy takes precedence above all other things; so according to you, I worship my family? So parents worship their children, and children worship their parents? Is this really the Christian definition of worship?

 

[honey badger]

Dude, this is a debate forum. The mysterious stranger explains all forum is that way >>>>

the end of all debate is the futility of it ...

 

[Larniavc]

to share my thoughts which are not caught between two fruits of a tree ...

You might want to talk in normal non salady sentences if you want people to take you seriously. This Yoda thing you are trying to do is not working.

 

[honey badger]

You might want to talk in normal non salady sentences if you want people to take you seriously. This Yoda thing you are trying to do is not working.

words ... when you measure them ( nail them down) they become measured to you ... which is to say it is you who is doing the measuring ...

 

[Petros2015]

Any thoughts on this?

What would qualify something as "a God"?

If it can't be interacted with (there's no reaction from it to my actions) then it falls into more of a "Force of Nature" category, like a flood or an avalanche or Gravity maybe. Get out of it's way or ride the surf as it were.

It acts with intent - there could be a God that did Nothing, I suppose, but I don't think anyone would notice. If it's acting, but without intent, then something else might be acting on it. It would also prefer things were one way and not another (or it would have done nothing). Maybe in the same way Artists prefer canvases not to blank? It's also possible there might have been a God, which finished our canvas and moved on to another.

Something that created what we call the Forces of Nature, but was not itself subject to them and could be interacted with, I suppose, would qualify for me as 'a God'. Which isn't the same as saying 'my God' if either it didn't really care what I did or I didn't care what it's preference was.

If we say 'there is no God', what definition are we using? Does it mean 'there is no Creator God'? Or does it mean, 'there is nothing to which I hold myself accountable'? Certainly there are things which are 'more powerful' than me... but this doesn't mean that we pay much attention to each other (I might even go out of my way to avoid their attention).

So, I guess what I am getting at is this:

How MUCH more powerful than me does something have to be before I would consider it to be 'a' God?
And at what level of relationship do I care? Thor, God of Thunder if he existed might be pretty useful for certain things if we got along and he could be interacted with, but would be unlikely to be able to help with, oh, say, a drinking problem.

I feel like there has to be an element of benevolence and wisdom as well as action and power. A God that wished me ill or was more or less impotent or insane could still be 'a' God just not 'the' God I was looking for. Not really interested in finding a lying God, that wouldn't be helpful.

What would your definition of a God be, if you were looking for one? What would you hope to find, if one was there. And how low could the bar go before you either said 'nope, not a God' or 'not my God'. It's an interesting question.

 

[stevil]

i see no difference between atheisms and christianism ... to me they are just two of many isms ...

Very different.
Christianism comes with scriptures that all Christains base their beliefs over. They believe in characters, concepts and events portrayed in those books/scriptures e.g. god, jesus, adam, eve, moses, noah, genesis of the universe and earth and man and women, they believe in sin, in heaven, in demons and angels. Many go to church or church groups, many go to church leaders for advice.

Atheists have none of this. There is no Atheism. Just individual Atheists.

 

[stevil]

God specifically forbids having other gods, or making any thing in heaven or the earth into a god and worshiping it. God designed us to worship Him.

If we don't worship Him, something else becomes our god. It could be science, philosophy, Star Wars, the Marvel universe, Harry Potter, your favorite hobby, sports, your job, money, sex... any thing in this world. There is something everyone puts front and center in their lives as an object of worship, because it is our created nature.

No matter your beliefs, you worship something. All of us do.The difference between Christians and atheists is who/what you worship. Christians choose to worship God, instead of any thing in the world, because it's what God wants.

I'm an atheist and I don't worship anything or anyone.
I reckon that even if there was a god, let's say a god revealed itself to me, I doubt I would worship it.

 

[comana]

I'm sorry you took offense. It wasn't meant to be offensive.

By the secular definition of worship, we indeed worship things in our lives, we all do—me included. It used to be that a number of things took precedence in my own life. And indeed they met the above definition of worship. Addictions. Pastimes. Wealth.

The secular definition of worship as per Merriam-Webster:

: extravagant respect or admiration for or devotion to an object of esteem
example: worship of the dollar​

You don't have to agree with this definition of worship and how it applies to your own life.

I can’t think of a single thing in my life that that definition would apply to.

 

[stevil]

But this is the myopia of the religious when it comes trying to think like an atheist. There is no god shaped hole in our lives that needs to be substituted with something else.

We are just like you except we do not believe in gods. There is no other difference.

Very much like our collective disbelief in fairies.
It does not impact our lives, we don't walk around thinking about our disbelief in fairies.
We don't worry about whether we are true to our disbelief in fairies.
We don't worry about whether we are pleasing the leader of fairy disbelief (is there a leader?)
We don't seek guidance on how to further strengthen our lack of faith and disbelief in fairies.

Same applies to the gods. We don't worry about whether we are displeasing Zeus, or Vishnu or Allah or YHWH or Tane or Estra (the Easter goddess).

If Fairy believers had a web forum, some of us would probably be on there, if they had rules where we aren't allowed to talk about Fairyism or folklore, then we would probably be talking politics or guns or about ourselfs and our a-fairyism by trying to explain that we don't have a fairy shaped hole that we are filling with other things such as money or love or the such.