Assyrians on Sabbath and Sunday Worship

[FreeinChrist]

ADVISOR HAT


Folks, there is a phrase I have seen here - obvious troll is obvious. Don't egg it on. Don't engage him. Report him. Otherwise you are making a great deal of work for staff.

A clean up was done though it was so big, we could have simply closed the thread. ​

 

[HIM]

ADVISOR HAT


Folks, there is a phrase I have seen here - obvious troll is obvious. Don't egg it on. Don't engage him. Report him. Otherwise you are making a great deal of work for staff.

A clean up was done though it was so big, we could have simply closed the thread. ​

Thanks for not closing the thread

 

[The Liturgist]

ADVISOR HAT


Folks, there is a phrase I have seen here - obvious troll is obvious. Don't egg it on. Don't engage him. Report him. Otherwise you are making a great deal of work for staff.

A clean up was done though it was so big, we could have simply closed the thread. ​

@FreeinChrist just thought I would let you know that for me the thread shows as having 13 pages but page 12 is empty, in case this is indicative of a database issue from the much appreciated troll cleanup.

 

[The Liturgist]

The "context" in all those quotes is Jesus speaking to Jews - so in fact they do apply in that very context.

The idea our Lord had of the Sabbath was clearly disparate from the one that we see his own disciples had, let alone the larger religion. This is why I feel we must look to what happened on the seventh day of Holy Week and the Resurrection to understand the conceptual validity of how the church has interpreted and implemented its diurnal worship cycle.

 

[AdamjEdgar]

Admission request

The Vatican archives

The Vatican secret archives are located in the Vatican City. These archives are under the ownership of the serving Pope until death or resignation. The Vatican secrets mainly contains the state papers, correspondence, papal account books, plus many other documents that have been accumulated by the church over the centuries.Originally, the Vatican Secret Archives were in the Vatican Library but they were separated in the 17th century under the orders of Pope Paul V. The two were separated so as to limit the scholars’ access to the documents. They remained closed until 1881 when Pope Leo XIII opened them to researchers. The Vatican archives obtained the name Vatican secrets archives to show that the archives are private and that they are personal property to the Pope and do not belong to any other department of the Roman Curia.The Vatican secrets contain a lot of information about the governance, management and activities surrounding the Catholic Church. The information has been conserved and it is so large that the Vatican Secret Archives are said to contain approximately 84 km of shelving. This should be among the largest shelving under one room, in the world. The volumes are indexed in each catalog for easier accessibility. It is said that the Vatican secrets contain documents that are dated back to the end of the eighth century.This being an area that contains vital information about Vatican, its access is limited and it is not just anybody who can access the archives. An entry card to the Vatican secrets must be applied for by qualified applicants including qualified scholars from institutions of higher learning undertaking scientific researches and who have adequate knowledge in archival research. The scholars should present an introductory letter by either a qualified person in the historical research field or a recognized research institute. The applicants also need to fill in their personal information including name, address and telephone number plus the purpose of the research they are undertaking. It is after this process that you can obtain an entry card to the Vatican secret Archives. However, undergraduates are not admitted. Therefore it is not anybody who can have access to the Vatican Secret Archives. Normally, the documents of the Vatican Secret Archives are made available to the public after a period of seventy five years. However, there are sections of the Vatican Secrets that are not open to the public and it is only the Vatican that has access to these sections. Currently, Vatican has also granted permission to selected journalists and members of the public to have access to the Vatican Secrets.Ever since the Vatican Secret Archives were established, they have had several cardinal archivists and prefects. The full names of these cardinal archivists and prefects can be obtained on the Vatican Secret Archives’ website. Today, some of the documentation of the Vatican Archives has been digitalized for easier consultation by various organs of the Roman Curia. Therefore if you want to have access to the extraordinary historical value contained in the Vatican Secret Archives of the Roman Curia, ensure that you have all the qualifications needed for acquiring the entry card.​

and have you ever known anyone outside the Catholic church who prior to Samuel Bacchiocchi had been given complete access via this method? See that is the problem, submitting a request does not mean access is given...hence my statement...which is a quote btw (it did not come from me)
Here is another quote regarding access to the archives..."Not anyone can access the archive—it’s only open to scholars who undergo a thorough vetting process."Step Into the Vatican’s Secret Archives - HISTORY

One can easily deduce the likelihood of a non catholic Seventh Day Adventist scholar being given access to said archive. Samuel dug up documents from the archive that had been lost to history...so the fact Bacchiocchi got access to the archive and was able to use that access to write his paper on "Sabbath to Sunday" and other publications is significant as that naturally would not shed on the Catholic Church a favorable light.

 

[prodromos]

and have you ever known anyone outside the Catholic church who prior to Samuel Bacchiocchi had been given complete access via this method? See that is the problem, submitting a request does not mean access is given...hence my statement...which is a quote btw (it did not come from me)
Here is another quote regarding access to the archives..."Not anyone can access the archive—it’s only open to scholars who undergo a thorough vetting process."Step Into the Vatican’s Secret Archives - HISTORY

One can easily deduce the likelihood of a non catholic Seventh Day Adventist scholar being given access to said archive. Samuel dug up documents from the archive that had been lost to history...so the fact Bacchiocchi got access to the archive and was able to use that access to write his paper on "Sabbath to Sunday" and other publications is significant as that naturally would not shed on the Catholic Church a favorable light.

You have presented no evidence that no other non Catholic has been granted access. If you have evidence, present it.

 

[AdamjEdgar]

You have presented no evidence that no other non Catholic has been granted access. If you have evidence, present it.

Actually the onus is on the person who claimed anyone can gain access to provide that evidence. I have just shown a reference that supports my claim only those who pass a very stringent vetting process are now allowed access. This clearly follows the known tradition about the secrecy of that archive.
The specific archive that I speak of is the Jesuit one...and this has not been opened for viewing as has been the case with the other one.

 

[FreeinChrist]

ADVISOR HAT

Some more clean up was done and the little glitch with the pages was fixed.

Stick to the topic. It is an interesting topic that mostly is discussed calmly. The topic is not about each other's faith or username or any personal attacks.​

 

[Adventist Heretic]

ah that is a classic mistake in interpretation...let me give a real world example (i could give a number of them actually)...

If i were a company boss, had spent years of my life building up a business from a concept in my mind, making it very clear to all of my employees that i do not ever change my rules/laws nor do i ever give authority to another to make changes to said rules/laws (isaiah 44), one would absolutely expect that even though i pass off the keys to my company (which i remain in ultimate control of) to another person, that individual must fulfill my wishes in running the company in my temporary absence!

So, would one expect therefore given the above example, that I (the boss) would never sanction said individual coming into my company, in my absence, changing all the rules that i had spend a lifetime laying out!

God gave Peter the keys yes, but they were given to fulfill existing wishes...to carry on the task that had been modeled to him by Jesus...not to change them!

wow you read into that a lot of things I did not say. just the facts mama, just the facts. how did you get that out of what I said?

 

[tall73]

Samuel dug up documents from the archive that had been lost to history...so the fact Bacchiocchi got access to the archive and was able to use that access to write his paper on "Sabbath to Sunday" and other publications is significant as that naturally would not shed on the Catholic Church a favorable light.

The Catholic Church apparently did not think it painted them in a non-favorable light: