are Christians weak?

[FatalHeart]

I think there is a misunderstanding of what good fruit is. Good fruit leads to eternal life, obedience to God, and spiritual maturity. Bad fruit can be good for society, but it doesn't bring about following the Holy Spirit or salvation, meaning, in the end it leads to hell and death. Not so good anymore, is it? Even a slight skew from perfection is sin, and someone accomplishing things for their own glory above their need for God is most definitely sin. Are the accomplishments good? Certainly. Will they lead to life? No. Firstly, the idea that she has succeeded on her own power is laughable. According to what the Bible says, success is from God. The fact she elevates herself by her successes is a textbook example of how the wicked think. "They have no room for God." But think about what she is actually doing. She is doing "good" in the name of herself and the power of society so as to further what idea? The fact society doesn't need Jesus. My dear, you can accomplish anything in life, but if by your success you are leading people away from Christ and toward hell, you're a murderer. Make no mistake, religion, philosophy, and all of society will be held accountable for purporting a different gospel of being able to reach to God's standard without Christ; it is self righteousness. The tower of Babel, anyone? Men trying to make a name for themselves and build their own way to heaven? What's wrong with that? Now, you are rightfully jealous, because although she may be using her own ambition to ignore and teach no need for Christ, she is attaining to a character that you, as a Christin, should have. The only thing wrong with her life is she doesn't have God, and that's the one thing everything else is worth. But seeing as she didn't follow the Holy Spirit to get it, what makes you think she is even where she's supposed to be? Is that not glorifying the purposes of a man without God? "My feet had almost slipped, for I had envied the wicked until I entered the house of God and found out where their destiny lies." Good fruit leads to eternal life, not social "progress." Man's ways are not God's ways. She should be honored for her accomplishments. I am glad she has done well. We should all be more like her. But she is in a perilous place built on self pride, and it won't end well if there is no change, and she certainly did not do any of it without the hand of God. You might want to ask yourself this question, "Am I as successful in the things of God as this woman is in the things of this world?" If the answer is no, that's why she bothers you, and yes, we can be petty. But see, what does position matter if our friends have failed? I'd give all that I am so we can all cross the finish line together. No one left behind. Is that not what the church is supposed to be?

 

[rockytopva]

If E = mc2 then we can divide and conclude that...

Mass (m) = Energy (E/c2)

And there are three varieties...

Natural E/c2 - All mass is basically cooled plasma
Mental E/c2 - Mentally, A mathematical formula, but this has chemical and spiritual properties as well.
Spiritual E/c2 - E (motivation, warmth, love) / c2 (faith, hope, charity, joy)

For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.- Romans 12:3

And the lord commended the unjust steward, because he had done wisely: for the children of this world are in their generation wiser than the children of light. - Luke 16:8

It is a wise thing to put the faith to work. The children of this world use faith to their advantage. We Christians need to learn how to put faith to work! Here is a story of a woman who was beat up regularly by her drunken husband, until the evangelist encouraged her to put an end to it! Good story @ 9:49

 

[semohi]

We are not weaker than they are. We just have different priorities after becoming Christians. Her priorities are to live up to the world's perception of success, which is driven by the fear of failure, hunger, others. And to be able to overcome these things is a sign of strength in the world's eyes.

These are not our main goals in life anymore. Jesus has overcome the world and we are no longer a citizen of it. Our goals are to please and love God, do His will, love others, save others, things that we cannot do on our own strength and neither can anyone else in this world. Even your friend.

We don't see eye to eye in life so our definition of strength and weakness differs.

Is a king weaker than a pauper who worked for every meal? No. The pauper is focused on his own life, but the king is focused on the kingdom.

 

[Pixey]

It's sad and it hurts. But I have God on my side. So I don't worry about it too much. The friends I'm talking about are great people and I've been trying to get out of the habit of not being friends with people just because we believe in different things and have different opinions. I think they could definitely work on their sensitivity though. I never look down on them or mock them for NOT believing in Christ.

Thank you Hannah, for sharing. It is tough, agreed, and i try to actually not advertise my faith and religious views. If asked directly, then that's one thing but mostly (this time around) i want people just to SEE the Lord in my life. I've been all talk no walk for too long, so now time for the reverse

Good luck with staying strong in your friends' circles - sooooo much more temptation when you're not among fellow believers, hey. *big hug*

 

[1213]

...She is a good person, in my opinion and lives a "clean" life. Without God? I dont want to consider that she draws her strength from the devil, because she does not "bear bad fruits" if i can phrase it that way.

How come she is able to do this all on her own?

It is difficult for me to say who is really good, especially when even Jesus said that only God is good.

Jesus asked him, "Why do you call me good? No one is good, except one-God.
Luke 18:19

It is always easy to be good to nice people when things go well. Real person is exposed when there are troubles. And I don’t really think that any human is something else than weak, when things don’t go smoothly.

And maybe it is like in poker, when somebody acts as if he would be strong, he is usually weak, and when person appears weak, he is probable strong. But maybe she is good all by herself, that would be really good thing. I don’t think it is good to try to point weaknesses in people. And I don’t think you should say she gets strength from the devil. If she really does good things, let’s be happy about that and thank God.

I think people should not be ashamed to admit that they are weak. I am also weak. Luckily it is not really a big problem.

Only weak people can develop and get better. Those who are already perfect, cannot improve themselves at all.


Therefore I take pleasure in weaknesses, in injuries, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses, for Christ's sake. For when I am weak, then am I strong.
2 Cor. 12:10

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Christ came to heal the sick and sinful, not those who are perfect, so we are as Christians very weak and owe everything to God. I look at my life and who I was before I was baptised and I can see how things have changed for the better. Still got a long, long way to go mind you but if not for God I would not be the person I am today. Does that make me weak? Yes? Is weakness a bad thing? Yes. Why then if I am gradually overcoming my weakness by a means not entirely of myself is that a bad thing or cheating?

 

[Pixey]

Thank you all for your comments and taking the time to share your thoughts. Lots of pearls of wisdom to be found, and many good points made.

 

[Blade]

You know Pixey.. as we know God rains on the just and unjust. If we read the word we find WHO SO EVER BELIEVES. God gives... some use what He gave for the wrong reason or they do not know anything about Him. Yet what HE gives He does not take back. And FAITH always works. Man not of God KNOW how to "believe" and God is not in that at all.

But.. at some point it will come falling down. Anything done with out God.. is in vain. There comes a point to all were we get to that place of.. is this it? God never ever forces Himself on anyone.

Now remember its the heart God sees. You may see something on the outside as looking wonderful...but maybe there is something here deeper.. that GOD wants to help... so YOU are talking.. that LIGHT in you drives away all darkness. It is that light they see and will wonder ..why do you have something they do not.

We are the servants to all. God left heaven and died for all. Mary got to hold GOD in ...well man at the time..but still in her hands. God let them do such awful things to Him.. to save what He love the most. So to LOOK weak...its just a twist on the real truth.

GOD is IN YOU! Not some where billions of miles away.. but IN YOU!

 

[Far Side Of the Moon]

The non-Christian woman that you are talking about is relying on the power of Satan in her life.

Many non-Christians are "good people" in that they try to live moral lives.

Please read Psalm 73. It will tell you about the final destination of non-Christians.

Many non-Christians think that Christians are "weak and that Christians use God and Jesus Christ "as a crutch"

Christians should be aware that Satan is the major influence on the ideals, opinions, goals, hopes and views of all non-Christians. Satan's influence also encompasses the world’s philosophies, education, and commerce. The thoughts, ideas, speculations and false religions of the world are under Satan's control and have sprung from his lies and deceptions.

Satan is also called the "prince of the power of the air" in Ephesians 2:2. He is the "ruler of this world" in John 12:31.

When the Bible says Satan has power over the world, we must remember that God has given him domain over unbelievers only. Christian Believers are no longer under the rule of Satan (Colossians 1:13). Unbelievers, on the other hand, are caught "in the snare of the devil" (2 Timothy 2:26), lie in the "power of the evil one" (1 John 5:19), and are in bondage to Satan (Ephesians 2:2).

Uh she isn't relying on Satan unless she's a Satanist. God causes his mercy to rain on the just and unjust. Whether your friend believes it or not , God helped her get all she ever accomplished...apart from God we can't even breathe.

 

[Far Side Of the Moon]

What your non-believer friend doesn't realize is her talent and success aren't her own doing. It all comes from God. God gave her everything she has. To think that we stand on our own talent by our own power is pride. Pride is not a good thing, despite what society says.

Exactly

 

[frettr00]

It is difficult for me to say who is really good, especially when even Jesus said that only God is good.

Jesus asked him, "Why do you call me good? No one is good, except one-God.
Luke 18:19

It is always easy to be good to nice people when things go well. Real person is exposed when there are troubles. And I don’t really think that any human is something else than weak, when things don’t go smoothly.

And maybe it is like in poker, when somebody acts as if he would be strong, he is usually weak, and when person appears weak, he is probable strong. But maybe she is good all by herself, that would be really good thing. I don’t think it is good to try to point weaknesses in people. And I don’t think you should say she gets strength from the devil. If she really does good things, let’s be happy about that and thank God.

I think people should not be ashamed to admit that they are weak. I am also weak. Luckily it is not really a big problem.

Only weak people can develop and get better. Those who are already perfect, cannot improve themselves at all.


Therefore I take pleasure in weaknesses, in injuries, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses, for Christ's sake. For when I am weak, then am I strong.
2 Cor. 12:10

Admitting you're weak and need God is a good thing. It develops humility.

 

[ChristianFromKazakhstan]

Hi All, hope everyone is doing well and living gloriously in Christ!

Had an interesting conversation yesterday with a non-believer, who actually (in a way, maybe it was just my perception) looked down on me for following Jesus. She is a successful career woman who has achieved much and lives a good life, she gives to the needy, generally doesnt speak ill of others and lives by a lot of "Godly principles". (Do unto others as you want done to yourself, etc, etc).

She feels accomplished that she has achieved this all on her own and hinted at the subtle changes in me (as i continue my daily struggle with patience, being more graceful and controlling my spewing tongue, it must be paying off).

It's not that she said anything directly, but implication flowed from our conversation that she considers it "cheating" that i have help, ("i can do anything through God who gives me strength" came up). It made me feel like i am weaker than what she is, not being able to amount to much without God's Holy Intervention in my life.

I KNOW this is the devil working to sow doubt in my mind, and i am by no means ashamed of it that i need God. I dont think so anyway. It DID however raise a few questions internally which i wish it hadnt.

She is a good person, in my opinion and lives a "clean" life. Without God? I dont want to consider that she draws her strength from the devil, because she does not "bear bad fruits" if i can phrase it that way.

How come she is able to do this all on her own?

Jesus came to give us eternal life. No amount of earthly achievements during this very short earthly life can compare. Even if you gain the whole world, but lose your soul, you're a megaloser....

 

[dad]

Hi All, hope everyone is doing well and living gloriously in Christ!

Had an interesting conversation yesterday with a non-believer, who actually (in a way, maybe it was just my perception) looked down on me for following Jesus. She is a successful career woman who has achieved much and lives a good life, she gives to the needy, generally doesnt speak ill of others and lives by a lot of "Godly principles". (Do unto others as you want done to yourself, etc, etc).

She feels accomplished that she has achieved this all on her own and hinted at the subtle changes in me (as i continue my daily struggle with patience, being more graceful and controlling my spewing tongue, it must be paying off).

It's not that she said anything directly, but implication flowed from our conversation that she considers it "cheating" that i have help, ("i can do anything through God who gives me strength" came up). It made me feel like i am weaker than what she is, not being able to amount to much without God's Holy Intervention in my life.

I KNOW this is the devil working to sow doubt in my mind, and i am by no means ashamed of it that i need God. I dont think so anyway. It DID however raise a few questions internally which i wish it hadnt.

She is a good person, in my opinion and lives a "clean" life. Without God? I dont want to consider that she draws her strength from the devil, because she does not "bear bad fruits" if i can phrase it that way.

How come she is able to do this all on her own?

Appearances can be deceiving. God looks on the heart. If the lady is a sheep, she will come to Jesus one day. No other way. I have seen 'good' people, yet they promote abortions, Sosom lifestyles, maybe population control, war, etc etc.

 

[JGHorton]

Hi All, hope everyone is doing well and living gloriously in Christ!

Had an interesting conversation yesterday with a non-believer, who actually (in a way, maybe it was just my perception) looked down on me for following Jesus. She is a successful career woman who has achieved much and lives a good life, she gives to the needy, generally doesnt speak ill of others and lives by a lot of "Godly principles". (Do unto others as you want done to yourself, etc, etc).

She feels accomplished that she has achieved this all on her own and hinted at the subtle changes in me (as i continue my daily struggle with patience, being more graceful and controlling my spewing tongue, it must be paying off).

It's not that she said anything directly, but implication flowed from our conversation that she considers it "cheating" that i have help, ("i can do anything through God who gives me strength" came up). It made me feel like i am weaker than what she is, not being able to amount to much without God's Holy Intervention in my life.

I KNOW this is the devil working to sow doubt in my mind, and i am by no means ashamed of it that i need God. I dont think so anyway. It DID however raise a few questions internally which i wish it hadnt.

She is a good person, in my opinion and lives a "clean" life. Without God? I dont want to consider that she draws her strength from the devil, because she does not "bear bad fruits" if i can phrase it that way.

How come she is able to do this all on her own?

"The wisdom of this world is foolishness with God" -- It really doesn't matter what she (or you) "thinks" apart from God's unchanging truth. She may 'think' she is successful and wise and needs only her own resources .... just like you may think and wonder how she is able to 'succeed' so admirably on her own, but, only God's truth matters.

The difference between a non-believer/Christian and a believer/Christian is that one has been born-again to new, Spiritual life in the power of the indwelling Holy Spirit. They are a 'new creation' in Christ - able to live in relationship with the living God and be transformed by the renewing of their minds. They have eternal life and have been saved from the just wages of sin (death). They have a life of hope, faith, confidence in God and a plan, purpose, truth and promises for the future.

The non-believer/non-Christian has none of these things.

Of these two, who is truly wise and successful?

Let God, Christ and Scripture define your "truth" and reality, not this lost and dying world. "Those who suppress God's truth are without excuse."

 

[Nicholas McDowell]

There is no power but of God. We live, move and have our being in Him. Only the highest part of the dust of the world would use the tongue and mind to boast of such ridiculousness. Such are those that prance to hell and think nothing of it. Principalities and powers lie in ambush, are invisible and vanquish before the fight begins. That's why the Comforter was sent. We look at that which is not seen because what is seen is utter distraction. The same power that raised Christ Jesus from the dead dwells, actually, in you, so tell me, who's weak?

 

[marineimaging]

Hey! I met that same woman at the University of Colorado about 20 years ago. She was working on her Doctorate and was a good person all around. She was pretty and she did good things for the poor, helped out on all the holidays..., just a good person who said she didn't need God to help her. She did alright by herself and didn't believe in heaven or hell so she wasn't going to participate either. As a Christian I have to admit she had me going..., for a brief moment. Then I thought about the fact that in spite of graduating around 394 of 395 in my class on the second go around of high school, I too was working at the University of Colorado on the largest scientific project in the history of mankind! I was selected out of 250 people to work alongside some of the greatest minds in the world and here I was, having barely scraped by high school. I didn't get there because of my academic score. I got there because I asked God for the opportunity and He granted it to me. I know it came from God because I could not have done the things I did without Him. It came because I believe in Jesus and asked it was granted and for no other reason. As for her, I don't know where she went but I do know that she WILL participate in heaven or hell whether she believes or not. And I know that Christ will support you and you will see the truth and know why you went through it. Embrace Christ for He will be with you in the darkest of times and in eternity.

 

[Lyllie]

God did amazing things in my life well before I would even acknowledged that he existed. In fact, I can look back through my whole life and see myself wrapped in his love and care. Every negative thing I ever went through had amazing lessons for me to find, every good thing that came my way was an enormous blessing. I have no doubt at all that he watched over me, and every time I needed him and didn't even know it, he was there.

In 2014 my husband was in a coma not expected to survive due to a chronic illness. For the second time in 12 months I had to go home and tell my children that he had only days to live and they needed to say their goodbyes. I got a call from the hospital that night to tell me he had been moved closer to the ICU nurse station. Bed 41 section 3. I didn't have a pen so I typed 41-3 into my tablet then went to sleep. When I woke up the next morning and opened my tablet, right there on my screen was Psalms 41:3. "The Lord will strengthen him on his bed of illness;and sustain him on his sickbed." And that's exactly what he did. 2 and a half years on, while my husband's illness is still considered terminal, he no longer needs oxygen and is stronger and healthier than ever. God gave us that amazing blessing and he did it at a time when I didn't even believe in him.

Maybe it's the same for your friend. Just because she isn't thinking of God doesn't mean he isn't thinking of her and working on her life.

 

[LovebirdsFlying]

My knee-jerk reaction to the question, "Are Christians weak?" is this: I don't know about anybody else. I can only speak for myself. And yes, I am weak. That's why I need Jesus Christ. With Him, I am strong.

 

[Tetra]

The non-Christian woman that you are talking about is relying on the power of Satan in her life.

Many non-Christians are "good people" in that they try to live moral lives.

Please read Psalm 73. It will tell you about the final destination of non-Christians.

Many non-Christians think that Christians are "weak and that Christians use God and Jesus Christ "as a crutch"

Christians should be aware that Satan is the major influence on the ideals, opinions, goals, hopes and views of all non-Christians. Satan's influence also encompasses the world’s philosophies, education, and commerce. The thoughts, ideas, speculations and false religions of the world are under Satan's control and have sprung from his lies and deceptions.

Satan is also called the "prince of the power of the air" in Ephesians 2:2. He is the "ruler of this world" in John 12:31.

When the Bible says Satan has power over the world, we must remember that God has given him domain over unbelievers only. Christian Believers are no longer under the rule of Satan (Colossians 1:13). Unbelievers, on the other hand, are caught "in the snare of the devil" (2 Timothy 2:26), lie in the "power of the evil one" (1 John 5:19), and are in bondage to Satan (Ephesians 2:2).

I would disagree with your position... while it's possible for Satan to work in her life. It's also possible for God to do so. It's not as black and white as you're making it out to be.

Many non-believers whether or not they realize it are often functioning with God in their life. The Doctrine of Common Grace would suggest this is the case...

From my own personal experience... I've often seen God in the discussions I have with my non-believing friends.

 

[Victor E.]

Hi All, hope everyone is doing well and living gloriously in Christ!

Had an interesting conversation yesterday with a non-believer, who actually (in a way, maybe it was just my perception) looked down on me for following Jesus. She is a successful career woman who has achieved much and lives a good life, she gives to the needy, generally doesnt speak ill of others and lives by a lot of "Godly principles". (Do unto others as you want done to yourself, etc, etc).

She feels accomplished that she has achieved this all on her own and hinted at the subtle changes in me (as i continue my daily struggle with patience, being more graceful and controlling my spewing tongue, it must be paying off).

It's not that she said anything directly, but implication flowed from our conversation that she considers it "cheating" that i have help, ("i can do anything through God who gives me strength" came up). It made me feel like i am weaker than what she is, not being able to amount to much without God's Holy Intervention in my life.

I KNOW this is the devil working to sow doubt in my mind, and i am by no means ashamed of it that i need God. I dont think so anyway. It DID however raise a few questions internally which i wish it hadnt.

She is a good person, in my opinion and lives a "clean" life. Without God? I dont want to consider that she draws her strength from the devil, because she does not "bear bad fruits" if i can phrase it that way.

How come she is able to do this all on her own?

It's basic moral uprightness of the gentiles that stem from the moral compass all humans have via the convictions of the conscience/Spirit (John 16:5-16)

"Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the Law, do by nature what the Law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the Law, since they show that the work of the Law is written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts either accusing or defending them. This will come to pass on that day when God will judge men’s secrets through Christ Jesus, as proclaimed by my gospel." Romans 2:14-16

The Fact remains, apart from following Jesus Christ's way of life in faith, all her righteous acts are worthless, and they will not save her from eternal hellfire.

"Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him." John 3:36

"For all of us have become like one who is unclean,
And all our righteous deeds are like a filthy garment;
And all of us wither like a leaf,
And our iniquities, like the wind, take us away." Isaiah 64:6

"But now, apart from the Law, the righteousness of God has been revealed, as attested by the Law and the Prophets. And this righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no distinction, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus." Romans 3:23-24

However, you should definitely take this as an opportunity to spur your own growth.

"For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men. It instructs us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live sensible, upright, and godly lives in the present age, as we await the blessed hope and glorious appearance of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ. He gave Himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for Himself a people for His own possession, zealous for good deeds." Titus 2:11-14

"Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me will live, even though he dies. And everyone who lives and believes in Me will never die. Do you believe this?” John 11:25-26

Sanctification is a lifelong process.

"I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Romans 12:1-3

"Let the lowly brother boast in his exaltation, and the rich in his humiliation, because like a flower of the grass he will pass away. For the sun rises with its scorching heat and withers the grass; its flower falls, and its beauty perishes. So also will the rich man fade away in the midst of his pursuits." James 1:9-11

She cannot perform miracles, signs, wonders through Christ's power of the Holy Spirit. She has basic human moral uprightness. You have Christ! Keep seeking God, friend! Matthew 6:33