Adam ?

[Ken Rank]

Amen and God knew this BEFORE Jesus made Adam from the dust. Here's how we know:

Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Do you have a second witness for that?

 

[Aman777]

What about the 1000 year reign?

Where do you place this period of time?

Before.

Or after the cosmos is burned and death is destroyed?


This seems to be a temporary period of peace...

Amen. Genesis 1:28-31 will happen AFTER Jesus returns to set up His 1,000 year reign on planet Earth. After this time, our Cosmos will be burned and death will be destroyed. Then we will enter the 7th Day. Gen 2:1

 

[Aman777]

With all those animals having sex he knew he was missing out on something before she was created and his imagination must have kicked in. He also must have surely noticed the physical resemblance between himself and other mammals-especially the apes and noticed their sexual differences and have expected to be soon provided with a similar companionship albeit human..

BTW
I once mentioned this to a female bible student JWS who was greatly offended by it and insisted that Adam went around totally oblivious to his surroundings in relation to sex. Where she derived that notion from is anybody's guess since it isn't found in their literature.

Can you imagine the need poor Adam must have felt when he saw Eve, naked in the flesh? No wonder he sinned. Amen?

 

[Aman777]

Do you have a second witness for that?

IF God could not see that Jesus would have to die for mankind's sin, He wouldn't be God. God sees the end from the beginning.

Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all My pleasure:

 

[Ken Rank]

IF God could not see that Jesus would have to die for mankind's sin, He wouldn't be God. God sees the end from the beginning.

Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all My pleasure:

That is not a second witness, that is your personal view of God. You know all truth is established with 2-3 (or more) witnesses... where is your second witness to that Revelation verse? I have one... just wanted to see if you had another.... seeing you have deemed it your job to teach me and all.

 

[Aman777]

That is not a second witness, that is your personal view of God. You know all truth is established with 2-3 (or more) witnesses... where is your second witness to that Revelation verse? I have one... just wanted to see if you had another.... seeing you have deemed it your job to teach me and all.

I haven't taken you to teach. Why do you withhold your other witnesses? Don't you want to enlighten the poor lost sinners here? Remember what happens when you hide your light under a bushel. Mat 5:16

 

[Ken Rank]

I haven't taken you to teach. Why do you withhold your other witnesses? Don't you want to enlighten the poor lost sinners here? Remember what happens when you hide your light under a bushel. Mat 5:16

You started this today by saying, "Just one more fact to add to your understanding." So, you felt the need to correct me with your perception of facts and add to my understanding. Sounds like you are trying to teach me when I didn't come to you as a student. Not that I don't appreciate your concern... it just came off as unsolicited teaching... a hint of superiority perhaps? Maybe I was wrong... if so, my apologies.

The second witness is found in Genesis 1:14. Put your cursor over that verse... see the word "seasons?" That isn't "fall, winter, spring, summer" that is the word "moedim." It would be the word translated as "feasts" although "appointments" or "appointed times" is really a better translation.

Anyway... the sun, moon, and stars were placed where they are, IN PART... to be a marker so that we know when the feasts will be. Each feasts has a historical event they are tied to but also point prophetically to an event Messiah would do, is doing, or will do. So... on day 4 of Creation, before there was an Adam, before there was a sin, before there was a need to be redeemed from sin... the markers were set in place (again, in part) to point to appointed times that would teach of the work of messiah. That, along with Revelation 13:8, tells us that while God might not have made Adam to sin, He did make him knowing he would sin and thus EVERYTHING God did from that time forward, was for the reason of redeeming us.

 

[Aseyesee]

Amen, but 930 years after he and Eve were born again Spiritually or created in God's Image, Adam died.

*** The kingdom of God (in one form) is likened to a seed that falls to the ground, which without this process is said to abide alone.

How to be perfect (like all things God) is a matter of faith.

Amen. The ONLY way to be perfect is to be in Christ Spiritually, created Eternally by God the Trinity. Gen 1:26 Gen 5:1-2 and John 14:16 God Bless you

70 years short of entering into rest ...

 

[Radrook]

Can you imagine the need poor Adam must have felt when he saw Eve, naked in the flesh? No wonder he sinned. Amen?

They had been told to multiply. The only way to multiply was with the sexual organs provided them just like other mammals were multiplying.

Genesis 9:7
"As for you, be fruitful and multiply; Populate the earth abundantly and multiply in it."

Had they been designed like amoebas they could have done so differently.

 

[Radrook]

I don't see the humor that you see Ken. Adam's sin was INHERITED along with his superior intelligence, which is like God's, according to Gen 3:22. Sin and death will continue until Jesus returns at Armageddon.

So Adam inherited sin from God? From where in the Bible do you derive that concept?

 

[Radrook]

Just one more fact to add to your understanding. Adam and Eve were like the Angels in Heaven, and like Christians will be in Heaven. Mar 12:25 There will be NO sex since God has something better. Amen?

So your Bible never tells them to procreate? What is the name of your Bible version?

 

[Hethatreadethit]

Did God make Adam imperfect?

Good question. Was Adam created flesh? Was Adam created naked? Research those questions and you will find, in my opinion, he was created a natural man with the same weaknesses as all men including Eve.

 

[Radrook]

It was not good for man to be alone, yet God's remedy (knowingly by him), brings him to a death.

Seems as if you believe God purposefully made all the trash that has transpired on this Earth since the Fall happened on purpose. Weird! In that case one would need to view your creator as an establisher and perpetrator of sin.

 

[Radrook]

Good question. Was Adam created flesh? Was Adam created naked? Research those questions and you will find, in my opinion, he was created a natural man with the same weaknesses as all men including Eve.

If Adam had been created incapable of perfect obedience and had a predisposition to sin, then punishing for what came natural[sinning] would constitute an injustice. It's like making an android flawed and then castigating it for that flaw. Rather whimsically cruel-don't you think? Jump over that obstacle even though I know you can't and if you don't I will use a two-by-four on you. Certainly not a fatherly behavior that engenders admiration..

 

[Hethatreadethit]

Seems as if you believe God purposefully made all the trash that has transpired on this Earth since the Fall happened on purpose. Weird! In that case one would need to view your creator as an establisher and perpetrator of sin.

Satan was created perfect and never had to witness the sufferings like Christ.

Like given an shot of a vaccine, man was given a shot of sin that He through Christ can have resistance to it's deadly infectious disease.

Satan never got the anti-serum and was disease ridden.

 

[Radrook]

It insures that one must believe that God will save him from his own sins. Only God can see a person's faith.

Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of them that diligently seek Him.

So faith is expected and if not demonstrated then we are punished? Strange!
Why create or allow circumstances which make belief extremely difficult and then castigate people because they have difficulty believing as if belief should come easily?

For example, the end of the world was expected to arrive during the first century CC. It did not. That failure made belief difficult. 2000 years later other groups have been proclaiming the end and it still doesn't arrive. Worlds of people have died since that first promise and yet we are expected to believe and if we have doubt we must be punished?

All the horrendous atrocities that have transpired during human history and we are supposed to believe he cares? Example: Vlad the Impaler and his impaling people so that they lasted days in agony. Yet absolutely no intervention. Was the impaled person being condemned for lac of faith in not believing that God cares? Sorry but it just seems a bit weird.

 

[Hethatreadethit]

Men are not androids. We are created in a fleshly body with the needs of a carnal world. God is Spirit and His wisdom is far greater than ours. Paul did not paint Adam as a great Spiritual man but rather as the beginning of those flawed by sin. Christ was created perfect, Adam, as natural man with his wife coveted against God's will, took not what was his, and disobeyed his Fathers commandment. Total weakness of all flesh.

 

[Radrook]

Satan was created perfect and never had to witness the sufferings like Christ.

Like given an shot of a vaccine, man was given a shot of sin that He through Christ can have resistance to it's deadly infectious disease.

Satan never got the anti-serum and was disease ridden.

I agree that the Bible teaches that God creates perfectly.

Ecclesiastes 7:29 ►
This only have I found: God created mankind upright, but they have gone in search of many schemes."

Where do you derive the concept that he doesn't? What biblical support can you offer to justify that conclusion? In short, where in the Bible sos it blame God for mankind's sin? The only scriptures I am aware of place the blame directly on Adam.

 

[Radrook]

Men are not androids. We are created in a fleshly body with the needs of a carnal world. God is Spirit and His wisdom is far greater than ours. Paul did not paint Adam as a great Spiritual man but rather as the beginning of those flawed by sin. Christ was created perfect, Adam, as natural man with his wife coveted against God's will, took not what was his, and disobeyed his Fathers commandment. Total weakness of all flesh.

I never claimed that we are literally androids. It was used as an approximate analogy to illustrate a certain point which you seem to prefer to ignore.


I never claimed that God is not a spirit and that we have greater wisdom.

I never claimed that Paul was talking entirely of a pre-sinful Adam. He was describing how sin entered the world through Adam's transgression. Had Adam been sinful to begin with then no transgression would have been necessary-procreation would have done the job via inheritance of his sin-marred DNA.

I never claimed that Adam did not disobey.

BTW
Again you choose to contradict the Bible's clear description of pre-sinful mankind.
Ecclesiastes 7:29 ►
This only have I found: God created mankind upright, but they have gone in search of many schemes."

So faced with the choice of believing the Bible and believing your opinion-I think I will believe the Bible.

 

[Hethatreadethit]

I agree that the Bible teaches that God creates perfectly.

Ecclesiastes 7:29 ►
This only have I found: God created mankind upright, but they have gone in search of many schemes."

Where do you derive the concept that he doesn't? What biblical support can you offer to justify that conclusion? In short, where in the Bible sos it blame God for mankind's sin? The only scriptures I am aware of place the blame directly on Adam.

He looked on His creation and said it was good. BUT, it was just the beginning of His plan, unless you think our Perfect God flawed in His plans. I can just see it now: Adam and Eve sin, and rudely alerted in this disaster, God realizes He will have to switch to Plan B.

You like Ecclesiastes, so do I:

Ecc 3:19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.
Ecc 3:20 All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again.

You show me in Genesis where it says man was created upright?

Man to have been created perfect would have been a partaker of the tree of life. But he was not and died from eating knowledge, he had no clue and no righteousness, for he was naked.