Absolute Predestination

[Dave L]

Does God ordain one to sin, even though he hates sin? Your 'ordain' beliefs are going to get you into trouble.

“For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.” (Acts 4:27–28)

 

[EmSw]

Calvinists like myself have read Calvin, and Hodge, and Berkhof, among others, but the primary andmain source of my theology is still from the scriptures themselves...

So, are the Westminster Confessions a source of your beliefs? How do you feel about these words of truth from the Savior Himself?

Matthew 19:17
... but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.

Is your theology from this scripture?

 

[EmSw]

“For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.” (Acts 4:27–28)

So, I take God ordains you to sin.

 

[YeshuaFan]

So, are the Westminster Confessions a source of your beliefs? How do you feel about these words of truth from the Savior Himself?

Matthew 19:17
... but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.

Is your theology from this scripture?

The source of all of my theology is the Bible, and the 1689 Baptist Confession is a good primer to what I believe they teach!

 

[YeshuaFan]

“For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.” (Acts 4:27–28)

Also that part in Acts, where God ordained Jsus to be put to death on the cross, but that act was done through the "free will" of sinners!

 

[YeshuaFan]

So, I take God ordains you to sin.

God ordains that even in my sinning, His plans and purposes will be get worked out, but he never caused me to sin!

 

[EmSw]

God ordains that even in my sinning, His plans and purposes will be get worked out, but he never caused me to sin!

So, if God ordained the world into being, He didn't cause it, right?

 

[EmSw]

The source of all of my theology is the Bible, and the 1689 Baptist Confession is a good primer to what I believe they teach!

You didn't answer the question. Is Matthew 19:17 a scripture you believe?

 

[EmSw]

Also that part in Acts, where God ordained Jsus to be put to death on the cross, but that act was done through the "free will" of sinners!

Would these 'sinners' have put Jesus to death, if God didn't ordain it?

 

[Dave L]

Also that part in Acts, where God ordained Jsus to be put to death on the cross, but that act was done through the "free will" of sinners!

Yes, but God provided the reasons they based their choices on, including Judas, and it could not be otherwise.

 

[Dave L]

So, I take God ordains you to sin.

Why pray "lead us not into temptation" if he does not?

 

[Dave L]

So, are the Westminster Confessions a source of your beliefs? How do you feel about these words of truth from the Savior Himself?

Matthew 19:17
... but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.

Is your theology from this scripture?

He was proving to the rich young ruler he could not save himself by keeping the Law.

 

[EmSw]

Why pray "lead us not into temptation" if he does not?

Really? So He wants us to pray against something He ordains?

 

[EmSw]

He was proving to the rich young ruler he could not save himself by keeping the Law.

Please, you people quit adding to what Jesus said. He was proving the young ruler could enter life by keeping the commandments. What in the world are you reading?

 

[1stcenturylady]

We believe that God intended the death of Jesus to purchase and provide real salvation to be applied towards His very elect...

I know. But you really should study for yourself.

Israel was said to be God's elect, but were all Israel saved? No.

Isaiah 45:4
For Jacob My servant’s sake, And Israel My elect, I have even called you by your name; I have named you, though you have not known Me.

The blood of Jesus was shed for the whole world. Are you going to believe your Bible and the apostles, or John Calvin who was not an apostle?

John 3:16 For God so loved THE WORLD, that He gave His only Son, that WHOSOEVER believes in Him, should not perish, but have everlasting life.

1 John 2:2 And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for THE WHOLE WORLD.

 

[Dave L]

Please, you people quit adding to what Jesus said. He was proving the young ruler could enter life by keeping the commandments. What in the world are you reading?

“Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.” (Romans 3:20)

 

[Dave L]

Really? So He wants us to pray against something He ordains?

The only reason we are not cannibals is because God withholds us from the depths of our sin.

 

[1stcenturylady]

But Jesus did it for us who believe in him. So while we wear his righteousness and all it merits, we still struggle working on our own.

On our own? That's the problem right there. A Christian doesn't do anything on his own, but through the Spirit. There is no struggle. IF one has the Spirit, they know the difference, and would never say what you just did. Christ receives all the glory. But I will not be ashamed of the power of the gospel.

 

[Dave L]

On our own? That's the problem right there. A Christian doesn't do anything on his own, but through the Spirit. There is no struggle. IF one has the Spirit, they know the difference, and would never say what you just did. Christ receives all the glory. But I will not be ashamed of the power of the gospel.

If you have no temptation or struggle with the flesh, you might not have the Holy Spirit. I had zero struggle with the flesh as an unbeliever.

 

[1stcenturylady]

“Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.” (Romans 3:20)

We are not under the law of sin and death, but live under the law of the Spirit of life in Christ. There is a huge difference in understanding that has gone over your head. Open your mind and let ALL of Calvinism fly away. You say you are not Calvinist. Well, then what are you holding on to it for?