A thought or two about Infant Baptism

[bbbbbbb]

What about infants, small children, the intellectually challenged and peoples living in remote areas with no contact with the Christian faith?

Romans 4:15​

(15) Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.​

Romans 5:13​

(13) (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.​

Romans 2:14​

(14) For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:​

An excellent question indeed and one which, unfortunately, seems to be ignored.

 

[Landon Caeli]

Those who minds are not capable of comprehending such abstract concepts as sin, salvation, repentance, salvation, gospel, Christ, New birth.

- and so what does the Bible actually teach in places like Matt 28 and Acts 2 - where they are called to hear the gospel, repent and then be baptized?

Is a baby able to do the following:

“Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them ... teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you” (Matthew 28:19, 20).

“He who believes and is baptized will be saved” (Mark 16:16).

“Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins” (Acts 2:38).

“Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out” (Acts 3:19).

There is no example of infant baptism in scripture this is a doctrine of man. Jesus as our example, did not get baptized until the beginning of His ministry, not at birth. Baptism is a decision one makes, when they understand right from wrong and want to choose right and live a new life in Christ.

So do the intellectually challenged among us not get baptized as well? If so, that seems really mean-spirited and rude.

 

[bbbbbbb]

So do the intellectually challenged among us not get baptized as well? If so, that seems really mean-spirited and rude.

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Isn't it also extremely mean and cruel not to baptize everyone?

 

[Landon Caeli]

Isn't it also extremely mean and cruel not to baptize everyone?

Well, I'm opposed to the exclusiveness of baptism, even within my own Church, and we baptize infants.

...That should tell you something.

I don't have to like the ecclesiastical rules of Canon law. It's not a requirement.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Well, I'm opposed to the exclusiveness of baptism, even within my own Church, and we baptize infants.

...That should tell you something.

I don't have to like the ecclesiastical rules of Canon law. It's not a requirement.

How would you feel about a priest visiting nursing homes on a regular basis to baptize anyone who hasn't been baptized?

 

[Landon Caeli]

How would you feel about a priest visiting nursing homes on a regular basis to baptize anyone who hasn't been baptized?

I like that idea. I'm for baptizing as many as possible.

 

[bbbbbbb]

I like that idea. I'm for baptizing as many as possible.

Thanks! You are the first poster here at CF that I have met that is consistent. Most others waffle at the idea of baptizing adults who don't articulate some form of confession of faith.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

the idea of baptizing adults who don't articulate some form of confession of faith.

From a Catholic perspective, baptism is a sacrament that marks the beginning of a person's journey of faith and initiation into the Christian community. The Catechism of the Catholic Church states that "Baptism is the sacrament of faith. But faith needs the community of believers. It is only within the faith of the Church that each of the faithful can believe."

Scripture references for the sacrament of baptism include John 3:5, where Jesus tells Nicodemus that "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God," and Acts 2:38, where Peter tells the crowd on the day of Pentecost that "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins."

The Catholic Church recognizes the validity of baptisms performed by other Christian denominations, and thus an adult who is already baptized in another denomination but wishes to join the Catholic Church will typically not be baptized again. However, an adult who has never been baptized, or whose baptism is uncertain, would be received into the Church through the sacrament of baptism.

As for the confession of faith, the Catechism of the Catholic Church states that "Baptism is the foundation of the whole Christian life, the gateway to life in the Spirit, and the door which gives access to the other sacraments". The Church recognizes the freedom of the person, The adult who is being baptised may not be able to express the faith in words, but the faith is recognized by the church if the person is willing to receive the sacrament.

Therefore, from a Catholic perspective, an adult who does not articulate some form of confession of faith can still be baptized if they are willing to receive the sacrament and begin their journey of faith in the Christian community.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

So do the intellectually challenged among us not get baptized as well? If so, that seems really mean-spirited and rude.

View attachment 327020

Are you saying the person pictured doesn’t know how to accept Jesus or know the difference between right and wrong? My guess that is not true, which I don’t see how this relates to infant baptism when they can’t accept Jesus and do not know the difference between right or wrong.

God knows our every circumstance and my faith is He is a righteous Judge.

 

[bbbbbbb]

From a Catholic perspective, baptism is a sacrament that marks the beginning of a person's journey of faith and initiation into the Christian community. The Catechism of the Catholic Church states that "Baptism is the sacrament of faith. But faith needs the community of believers. It is only within the faith of the Church that each of the faithful can believe."

Scripture references for the sacrament of baptism include John 3:5, where Jesus tells Nicodemus that "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God," and Acts 2:38, where Peter tells the crowd on the day of Pentecost that "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins."

The Catholic Church recognizes the validity of baptisms performed by other Christian denominations, and thus an adult who is already baptized in another denomination but wishes to join the Catholic Church will typically not be baptized again. However, an adult who has never been baptized, or whose baptism is uncertain, would be received into the Church through the sacrament of baptism.

As for the confession of faith, the Catechism of the Catholic Church states that "Baptism is the foundation of the whole Christian life, the gateway to life in the Spirit, and the door which gives access to the other sacraments". The Church recognizes the freedom of the person, The adult who is being baptised may not be able to express the faith in words, but the faith is recognized by the church if the person is willing to receive the sacrament.

Therefore, from a Catholic perspective, an adult who does not articulate some form of confession of faith can still be baptized if they are willing to receive the sacrament and begin their journey of faith in the Christian community.

Poor Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch. There was no ecclesial community of believers for the eunuch when Philip baptized him in the desert. Thus, the eunuch probably had a doubtful baptism according to what you wrote. What was the result? The eunuch went on his way, rejoicing and that sparked the beginning of the Ethiopian Orthodox Church which, according to your denomination, is not the ONE AND ONLY TRUE CHURCH.

The scenario I proposed included adults, probably quite senile or otherwise unable to express any interest, pro or con, in baptism. Landon Caeli, who seems to be a firm believer in the efficacy of the sacrament of baptism, is more than willing to extend salvation beyond the boundaries of a church. His offer is utterly free and without constraint. Yours requires evidence of repentance and faith, even though infants are quite incapable of providing any such evidence.

 

[Landon Caeli]

Are you saying the person pictured doesn’t know how to accept Jesus or know the difference between right and wrong? My guess that is not true, which I don’t see how this relates to infant baptism when they can’t accept Jesus and do not know the difference between right or wrong.

God knows our every circumstance and my faith is He is a righteous Judge.

I feel like you're dodging the question because the particular person pictured isn't challenged 'enough'. Personally I know of people, like my friend Tony, who was hit by a van while riding his bike when we were 10. He can no longer speak, drools constantly in his wheelchair. He may have the mental capacity of a 1 or 2 year old, bit his loving mother couldn't bear to take him off life support at the time.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I feel like you're dodging the question because the particular person pictured isn't challenged 'enough'. Personally I know of people, like my friend Tony, who was hit by a van while riding his bike when we were 10. He can no longer speak, drools constantly in his wheelchair. He may have the mental capacity of a 1 or 2 year old, bit his loving mother couldn't bear to take him off life support at the time.

I wasn't dogging the question; I think God understands abnormal circumstances- infant baptism does not fit that category, which is the topic of the thread.

 

[Landon Caeli]

I wasn't dogging the question; I think God understands abnormal circumstances- infant baptism does not fit that category, which is the topic of the thread.

That doesn't help me out much in understanding, but if that's the best you can do, then so be it.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

That doesn't help me out much in understanding, but if that's the best you can do, then so be it.

This the example of what people did before being baptized in scripture. The scriptures are meant to be our guide.

“Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them ... teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you” (Matthew 28:19, 20).
“He who believes and is baptized will be saved” (Mark 16:16).
“Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins” (Acts 2:38).
“Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out” (Acts 3:19).

Infants can't do these things, which is why there are no infant baptisms in scripture. Will God make certain circumstances for adults who have mental disabilities, I think He will, and my faith is in the righteous judgement of Jesus. This thread is about infant baptisms, not special circumstances, my faith is in Jesus and His judgment, but that doesn't mean there are special circumstances for those who do not have them and are mentally capable or it applies to babies before they can make the decisions in the scriptures posted for our guidance. This is the best answer I have, and I hope it helps see my view better.

 

[Der Alte]

I belong to a large Southern denomination which practices believer's baptism. I once heard a pastor say, "If you do not have faith in Jesus Christ, all baptism does is get you wet."
A pastor I knew often went to visit a bed ridden husband of a church member. On one occasion the man made a profession of faith and asked to be baptized. The pastor said he couldn't because the man was connected to machines and tubes. The man said, "Here is a glass of water baptize we with that." The pastor objected strenuously saying, "That is not scriptural baptism." While I believe that complete immersion is scriptural baptism, I'm flexible enough that if I can give a sick person comfort with a glass of water I will do it.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

While I believe that complete immersion is scriptural baptism, I'm flexible enough that if I can give a sick person comfort with a glass of water I will do it.

Agreed, God understands special circumstances.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Poor Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch.

No single post answers every possible question nor ought any reader treat a single post as if it were an exhaustive treatment on the subject of infant baptism.

In the Catholic perspective, the baptism of the Ethiopian eunuch by Philip the evangelist as recorded in the book of Acts in the New Testament is seen as an important moment in the early Christian Church. The eunuch, a powerful official in the court of the Ethiopian queen, was seeking to understand the teachings of the prophet Isaiah and was being led to faith in Jesus Christ by Philip.

The act of baptism is significant because it initiates the eunuch into the Christian community, giving him access to the sacraments and the spiritual benefits that come with being a member of the Church. The eunuch's baptism also shows that the Church is open to all people, regardless of their background or social status, and that anyone can be saved through faith in Jesus Christ.

Furthermore, the story of the Ethiopian eunuch is also seen as a manifestation of the universality of the Catholic Church and the universality of salvation. It shows that salvation is not limited to any specific race or nationality and that the Church is open to people from every culture, social status, and ethnic group, as long as they have faith in Jesus.

In summary, the Catholic perspective on the baptism of the Ethiopian eunuch emphasizes the importance of initiation into the Christian community through the sacrament of baptism and the universality of salvation offered to all people through faith in Jesus Christ.

 

[bbbbbbb]

No single post answers every possible question nor ought any reader treat a single post as if it were an exhaustive treatment on the subject of infant baptism.

In the Catholic perspective, the baptism of the Ethiopian eunuch by Philip the evangelist as recorded in the book of Acts in the New Testament is seen as an important moment in the early Christian Church. The eunuch, a powerful official in the court of the Ethiopian queen, was seeking to understand the teachings of the prophet Isaiah and was being led to faith in Jesus Christ by Philip.

The act of baptism is significant because it initiates the eunuch into the Christian community, giving him access to the sacraments and the spiritual benefits that come with being a member of the Church. The eunuch's baptism also shows that the Church is open to all people, regardless of their background or social status, and that anyone can be saved through faith in Jesus Christ.

Furthermore, the story of the Ethiopian eunuch is also seen as a manifestation of the universality of the Catholic Church and the universality of salvation. It shows that salvation is not limited to any specific race or nationality and that the Church is open to people from every culture, social status, and ethnic group, as long as they have faith in Jesus.

In summary, the Catholic perspective on the baptism of the Ethiopian eunuch emphasizes the importance of initiation into the Christian community through the sacrament of baptism and the universality of salvation offered to all people through faith in Jesus Christ.

Unfortunately, for the Ethiopian eunuch there was no Christian community into which he was baptized, unless you ascribe to the concept of the "invisible" church. Following his baptism he had no access to any of the various sacraments recognized by your denomination.

I suppose the question now is whether or not you believe in the "invisible" church. Many Catholic posters here at CF have objected quite strenuously to the concept. What is your view?

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Unfortunately, for the Ethiopian eunuch there was no Christian community into which he was baptized, unless you ascribe to the concept of the "invisible" church. Following his baptism he had no access to any of the various sacraments recognized by your denomination.

I suppose the question now is whether or not you believe in the "invisible" church. Many Catholic posters here at CF have objected quite strenuously to the concept. What is your view?

Philip was a member of the Christian community. The Eunuch was "immersed" in the Christian community.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Philip was a member of the Christian community. The Eunuch was "immersed" in the Christian community.

Was this community visible or invisible as far as the eunuch was concerned? Was he enabled to receive any sacraments from this community following his baptism?