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Featured A Healing Priestess and Feminist Christianity

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by Raphael Jauregui, Jun 17, 2017.

  1. Raphael Jauregui

    Raphael Jauregui Episcopalian, liberal Anglican, Mdiv

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    Ebenezer Lutheran Church in San Francisco, also known as 'Her Church', is a congregation of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America and identifies as a congregation which focuses on women's spirituality and feminist thealogies.

    The congregation also advertises itself as a centre for women to explore feminist images of God and has a 'healing priestess.'

    A Healing Priestess, ‘Changing Church’
     
  2. bettercallpaul

    bettercallpaul Part time Catholic

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    How to write this without sounding like a misogynist?
    OK, pass.
     
  3. tstor

    tstor Where there is no whisperer, quarreling ceases.

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    [​IMG]
     
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  4. rich rio

    rich rio New Member

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    Reply to Thursday: (This info is good for everyone as well)

    Rich rio
    Thursday. Your not even using the K.J.V.

    Other versions change 5% of Gods word for copy right reasons so they can make money.

    You know other versions take out the deity of God, so much more. The other versions have verses taking out.

    The KJV didn't even exist for 1600 years. Are you joking?

    Well Thursday!!!
    Do you even know anything about manuscripts?.
    There are 3 manuscript trees.
    Most early version and newer modern versions go off the (1.Ancestor of Alexandrian manuscripts.)
    People from Alexandra Egypt worship alot of false gods.
    Ancestor of Alexandrian manuscripts.
    1.Papyrus
    75
    C.300 A.D
    Codex B
    4th century
    2.Papyrus
    66
    C.300 A.D
    Codex Aleph 4th century
    The revised version 1881,
    The American standard version 1946( also did you know that American means "Land of the plumed serpent". The serpent is Satan;its sad there is a version called American standard version. Well it fits though Satan inspires to change the word of THE TRUE LIVING GOD.
    Also little more info about American equals Amerioca-pans in 1595. Also Amaraca pans.
    Then the Revised standard version in 1946, next
    the New English Bible in 1961.
    Tree number 2.) Ancestor of western family.
    The Jesuit version or versions.
    1. Old Latin versions 2th century.
    Codex D 5th or 6th century.
    Codex E2 4th century.
    2.Latin Vulgate 4th century.
    Codex D2 6th century.
    The Douai version. Which is later with vast changes becomes the catholic version; comes from this manuscript tree.
    #3 manuscript tree.
    Manuscripts of the Traditional text.
    1.Gothic version 4th century.
    Codex W Mathew 4th or 5th century.
    The Vast Majority of EXTANT New Testament manuscripts.
    2.Peshitta Syriac 2nd century.
    Codex A (Gospels) 5thcentury.
    This is the King James Version 1611
    Then the King James Version 1629.
    Also William Tyndale used this manuscript tree in 1528 first English translation.
    Theses are the manuscript trees.

    What manuscript tree does the version you use fall under?
     
  5. Paidiske

    Paidiske Bodily member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    For my taste, taking the focus off Christ, and putting it on women's spirituality and issues, is the wrong way around.

    Not that we should never pay attention to nurturing particular spiritualities or dealing with particular issues, but they should never be the centre. (Also, I do think there are valid feminine images for the divine - they're in the Bible, after all! - but it's about how you use them...)

    (I also find it personally irritating, because this is the sort of stuff people seem to suspect is true of more mainstream women in ministry, and it doesn't help that there are actually people out there pushing it).
     
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  6. Zoii

    Zoii Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure why this is upsetting. Is it because there is a focus on women or is it that one person interviewed does faith healing.....or is it something else
     
  7. Tolworth John

    Tolworth John Well-Known Member

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    I wonder how they deal with the fact that the head of the Church is Jesus, A male headship, not female.
     
  8. Zoii

    Zoii Well-Known Member

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    Maybe they see it as an old fashioned view
     
  9. Tolworth John

    Tolworth John Well-Known Member

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    Well yes the idea of a godess and of priests and priestess is a very old fashioned idea.

    But Jesus is clearly male and he said he was the head of the church so if they choose to denie this they are also denieing what the bible teaches so it follows that their believes could well be unbiblical.
     
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  10. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    A series of disclaimers:

    1) I am ELCA, and Ebenezer also is, technically, ELCA. Honestly, this makes me cringe a great, great deal.
    2) I also self-identify as a feminist, but there's a difference between feminism, and even feminist approaches to theology, and heresy and idolatry.

    There is plenty from within historic, orthodox Christian teaching and practice by which to draw from in regard to matters of social justice, sexual and gender ethics, etc; I have a difficult time, based on what little I've seen and read about "Her Church" that jives with standard Lutheran belief and practice, let alone Christian faith and practice. Dipping into heresy and idolatry is not an option here. The way it seems to me, this isn't about Christian sexual and gender ethics or a healthy discussion about them, and cultural engagement; this isn't about feminism either; even if all the intention is well meaning and good, a lot of heresy has been the result of well meaning intentions.

    There are ways to discuss these things, there are ways to express these things, and there are ways to engage these things without falling into heretical and idolatrous religious teachings and practices.

    Those are my couple of pennies worth speaking as a Lutheran who has attended ELCA churches the last few years and who also identifies as socially/politically liberal and theologically traditional/confessional.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  11. Zoii

    Zoii Well-Known Member

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    Did Jesus say all pastors have to be males
     
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  12. Tolworth John

    Tolworth John Well-Known Member

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    No he didn't, bu he didn't choose a female apostle.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2017
  13. Adstar

    Adstar Well-Known Member

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    A place i would avoid like the plague...
     
  14. FireDragon76

    FireDragon76 Well-Known Member

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    There's nothing remotely Lutheran about Ebenezer. Frankly, it's embarrassing. Their teachings and practices are not at all consistent with our confessions.

    As P pointed out, the "priestess" label comes across now days as disrespectful to women in ministry. Ebenezer's "thealogy" is like a right-wing parody of mainline churches. Unfortunately, it is real and it's something we have to deal with.

    But you're bound to get this type of stuff in California. It's got more than its share of crazies.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2017
  15. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    True, but He also didn't choose any Gentile apostles either.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
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  16. Tolworth John

    Tolworth John Well-Known Member

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    On that bases you recognise that spiritual leadership must be male and of jewish disent.

    Fortunetly the apostals realised they had the authority to appoint leaders.
    That they followed their cultral trend is clear.
    The question is should we follow what our culture is saying to us or should we seek to apply biblical principals to our choices.

    To put it another way, is feminism something Christians should be involved with if it means throwing out what the bible teaches.
     
  17. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis Evangelical Catholic of the Augsburg Confession

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    If the argument that women can't be ordained hinges on Jesus not having chosen any women among the Twelve, then it follows that Gentiles can't be ordained since Jesus did not choose any Gentiles to be among the Twelve either.

    I have no problem with Gentiles being ordained to the ministry of Word and Sacrament, but then I also don't believe the lack of women among the Twelve is a sufficient or particularly valid argument against female ordination.

    Also note that I am referring specifically to the Twelve, because as a point of fact, there were female apostles, or at the very least, one mentioned specifically in Holy Scripture: St. Junia the Apostle.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
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  18. Raphael Jauregui

    Raphael Jauregui Episcopalian, liberal Anglican, Mdiv

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    He chose Mary and Martha as disciples; they were pastors to the other apostles when they were the first to preach the resurrection.
     
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  19. JacquelineDeane55

    JacquelineDeane55 Newbie

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    It is generally believed in my family that Pastors cannot be female, no. The Scripture says that a bishop must be the husband of one wife.

    Females cannot be husbands. So it is referring to males only.

    So he cannot be polygamous either or it is sin. I am *cough* talking about the Mormons *cough*. They think it is OK to have several wives. You would think they have never read that verse before.

    Having several wives creates issues of loyalty anyway. He could abandon one wife for another. It's not being true like Christ is.

    My mom doesn't let me go into any churches with female pastors anyway. She thinks they are all heretics. If anything disagrees with her beliefs, she avoids it at all costs. She is very strong in what she believes, I don't think you could convince her otherwise.
     
  20. Raphael Jauregui

    Raphael Jauregui Episcopalian, liberal Anglican, Mdiv

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    That was written in a specific context. For example, Paul may have been writing about bishops who tried to marry more than one spouse. That is generally what is believed about the situation to which Paul was speaking.

    In other passages, women are definitely in leadership roles and in roles that, when they are held by men, are understood as an early form of ordination. Romans 16:1-8 shows Paul sending Phoebe to deliver his message. This role is shared by male pastors in the early Church. Then, it refers to Priscilla as a deaconess. In verse 8, Junia is referred to as "among the apostles."
     
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