7 Day creation- literal or figurative?

[GenemZ]

Since the Holy Spirit knows more than any man ever will, I study what is actually written by Him, since there are thousands of denominations or unsupported "beliefs" of men. Since a man wrote the book you cited, I'm not interested in studying his personal view which does NOT agree with all of the other denominational views.

So, you're not man...Because? According to your logic? If you are? I should not listen to you.

 

[Aman777]

So, you're not man...Because? According to your logic? If you are? I should not listen to you.

Amen, unless I can support my views with actual Scripture.

 

[GenemZ]

Amen, unless I can support my views with actual Scripture.

You made up stuff while using Scripture. That does not count.
What you do is in the style of mysticism type thinking. Esoteric and abstruse. You can not back up what you claim by using just one passage, even if your speculation is given to sound matter of factly.

You must know you are making it up. Perhaps? Its because you think that's what everyone else is doing anyway? To do so is like saying, the Word of God does not really mean anything that is exact and can not truly be understood.

 

[GenemZ]

No, the 7th Day is Eternity. God has but 7 Days (yowm-periods of time) and today remains the 6th Creative Day/Age.

Periods of time do not have nights included. It does not work that way. Simply one period ends as the next begins when it refers to periods in time.

That's because God is STILL creating Adam (Heb-mankind) in His Image or in Christ Spiritually. That means that we live today at Gen 1:27 and we will NOT advance to the prophecy of Gen 1:28-31 until AFTER Jesus returns to this Earth.

It does not mean that. For the Bible tells us that those in the Church are a new creation in Christ. Not just anothe same old type of creation newly created. Its something that comes along and is unique. That creation was not mentioned in Genesis 1:27, at all. It speaks only of souls in a general sense - male and female. The word "new creation" in the Greek indicates a creation unlike anything else that preceded it.

2 Corinthians 5:17

Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things
have passed away; behold, all things have become new.
​

No OT saint's soul functioned spiritually like a Church age believer has been granted the right to live.


Now?... Back up what you proclaimed, with chapters and verse. Here's your chance to do as you say I should do it.

 

[Aman777]

You made up stuff while using Scripture. That does not count.
What you do is in the style of mysticism type thinking. Esoteric and abstruse. You can not back up what you claim by using just one passage, even if your speculation is given to sound matter of factly.

Scripture does not teach that everything must be backed up by just one passage. Here is what Scripture actually teaches:

Isa 28:9 ¶ Whom shall He teach knowledge? and whom shall He make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. Isa 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

*** You must know you are making it up. Perhaps? Its because you think that's what everyone else is doing anyway? To do so is like saying, the Word of God does not really mean anything that is exact and can not truly be understood.

Scripture can be understood only by those who are born Spiritually 1Co 2:14 and who study to show themselves approved unto God 2Ti 2:15 and those who live in the last days. Dan 12:4 Those who continue to teach that ancient religious traditional view are teaching the theology of the religious leaders who later called for the Crucifixion of their own God. Jhn 19:6

 

[Aman777]

Periods of time do not have nights included. It does not work that way. Simply one period ends as the next begins when it refers to periods in time.

Sure they do. The Hebrew word "yowm" can mean 12 hours, 24 hours, a lifetime or eternity. It's a period of time; any period of time. It shows both the beginning AND the end of a work. Since today remains the present 6th Day or Age, it includes the morning and evening of many earth days and nights.

Aman:>>That's because God is STILL creating Adam (Heb-mankind) in His Image or in Christ Spiritually. That means that we live today at Gen 1:27 and we will NOT advance to the prophecy of Gen 1:28-31 until AFTER Jesus returns to this Earth.

*** It does not mean that. For the Bible tells us that those in the Church are a new creation in Christ. Not just anothe same old type of creation newly created. Its something that comes along and is unique. That creation was not mentioned in Genesis 1:27, at all. It speaks only of souls in a general sense - male and female. The word "new creation" in the Greek indicates a creation unlike anything else that preceded it.

Amen. Notice that it is God (Elohim-the Trinity) Who does the "creating". God creates ONLY 3 times in Genesis 1 and every time it's an Eternal creation. Lord God (YHWH/Jesus) always "forms" or "makes" since it shows a temporary creation. This reveals that creeping things, which are His kinds or the kinds made by Lord God or Jesus, will NOT be in Heaven.

***2 Corinthians 5:17

Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things
have passed away; behold, all things have become new.
​

No OT saint's soul functioned spiritually like a Church age believer has been granted the right to live.

Adam, Eve, and Abel were "created" by God (The Trinity). Gen 5:1-2 and Heb 11:4

*** Now?... Back up what you proclaimed, with chapters and verse. Here's your chance to do as you say I should do it.

Sure.
Gen 1:26 ¶ And God said, Let US make man in OUR image, after OUR likeness:
Jesus is the only God ever formed or that ever will be formed physically. He IS the physical Image and likeness of the invisible God. Col 1:15

Jesus confirms that it takes the Trinity to create:
Jhn 14:15 ¶ If ye love Me, keep My commandments. Jhn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that He may abide with you for ever; Jhn 14:17 Even the Spirit of Truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth Him not, neither knoweth Him: but ye know Him; for He dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

See? It's the same Spiritual Creation which takes the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, in the O.T. and the N.T. and it is the Trinity Who creates Spiritually and Eternally. Amen?

 

[GenemZ]

Scripture does not teach that everything must be backed up by just one passage. Here is what Scripture actually teaches:

Isa 28:9 ¶ Whom shall He teach knowledge? and whom shall He make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. Isa 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

*** You must know you are making it up. Perhaps? Its because you think that's what everyone else is doing anyway? To do so is like saying, the Word of God does not really mean anything that is exact and can not truly be understood.

Scripture can be understood only by those who are born Spiritually 1Co 2:14 and who study to show themselves approved unto God 2Ti 2:15 and those who live in the last days. Dan 12:4 Those who continue to teach that ancient religious traditional view are teaching the theology of the religious leaders who later called for the Crucifixion of their own God. Jhn 19:6

Sir.. you contradict yourself with what you quoted.


Isa 28:9 ¶ Whom shall He teach knowledge? and whom shall He make to understand doctrine? them that are weaned from the milk, and drawn from the breasts. Isa 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

That means here a verse, there a verse... LINE UPON LINE! The Church only had the Torah in its beginning! And, you quoted? OT Scriptures on top of it all.

You continue not to know what you are talking about.

 

[GenemZ]

Sure they do. The Hebrew word "yowm" can mean 12 hours, 24 hours, a lifetime or eternity. It's a period of time; any period of time. It shows both the beginning AND the end of a work. Since today remains the present 6th Day or Age, it includes the morning and evening of many earth days and nights.

You are dodging the context. Yes, "yom" can hold several meanings. But, Genesis 1:3-5 .. gives the context for its meaning! "Yom" was used for when there was light. "Night" was when there was darkness. It can not possibly be speaking about the other possible meanings.


3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 And God saw the light, that it was good;
and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness He
called Night. So the evening and the morning were the first day.

You have been turning a blind eye to the context, evidently, because, you were so set on following something different.

 

[JoeP222w]

I'm after thoughts and opinions Gods 7-day creation. Did Moses right it as a narrative to the Israelites? Is Genesis all figurative language?

Thoughts and opinions on the controversial topic!

It was 7 literal 24 hour days.

Genesis has a mixture of literary styles, as all of the Bible has a mixture of literary styles. But in the case of Genesis 1 and 2 it is literal.

 

[Aman777]

You are dodging the context. Yes, "yom" can hold several meanings. But, Genesis 1:3-5 .. gives the context for its meaning! "Yom" was used for when there was light. "Night" was when there was darkness. It can not possibly be speaking about the other possible meanings.

3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 And God saw the light, that it was good;
and God divided the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness He
called Night. So the evening and the morning were the first day.

You have been turning a blind eye to the context, evidently, because, you were so set on following something different.

Again, you show only a surface understanding, while ignoring the deeper meaning. Tell us what you think the light is. It couldn't be the Sun since it was not made until the 4th Day Gen 1:16. What is this light which God called Day and why is it good?

 

[GenemZ]

Again, you show only a surface understanding, while ignoring the deeper meaning. Tell us what you think the light is. It couldn't be the Sun since it was not made until the 4th Day Gen 1:16. What is this light which God called Day and why is it good?

In the future there will be no more sun. The Lord will be the light!

Revelation 22:5

There shall be no night there: They need no lamp nor light of the sun,
for the Lord God gives them light. And they shall reign forever and ever.​

He did that in Genesis One. He has that ability, and provided the light for the first three days!

Why the first three days without a sun? The first three days was a type of reenactment of the way days were once manifested in the previous prehistoric creation. That was world where the angels had been given dominion, not Adam. Why can I say that? What Scripture?

Isaiah tells us that Lucifer used to herald in the morning light (Isaiah 14:12). Lucifer was created in the Lord's image, too. But, in a different way than man. Light bearing! The Lord revealed light in the first three days of Genesis. Without Lucifer to begin the morning as before his fall, the Lord provided all the light for the the day. Fallen Lucifer was now being left out of heralding in the mornings. The angels watching this going on were most likely assuming that this world was going to be much like the creation they had reigned in.

Angels bearing light? We can deduct from words found in Job 38, that some did bear light in the prehistoric creation. But, not tremendous light like Lucifer produced who was able to bring in the mornings. These special angels most likely ruled through the night. For, the angels are called "morning stars" and had a different function from the regular angels.

My guess is that the morning star angels were used to set seasons and to help with the needed migration of the herds on that prehistoric earth. Just like our sun, moon, and stars are said to do in our world's creation.

Job 38:6-7

To what were its foundations fastened?
Or who laid its cornerstone,When the
morning stars sang together, And all
the sons of God shouted for joy?​

Two different kinds of angels are mentioned in that passage..

There were two species of angels created by God. Two races of angels. One race was created to be light bearers. The other race, was not light bearing. That is why we see such a name as Lucifer! Lucifer means,
"light-bringing." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer

The first three days were like days the angels had always been accustomed to. Then! When God made the sun, moon, and stars to bear light? God was slamming down the arrogance and pride of the fallen angels, who in the previous creation must have felt they had been indispensable. They obviously felt "superior" to the non-light angels. And there was God in Genesis One, replacing these arrogant angels with dead, light bearing rocks floating in space! It must have been a shock to the angels to see that new way to produce lights for day and night.

.

 

[Aman777]

Why the first three days without a sun? The first three days was a type of reenactment of the way days were once manifested in the previous prehistoric creation. That was world where the angels had been given dominion, not Adam. Why can I say that? What Scripture?

UnScriptural since Adam was made BEFORE the Angels and that is WHY mankind will be given dominion or rule over Angels. Gen 1:28 First, there was Jesus on the FIRST Day. Gen 1:3 Then, there was Adam on the THIRD Day. Gen 2:4-7 This means the Angels were made between the 3rd Day and the 5th Day when every living creature that moveth was made from the water. Gen 1:21 Your Theory does NOT agree with the creation order.

Also, you are saying that there was a time BEFORE Jesus came into the physical world on the 1st Day. That is commonly called the Gap Theory which cannot be shown Scripturally. Most teach it happened between Gen 1:1 and Gen 1:2. Is that your view?

 

[GenemZ]

UnScriptural since Adam was made BEFORE the Angels and that is WHY mankind will be given dominion or rule over Angels.

And, the angels are not even mentioned being created in this current creation? But, the animals were mentioned?


You must be joking.

 

[Darkness Flame]

II Peter 3:8-9
‘But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day. The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.’

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[GenemZ]

II Peter 3:8-9
‘But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day. The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.’

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That speaks of the irrelevance of time to God. Not, that God makes a day into a thousand years.

God is Eternal and does not reside within the limits of time. A thousand years is nothing to God. Notice? It says its "like" a day - thousand years. That speaks of how time means nothing to God. A single day to us? The Lord can see a billion details that we would take a thousand years for us to observe. He "takes" his time as he slowly observes what would look like a split second to us. God is therefore never impatient with anyone. It has nothing to do with the six days of creation.

 

[Darkness Flame]

That makes a lot of sense. Does it say that in the Bible?

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[Aman777]

That speaks of the irrelevance of time to God. Not, that God makes a day into a thousand years.

God is Eternal and does not reside within the limits of time. A thousand years is nothing to God. Notice? It says its "like" a day - thousand years. That speaks of how time means nothing to God. A single day to us? The Lord can see a billion details that we would take a thousand years for us to observe. He "takes" his time as he slowly observes what would look like a split second to us. God is therefore never impatient with anyone. It has nothing to do with the six days of creation.

Amen.

 

[GenemZ]

That makes a lot of sense. Does it say that in the Bible?

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The Word contains what teaches it ..Over time and with additional learning as we grow in the knowledge it possesses. God leaves it up to us to seek and discover what certain things mean. But, never without God's grace. For, only by the Holy Spirit's enabling are we able to come to understand certain truths.

First we need to gain in knowledge that God wants use to bring us forming our own conclusions. That is why its so important to find teachers who have an accurate grasp. Nat teachers simply tell the hearers things they think they want to hear. A good teacher will show you truths you need to know about, but may have you wonder why its something you must know. For God wants to bring us beyond our own understanding about the life He has chosen us for having.

Here is a verse they puts it in a nutshell.

Philippians 1:9

And this is my prayer: that your love may abound
more and more in knowledge and depth of insight.​

God's love in us grows according to our knowledge. Knowledge that leads to having insight into God's plan and God's life in us. It must be by sound doctrine that we learn. Too many fakers are out there who wish to appeal to our emotions and human reasoning. Only sound doctrine will build us up in having the Mind of Christ. Sound doctrine can be not exciting at first because it makes us realize how much we do not know. Human appeal teachings feels good because it makes us feel like we have already arrived. Believers will suffer a bit and find it uncomfortable at times, because sound doctrine is taking away from us our old way of enjoying life. Its feeding the new man who must replace our old man in life experience. Many refuse to lose their life so that they can find their life in Christ.

Instead, they will seek out teachers who will tell them what they want to hear so they can keep their old man alive. But, this time doing so with misapplied Bible verses to make them feel like they are pleasing God. Its sad. But, its also good that we see what God desires of us while here on earth. For most believers will not like sound doctrine at first. It will make them uncomfortable if they wish to continue living as they always have. For we all must learn how wrong we were about certain issues that we hold dear to our human position. These ones will quit seeking what God would have them to seek, and find teachers who make them feel good about how they want to see things.

2 Timothy 4:3​

For the time will come when people will not put up/tolerate/endure sound doctrine.
Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather round them a great number of teachers
to say what their itching ears want to hear. ​

Yes... the flesh is at enmity with the Spirit. And, the Spirit is at enmity with our flesh. Many DO NOT want sound doctrine. They would rather have teachings that cause them to have emotional responses that harmonize with they way they wish to believe in their natural perspectives. No transformation into the likeness of Christ (in their thinking). Only dogmatic stubbornness, or an immovable sweet facade that appears nice, but is filled with dead ideas which substitute for having truth.

Its all adds up to? If you are going to pursue sound teachings? You must deny self and take up your cross. For you will be rejected by those whom sound doctrine will demand you reject. Spirit filled believers must go through some suffering if they are to become closer to Christ through knowledge of His Word. It must sanctify you. Sanctification is being made separate and cleaned from the thinking of the world view. Even churchianity is a form of world view.

Churchianity is a subculture of thinking that has integrated with the world. Its what the world expects from believers. Yet, Jesus said that if you are lead of the Spirit? The world will not be able to know where you are coming from. Nor, know which way you will be heading. But, the world will hear what you have to say when God will have it to be heard.

John 3:8

The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where
it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.’​

So, everything is not going to be broken down for you in some neat logical package that can be comprehended on the same level as one studies for an academic test in the world. God's Word is not studied to take a quiz. Its studied to build up and cause you to become strong in Christ like nutrients are to a body builder.

grace and peace!

 

[Radrook]

I'm after thoughts and opinions Gods 7-day creation. Did Moses right it as a narrative to the Israelites? Is Genesis all figurative language?

Thoughts and opinions on the controversial topic!

If Genesis were all figurative language then we would have to dismiss Jesus's references to the events of Genesis as references to mere myth. However Jesus doesn't treat the events of Genesis in that fashion. Neither did the Jews consider Genesis merely figurative.

For example, in their encounter with the people of Canaan they said that the Nephilim described in Genesis were living there.

They also made continuous reference to their father Abraham, the punishment of an ancient world in a flood, and the chastisement of rebel angels who had disobeyed Giod prior to the flood as being in Tartarus and compared their sin as similar to that of the people of Sodom and Gomorrah.

In fact, Jesus tells us that during Judgment day it will be more tolerable for people of Sodom and Gomorrah, two cities mentioned in Genesis,
than for certain first-century cities which rejected Jesus' as the foretold messiah.

The Apostle Paul includes persons mentioned in Genesis in the list of people of great faith which he provides in the book of Hebrews. He also refers to the first man Adam and tells us that he was not deceived but his wife Eve was deceived.

Revelation mentions the Edenic snake and identifies it with Satan.

In short, the NT treats it as actual history and the people mentioned in it as actual people.


The following article delves deeper into the issue:

Does God expect us to read Genesis 1-11 as a record of authentic historical fact, or is this simply a collection of parable-like stories?
http://christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-c024.html

 

[GenemZ]

If Genesis were all figurative language then we would have to dismiss Jesus's references to the events of Genesis as references to mere myth. However Jesus doesn't treat the events of Genesis in that fashion. Neither did the Jews consider Genesis merely figurative.

For example, in their encounter with the people of Canaan they said that the Nephilim described in Genesis were living there.

They also made continuous reference to their father Abraham, the punishment of an ancient world in a flood, and the chastisement of rebel angels who had disobeyed Giod prior to the flood as being in Tartarus and compared their sin as similar to that of the people of Sodom and Gomorrah.

In fact, Jesus tells us that during Judgment day it will be more tolerable for people of Sodom and Gomorrah, two cities mentioned in Genesis,
than for certain first-century cities which rejected Jesus' as the foretold messiah.

The Apostle Paul includes persons mentioned in Genesis in the list of people of great faith which he provides in the book of Hebrews. He also refers to the first man Adam and tells us that he was not deceived but his wife Eve was deceived.

Revelation mentions the Edenic snake and identifies it with Satan.

In short, the NT treats it as actual history and the people mentioned in it as actual people.


The following article delves deeper into the issue:

Good comments!

People who must resort to saying Genesis is myth are unable to know God is real.