Solar system may be one of a kind

blixation

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WASHINGTON (Reuters) -- Our solar system may be unique after all, despite the discovery of at least 120 other systems with planets, astronomers said on Wednesday.

All the other solar systems that have been found have big, gassy planets circling too close to their stars to allow them to be anything like Earth or its fellow planets, the British and U.S.-based researchers said.

If that is the case, Earth-like planets will be very rare, the astronomers write in the latest issue of the Monthly Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society.

"Maybe these other extrasolar systems ... contain only the giant planets," said Mario Livio of the Space Telescope Science Institute in Baltimore.

Livio and colleagues took a close look at what is known about the other planetary systems that have been discovered.

"In (our) solar system the orbits are very circular. Most of the giant planets observed in extrasolar systems have very elliptical orbits," Livio said in a telephone interview.

This could mean that astronomers have been wrong in assuming that all planets formed in basically the same way.

Livio said most experts thought that planets formed out of dust. "This dust coagulates and forms small rocks and the rocks combine and form small bodies and then those bodies form things like Earths," he said.

"The Earths collect and accrete gas and then they form giant planets like Jupiter. That is one model."

But so far no one has found a planet outside our solar system that looks like it formed that way.

"Then there is a second model that has been suggested specifically for the formation of giant planets like Jupiter. You start with a gas disk and this disk becomes unstable and it breaks up into large clumps and those clumps are the things that form giant planets," Livio said.

"In that model it is not obvious at all how planets like Earth may have formed."

It could be our solar system formed in the first way and most of the others formed in the second way, Livio said.

But he said it is hard to tell as planets outside this solar system can only be detected through indirect observation and these methods are not able to detect smaller planets like Earth.

Either way, it is time to start thinking about the possibility that our system is unique or at least unusual, Livio said.

What has been seen up to now does not bode well for the main purpose of seeking other planets -- finding life outside our solar system.

"If the orbit is very elliptical then the planet may come very close to its sun at some point and that doesn't appear to be very healthy for life," Livio said.

Cite: http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/space/08/05/space.planets.reut/index.html

Wow, this article seems to be very interesting. Especially when it is saying that the conditions that earth has been "formed" in may be special (extremely rare) after all. Glory to God!
 

Arikay

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It seems to me like they are jumping to conclusions a bit. Our model might need adjustment, but I think I would want a bigger sample of solar systems first. Finding planets is pretty hard (look at the best pictures and data we have of pluto and its In our solar system). The number of solar systems (especially ones with small planets) that haven't been found is pretty large.
 
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Nathan Poe

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blixation said:
Wow, this article seems to be very interesting. Especially when it is saying that the conditions that earth has been "formed" in may be special (extremely rare) after all. Glory to God!
Glory indeed, regardless of exactly how it happened.
 
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Dale

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The thing is that at interstellar distances we can only see huge planet, gas giants. We can't see planets the size of earth at that distance. Likewise, if an earthlike body were the moon of a gas giant around another star, I don't believe we would be able to see it.
*
Don't jump to conclusions.
 
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michabo

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This would just seem to indicate that the standard model of planetary formation needs work. I don't see how one can reasonably jump from this to saying that we are genuinely unique! In all of these reports, I have never seen any attribution for the outrageous claim, so I imagine that it is the (not very scientific) reporter interjecting this provocative and unsupported spin.

Makes me think the standard of editing is sliding. Do people not understand what "unique" means? Here's a hint: it doesn't mean "unusual".
 
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Magnus Vile

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Just out of interest, and off the top of my head, but wouldn't an eliptical orbit on a gas giant be the easiest planet to see? I'm assuming a lot, but I seem to recall the planets are, or at least were, detected by the movement of their sun. A gas giant in an eliptical orbit would generate more movement than an Earth type planet in a stable orbit, wouldn't it? :scratch:

If that is the case, and we still find planets by the 'wobble' of their suns then shouldn't we expect conditions to favour finding gas giants in eliptical orbits over any other kind of planet, at least in the early stages of planetary detection?

Wouldn't that imply that of all detected solar systems we should expect to see a preponderance of those gas giants simply because they are easier to detect?

Someone help me, please... :eek:
 
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Obertray

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Aren't we all ignoring the fact that there is a huge chunk of the universe outside of the parts we can observe?

Well, not all of us...probably just the OP.

EDIT:
Life that isn't like us doesn't mean no life.
Simultaneously the most relevant and most ignored point when it comes to this subject.
 
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Stellar Vision

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Yes, our ability to find smaller extra solar planets will undoubtedly improve as the technology for astronomical observing advances. Most of what we are finding out there right now is limited to what our instruments can detect.

Obviously since a distant star's light would outshine any planet it may harbor, astronomers have to look for them indirectly. Stars with Jupiter-sized planets in elliptical orbits would likely have a noticeable wobble. Also the planet may eclipse the star, decreasing the star's apparent brightness momentarily. Take a look at this page to see some animated pictures http://astronautica.com/detect.htm

Ultimately you can expect that it will be very hard to find those tiny Earth-like planets hidden so close to their parent star.
 
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Brahe

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And even if there are no earth-like planets in existance, life that isn't like us doesn't mean no life.
If anyone is interested in pursuing the topic of life that's substantially different from Earth life, I recomment checking out Hal Clement's classic Mission of Gravity and Robert Forward's Dragon's Egg. The former is about a race of people who exist on a huge planet that rotates so quickly that the gravity on the equater is a mere 3G while the gravity at the poles is something like 700G. The planet is also in an extremely eccentric orbit, making seasonal changes rather incredible when the ammonia seas on an entire hemisphere start boiling. The latter is about life on a neutron star. Since the life is based on nuclear rather than chemical reactions, everything happens extraordinarily fast by human standards.

Finally, the Orion's Arm setting is a hard sci-fi universe which incorporates a lot of imaginative concepts. AI's and wormholes are the most recognizable concepts in a setting which includes memetic engineering, femtotechnology, Kardaschev type II polities, and Jupiter brains.
 
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revolutio

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Dale said:
The thing is that at interstellar distances we can only see huge planet, gas giants. We can't see planets the size of earth at that distance. Likewise, if an earthlike body were the moon of a gas giant around another star, I don't believe we would be able to see it.
*
Don't jump to conclusions.
That was what came to mind. I read a while back the the smallest planet we had found outside our solar system was 3 times the size of Jupiter.

Now lets compare.
Mean radius of Earth: 6,371.3 km
Mean radius of Jupiter: 778,412,010 km

This article doesn't seem to exclude that Earth-like planets could form, just that they don't know how it could happen under conditions different from those on our solar system.

Besides, life could arise in or on gas giants for all we know. To exclude it is homeocentric.
 
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Hydra009

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billwald said:
There are at least a billion galaxies and each galaxy contains at least a billion stars and we are unique. Right!
Well, we're probably unique in the sense that it is extremely unlikely that any other solar system would be exactly the same in every conceivable way, down to every last atom. In that sense, I can agree that the Sol system is unique.

But if one thinks our solar system is unique in the fact that it has planet with life or a planet that is capable of supporting life, that outcome is extremely unlikely and will probably eventually be proven wrong.
 
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Stellar Vision

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billwald said:
There are at least a billion galaxies and each galaxy contains at least a billion stars and we are unique. Right!
Have we confirmed that these billion or so stars in our galaxy alone are devoid of life? If not then we really don't know if we are yet unique in that respect.
 
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Mestel

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revolutio said:
That was what came to mind. I read a while back the the smallest planet we had found outside our solar system was 3 times the size of Jupiter.

Now lets compare.
Mean radius of Earth: 6,371.3 km
Mean radius of Jupiter: 778,412,010 km

This article doesn't seem to exclude that Earth-like planets could form, just that they don't know how it could happen under conditions different from those on our solar system.

Besides, life could arise in or on gas giants for all we know. To exclude it is homeocentric.
I think your Jupiter radius is of by about a factor of 10. It is about 71,400 km.
 
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