the myth of flat earth debunked again

contratodo said:

The Bible poetry is not just poetry, it is the divine word of God, written for a specific purpose as directed by God almighty and all knowing.
I believe the Bible is the solid anchor of truth.

Click to expand...

The Bible contains many books of different genres. Not understanding how to properly read those genres leads to false interpretations.

contratodo said:

The land is as the Bible describes:
The horizon always rises to eye level, as I've pointed out from videos posted in this thread and others.

Click to expand...

You haven't shown this and you can't because it isn't true.

contratodo said:

The sun and moon are as the Bible describes:
One can take some cardboard, cut out two circles, about a foot or so big.
Make some holes in both, about an 2 inches or so diameter, making the holes in the same locations on the two pieces.
Draw a dark circle around each hole.
Go outside on a nice sunny day with the sun above you.
Have one cardboard piece on the ground, and hold up the other above it,
notice that the rays of the sun can come through straight down, and that you can line up the rays with the circles around each hole.
This is because the light coming from the sun is very far away from the cardboard pieces.

Click to expand...

So this is evidence that the sun is very far away. Well done, you actually got something right.

contratodo said:

Go indoors with the pieces now, and use either a bright ceiling light or flash light,
a much closer light, and notice that you can not line up the light rays with the circled holes,
the light rays spread out, because the light is more local.

Click to expand...

Very true. Your point?

contratodo said:

The light coming from the sun, spreads out as it shines, because the sun is a local light in the sky.

Click to expand...

Your first experiment showed that the sun is not local and now you claim it is?

contratodo said:

If the sun were 93 million miles away, we should be bathed in a constant beam of light.

Click to expand...

As your first experiment demonstrated.

contratodo said:

Psalms 19:4-7

Click to expand...

So where is the tent for the sun located? I've never seen any flat earth model that has a tent for the sun.

contratodo said:

Take a gyroscope with you when you fly, hold it in the same position after take off, and measure any movement.

Click to expand...

Have you tried this yourself? No, of course you haven't. However, Bob Knodel, a prominent flat earther (may he rest In peace) managed to obtain a laser ring gyroscope with which he intended to prove the earth was motionless. It didn't go as he intended.

contratodo said:

The earth is flat, planes do not fly around anything, they fly straight.

From pilots:

Click to expand...

Pilots aren't going to waste time arguing with the mentally unstable.

contratodo said:

Nasa practices deception.

This is clearly evident in the supposed moon landing, one need only simply watch
the press conference after the supposed landing.

Click to expand...

If there was an earthquake or an explosion, those guys would have responded in the same calm, dry manner. They are trained to never panic in any situation.

contratodo said:

"There are great ideas undiscovered,
breakthroughs available, to those who can remove one of truth's protective layers."
Neil Armstrong

Click to expand...

Source?

contratodo said:

Nasa uses harnesses, cgi, and parabolic dives to achieve seeming zero-g.
We can see on zfxflying.com that nasa is one of their corporate clients.

Click to expand...

It's probably a lot cheaper than rides on the "vomit comet" for training in a zero-G environment.

contratodo said:

We can see David Copperfield fly, float and do flips very similar to the astronauts,
in a glass box on stage, with just harnesses, like the ones on zfxflying.

Click to expand...

Good for him

contratodo said:

The Bible is true, allowing us to see through and expose the deceptions of this world.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately people misinterpret God's Word and deceive themselves.

prodromos said:

You haven't shown this and you can't because it isn't true.

Click to expand...

Repeatedly in this thread, on various videos given by both sides,
we can clearly see a flat and eye level horizon, even in the video where they are over the north pole.
I listed the specific times in that video in a previous post of mine in this thread.
Your assertion that the horizon goes below eye level is very much proven false, in this thread,
and that you want to insist otherwise is rather silly.

contratodo said:

Repeatedly in this thread, on various videos given by both sides,
we can clearly see a flat and eye level horizon, even in the video where they are over the north pole.
I listed the specific times in that video in a previous post of mine in this thread.
Your assertion that the horizon goes below eye level is very much proven false, in this thread,
and that you want to insist otherwise is rather silly.

Click to expand...

I live on the Northern coast of Wales. It is a nice sunny and clear day right now.
On a flat earth model, I should have zero problem seeing the Isle of Man, which is 73.42 miles or 118.15 kilometres north-north-west of my location.

But I cannot. All I see is sea and sky.

Explain that.

prodromos said:

Unfortunately people misinterpret God's Word and deceive themselves.

Click to expand...

Genesis 1:7
And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament
from the waters which were above the firmament, and it was so.

Genesis 1:8
And God called the firmament Heaven.

Genesis 1:10
And God called the dry land Earth.

Genesis 1:11-13
And God said, let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed,
and the fruit tree yielding fruit after its kind, whose seed is in itself,
upon the land and it was so.

Genesis 1:14
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night
and let them be for signs and seasons and days and years

Genesis 1:17
And God set [the sun and moon] in the firmament of the heaven
to give light upon the land


But it is not so?
First the stars must have been made, right?
The stars must have come before the plants so even the order given in Genesis must be wrong, yes?
The Bible is very wrong, yes? It's much like a fiction story then, no?

The heavens declare the glory of God;
and the firmament shows His handy work
Psalms 19:1

Their line is gone out through all the land, and their words to the end of the world.
Psalms 19:4
In them He set a tent for the sun,
which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber,
and rejoices as a strong man to run a race.
Psalms 19:5

His going forth is from one end of heaven, (the sky)
and his circuit to the end of it;
and there is nothing hid from the heat of it.
Psalms 19:6




"And the sun stood still, and the moon stopped,
until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies.
Is it not written in the book of Jasher?"
Joshua 10:13

It did not really happen? That is not an actual account of what happened?


It is He that sits above the circle of the land,
and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers;
that stretches out the heavens as a curtain,
and spreads them out as a tent to dwell in
Isaiah 40:22


Job 38 is God speaking, an account of God speaking to Job.
But you say what, it is just poetry, the writer had no real connection to the voice of God?
It is not an actual account of words spoken by God? It is something else? That's what you say?


Job 38:4
Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth?

Job 38:8
Or who shut up the sea with doors,
when it brake forth, as if it had issued out of the womb?
Job 38:9
When I made the cloud the garment thereof ( of the sea! )
and thick darkness a swaddlingband for it ( Isaiah 50:3 )
and fixed my limit for it, and set bars and doors.
And said hither to shall you come, but not further:
and here shall thy proud waves be stayed ( the sky! the firmament, hard as a molten looking glass! Job 37:18 )
Job 38:10-11

But it is not an account of what God actually said? That is your contention?

Who is speaking in Job 38! Not God Almighty?

Have the gates of death been opened unto you?
Or have you seen the doors of the shadow of death?
Job 38:17

God has! In Christ!

But Job 38 is Not actually God speaking? It is something else?


Have you entered into the treasures of the snow?
Or have you seen the treasures of the hail?
Which I have reserved against the time of trouble
against the day of battle and of war?
Job 38:22-23

One of the top ten reasons Hitler lost the war, was due to the harsh Russian winter!

But Job 38 is not actually God speaking!? Is that your contention?

Warden_of_the_Storm said:

I live on the Northern coast of Wales. It is a nice sunny and clear day right now.
On a flat earth model, I should have zero problem seeing the Isle of Man, which is 73.42 miles or 118.15 kilometres north-north-west of my location.

But I cannot. All I see is sea and sky.

Explain that.

Click to expand...

Take a picture and lets look at it together.

contratodo said:

Repeatedly in this thread, on various videos given by both sides,
we can clearly see a flat and eye level horizon, even in the video where they are over the north pole.
I listed the specific times in that video in a previous post of mine in this thread.
Your assertion that the horizon goes below eye level is very much proven false, in this thread,
and that you want to insist otherwise is rather silly.

Click to expand...

Ah, this is the way of the flat earthers. Lie about what has and hasn't been demonstrated.

contratodo said:

"no filming below 10,000 feet" 1:40

8:48 map of the route

11:51 he has to leave the flight deck while they are in u.s. air space ending some point past northern Alaska

13:05 nice flat eye level horizon
13:21 more nice flat eye level horizon
13:57 Really nice

19:14 A little dark but still eye level horizon, at the pole

20:47 A celestial body on the eye level horizon.

Click to expand...

Why @prodromos is calling me a liar I do not know.

Anyone can check and see what has been said in this thread, I guess most people are too lazy to actually do it,
but no, it is that most people are using phones. I however am on a desktop, with a very large screen, and so going back and forth in the thread
and to keep proving things is not hard. @prodromos this is at least the second time I have done such in this thread.

contratodo said:

Repeatedly in this thread, on various videos given by both sides,
we can clearly see a flat and eye level horizon, even in the video where they are over the north pole.
I listed the specific times in that video in a previous post of mine in this thread.
Your assertion that the horizon goes below eye level is very much proven false, in this thread,
and that you want to insist otherwise is rather silly.

Click to expand...

prodromos said:

Ah, this is the way of the flat earthers. Lie about what has and hasn't been demonstrated.

Click to expand...

The truth is hard to battle. In fact it is impossible to sincerely battle truth.

Here is a link to what I said, pointing out each specific moment in the video we can still see the horizon eye level.



Here are the quotes of what I said

contratodo said:

"no filming below 10,000 feet" 1:40

8:48 map of the route

11:51 he has to leave the flight deck while they are in u.s. air space ending some point past northern Alaska

13:05 nice flat eye level horizon
13:21 more nice flat eye level horizon
13:57 Really nice

19:14 A little dark but still eye level horizon, at the pole

20:47 A celestial body on the eye level horizon.

Click to expand...

contratodo said:

9:40 beautiful flat stationary land.

10:11 wonderful flat eye level horizon

Click to expand...

contratodo said:

Take a picture and lets look at it together.

Click to expand...

So for internet safety rules, I will obviously not be disclosing my position of where I live fully, but I live on the northern coast of Wales (just as a recap). These were all taken from the local beach front which faces north and I tried to take the pictures in what I imagined to be a north-north-west direction (I don't have a pocket compass and I really should get one), at around an 8m elevation which is what my town sits at, give an extra half dozen metres for the first picture which is take on a small walking bridge.
These were taken on my Samsung phone, my actual photography camera is sadly on it way out and I need to get a new one.

No sign of the Isle of Man. No sign of Ireland beyond it.

Now, in the globe earth model, the horizon begins at 2.9 miles/4.7 kilometres away from the position of the observer, meaning that I would not be able to see the Isle of Man, which actually has a higher elevation on the southern edge of the island that my part of Wales, averaging around 20-odd metres in elevation.

In the flat earth model, I should have problem seeing the island at all. But I cannot.

Explain that.

Warden_of_the_Storm said:

Now, in the globe earth model, the horizon begins at 2.9 miles/4.7 kilometres away from the position of the observer, meaning that I would not be able to see the Isle of Man

Click to expand...

The isle of Man is 73.42 miles away.

Human line of sight is 3 miles.

I suspect with a p900 or similar zoom, we would see the island.

Also from this distance the perspective of the clouds may cover the island, the vanishing point effects our vision,
clouds that are in the sky, from this distance, cover the island from our perspective.
With a good zoom, we would be able to see if that is so.


Let us all also notice how nice and flat and eye level that horizon is, that is very beautiful place you are at.

contratodo said:

The isle of Man is 73.42 miles away.

Human line of sight is 3 miles.

I suspect with a p900 or similar zoom, we would see the island.

Also from this distance the perspective of the clouds may cover the island, the vanishing point effects our vision,
clouds that are in the sky, from this distance, cover the island from our perspective.
With a good zoom, we would be able to see if that is so.


Let us all also notice how nice and flat and eye level that horizon is, that is very beautiful place you are at.

Click to expand...

So you accept that we stop seeing things at 3 miles+ distance, which is the same distance as the horizon on a round earth/globe.

You defeat yourself by admitting to that point.

Warden_of_the_Storm said:

So you accept that we stop seeing things at 3 miles+ distance, which is the same distance as the horizon on a round earth/globe.

You defeat yourself by admitting to that point.

Click to expand...

Our eyes can only see so far, it has nothing to do with the supposed globe.

With a p900 or similar zoom, we would see Man island.
What happens if you use max zoom on your Samsung?

contratodo said:

Our eyes can only see so far, it has nothing to do with the supposed globe.

With a p900 or similar zoom, we would see Man island.
What happens if you use max zoom on your Samsung?

Click to expand...

What limits our eyes?
I see further than 3 miles all the time.

contratodo said:

Our eyes can only see so far, it has nothing to do with the supposed globe.

With a p900 or similar zoom, we would see Man island.
What happens if you use max zoom on your Samsung?

Click to expand...

And yet the horizon, the point where the earth to the view begins to disappear, is 2.9 miles, 0.1 mile less. I don't call that a coincidence. Especially since that's only from a ground level perspective like I was. Go higher and a person can see MUCH greater distances than 3 miles. 3 mile is the horizon, not just the distance where humans suddenly stop being able to see things.

Even on max zoom on my camera, it was impossible to see the Isle of Man (that's it's name, not 'Man island'). It just blurs, but I'll put that down more to the camera in the phone than anything else.

pgp_protector said:

What limits our eyes?
I see further than 3 miles all the time.

Click to expand...

Warden_of_the_Storm said:

And yet the horizon, the point where the earth to the view begins to disappear, is 2.9 miles, 0.1 mile less. I don't call that a coincidence. Especially since that's only from a ground level perspective like I was. Go higher and a person can see MUCH greater distances than 3 miles. 3 mile is the horizon, not just the distance where humans suddenly stop being able to see things.

Even on max zoom on my camera, it was impossible to see the Isle of Man (that's it's name, not 'Man island'). It just blurs, but I'll put that down more to the camera in the phone than anything else.

Click to expand...

I would love to see even a blurry photo of what your phone could zoom in and see.

How wide is what we see? More than three miles? Where is any curvature?

What stops are sight is the horizon, the point where the flat sky and sea meet, the overlapping clouds at that point likely cover the Isle of Man.

contratodo said:

I would love to see even a blurry photo of what your phone could zoom in and see.

Click to expand...

I'm not going back out to take a blurry photo just to satisfy you.

contratodo said:

How wide is what we see? More than three miles? Where is any curvature?

What stops are sight is the horizon, the point where the flat sky and sea meet, the overlapping clouds at that point likely cover the Isle of Man.

Click to expand...

So you admit that I cannot see the Isle of Man which, on a flat earth model, would be more than possible but considering that the Isle of Man has a greater elevation that my area of Wales and thus is higher than sea level, would be VERY hard to miss. Yet, not being able to see the island is exactly what is predicted and shown on a round earth globe, because it is hidden by the horizon.

Hence why I consider this irrefutable proof that the Flat Earth 'model' is a load of bollocks.

contratodo said:

I would love to see even a blurry photo of what your phone could zoom in and see.

How wide is what we see? More than three miles? Where is any curvature?

What stops are sight is the horizon, the point where the flat sky and sea meet, the overlapping clouds at that point likely cover the Isle of Man.

Click to expand...

What's size / curvature have to do with anything you stated and I quote.

Human line of sight is 3 miles.

Click to expand...

Or are you going to retract that now?

contratodo said:

Let us all also notice how nice and flat and eye level that horizon is, that is very beautiful place you are at.

Click to expand...

You can't 'notice' that the horizon is eye level. How does it look in a theodolite or some other surveying tool for measuring angles with respect to the perpendicular?

Different distances away but yet generally the same, eye level, flat horizon.

Warden_of_the_Storm said:

the Isle of Man has a greater elevation that my area of Wales and thus is higher than sea level, would be VERY hard to miss

Click to expand...

Isle of Man, 2,034 feet above sea level, some 600 meters

A place like Holywell is about 735 feet, about 224 meters.

The Isle of Man is at a higher elevation, but also far enough away that allows it to be blocked by our limited perspective.
With better zoom, I'm certain we would see some of the island.

contratodo said:

View attachment 344662


Different distances away but yet generally the same, eye level, flat horizon.




Isle of Man, 2,034 feet above sea level, some 600 meters

A place like Holywell is about 735 feet, about 224 meters.

The Isle of Man is at a higher elevaction, but also far enough away that allows it to be blocked by our limited perspective.
With better zoom, I'm certain we would see some of the island.

Click to expand...

But better zoom wouldn't mean anything on a flat earth because there would be no horizon to obscure it!
With the Isle of Man being at a higher elevation, I should have had not a problem seeing it but it cannot be seen in the pictures.

Your argument is bunk and worthless.