Mandatory Vaccination against Covid

mindlight · Dec 4, 2021

JulieB67 said:
Again, have you started any threads asking people if they've had their antibodies tested? That is the key -immunity. If you really had concern (along with all of our governments) that would be the focus -getting to "herd immunity" Many people have natural without even realizing it. And you can post all of the statistics you want, natural immunity has always been the gold standard and most likely be able to fight off the varients much better than some vaccines which only focus on spike proteins, etc.

And no, I'm not suggesting anyone go out and get Covid, but for those recovered from it, the natural immunity will recognize it again and most likely will equip to take on any varient.

And many have natural immunity and don't even know it. But there is no push for antibody testing. It's a simple and affordable test here in the US. But they are discouraging people to do this. Again, this should give anyone pause and question why? Why if the goal is "herd immunity" That's the only way out of a pandemic. Then some of us realize that's obviously not the goal.

The results suggest that COVID-19 mRNA vaccines are around five times more effective at preventing hospitalization than a previous infection.

COVID-19 vaccines more protective than ‘natural’ immunity

mindlight · Dec 4, 2021

bekkilyn said:
I didn't say anything about anything being built into the DNA, so your genetics of being British-German have no relevance to your understanding, or lack of, of our American culture of independence and opposition to government tyranny. Since you are not *American*, it is still not *your* culture, so while you may look similar to many Americans because of underlying genetics, we are very, very different in many other ways.

It was a phrase not a scientific statement, maybe you were not familiar with it. My point was actually the one you were making by way of rebuttal. Albeit I regard the American rebel culture dysfunctional in response to this Pandemic and you seem more anxious to avoid compliance to bad authorities than to support policies that will end this Pandemic.

mindlight · Dec 4, 2021

godleadyoursoul said:
Absolutely disgusting. Watch as some 'Christians' defend these types of moves.

Why? These irresponsible people are killing others by their negligence, something has to be done.

45 “Anyone with such a defiling disease must wear torn clothes, let their hair be unkempt, cover the lower part of their face and cry out, ‘Unclean! Unclean!’ 46 As long as they have the disease they remain unclean. They must live alone; they must live outside the camp. Lev 13:45-46

mindlight · Dec 4, 2021

Danthemailman said:
Unvaccinated Austrians Face Prison Time, Huge Fines For Non-Compliance | ZeroHedge

It is a choice between a $4000 fine or 4 weeks in prison followed by an $8000 fine for second offenders or a longer time in prison. There may be exemptions for those who have had the disease already.

mindlight · Dec 4, 2021

bekkilyn said:
It's all about the politics and power.

Exactly the unvaccinated have ignored the science or twisted it and are playing politics with peoples lives ;-)

JulieB67 · Dec 4, 2021

bekkilyn said:
It's all about the politics and power.

Yep

mindlight said:
The results suggest that COVID-19 mRNA vaccines are around five times more effective at preventing hospitalization than a previous infection.

Again, for every article you post, I can post something that suggests that natural immunity is better, so what's the point?

I go by the fact that ever since we've been on the planet, natural immunity has always been more robust in fighting certain diseases, etc. Science only wishes they could replicate the way our bodies produce memory cells and so on. Whereas you have no idea where all those extra spike proteins will lay in the next 5 years or so. It's impossible because we haven't arrived there yet.

You say people are killing people, that's ridiculous over a virus with a 99 percent survival rate whereas me personally, I want to be here in the "long run" I have family to take care of. I've had Covid and moved on. I see no need to get a shot that again is not all that effective at stopping the spread or hospitalization as the highly vaccininated Israel studies will show you - and could do me harm in the next 5 to 10 years. That's about that time in the US you'll start seeing all the commericals "Have you or a loved been effected by the Covid vaccine, if so let us help you...." Most of those commericals are for certain drugs that have been FDA approved but over the years you'll start seeing the effects. I mean it's pretty crazy even that the FDA wants to wait 55 years to release all the vaccine info because they can only produce 500 pages a month. Yeah, most of us will be dead by then and the makers. And yet you'll down someone who's weary of a shot that has no known "long term" studies out there. Again, ridiculous. This isn't leprosy, it's a virus that most people survive when they catch it. I can't help it if someone has underyling conditions. Most of these same people pass away from the flu, etc as well. Where has your concern been in the past for all these people with underlying conditions, where's all your outrage for the people not getting flu shots and so on? I mean where does it stop? And if someone feels the need to get vaccinated again, that's fine, but for others who choose not to that's fine as well.

High Fidelity · Dec 4, 2021

Mandatory? No.

But I do think unvaccinated people should be restricted from certain things, for example working in healthcare or certain social events.

Actions have consequences. As Christians we're told to bear our cross because of the consequences that following Christ could have, so it's nothing new. Make your choice, and if it is to not get vaccinated then suck it up and accept that it may mean you can't do everything you want because you're a risk to others.

mindlight · Dec 4, 2021

JulieB67 said:
Yep

Again, for every article you post, I can post something that suggests that natural immunity is better, so what's the point?

I go by the fact that ever since we've been on the planet, natural immunity has always been more robust in fighting certain diseases, etc. Science only wishes they could replicate the way our bodies produce memory cells and so on. Whereas you have no idea where all those extra spike proteins will lay in the next 5 years or so. It's impossible because we haven't arrived there yet.

You say people are killing people, that's ridiculous over a virus with a 99 percent survival rate whereas me personally, I want to be here in the "long run" I have family to take care of. I've had Covid and moved on. I see no need to get a shot that again is not all that effective at stopping the spread or hospitalization as the highly vaccininated Israel studies will show you - and could do me harm in the next 5 to 10 years. That's about that time in the US you'll start seeing all the commericals "Have you or a loved been effected by the Covid vaccine, if so let us help you...." Most of those commericals are for certain drugs that have been FDA approved but over the years you'll start seeing the effects. I mean it's pretty crazy even that the FDA wants to wait 55 years to release all the vaccine info because they can only produce 500 pages a month. Yeah, most of us will be dead by then and the makers. And yet you'll down someone who's weary of a shot that has no known "long term" studies out there. Again, ridiculous. This isn't leprosy, it's a virus that most people survive when they catch it. I can't help it if someone has underyling conditions. Most of these same people pass away from the flu, etc as well. Where has your concern been in the past for alll these people with underlying conditions, where's all your outrage for the people not getting flu shots and so on? I mean where does it stop? And if someone feels the need to get vaccinated again, that's fine, but for others who choose not to that's fine as well.

Statistically, natural immunity is not better with covid as the survey shows. You are free to post contradictory scientific evidence but you will not find any.

Generally, I agree that we should let our bodies handle it but not in this case. There is a big difference between a healthy immune system and an unhealthy one and with this pandemic, the consideration cannot be simply what works best for me personally.

Those who refuse to take the vaccine are killing others by their irresponsibility since they are five times more likely to contract the virus than vaccinated people. Also since they are taking ten times more hospital beds they are also contributing to higher general strain on the hospital system which in some cases of extreme overcapacity can also result in death.

A 1 % death rate in a population the size of the USA is 3.3 million people. That is about three times more dead people than in all the wars the USA has ever fought and to any sane person is not an acceptable casuality rate.

Flu is not so contagious and its death rate is only 0.1% so one-tenth of covid.

EDIT:

Add extra link about the Natural immunity discussion:

Reduced Risk of Reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 After COVID-19...

Please note Israeli and Cleveland studies not been peer reviewed.

JulieB67 · Dec 4, 2021

mindlight said:
Flu is not so contagious and its death rate is only 0.1% so one-tenth of covid.

So those deaths are acceptable to you, got it.

ETA Also, the death rate for the US concerning Covid this year -

The disease was reported as the underlying cause of death or a contributing cause of death for an estimated 377,883 people in 2020

So much less than even 1 percent in this case.

bekkilyn · Dec 4, 2021

mindlight said:
It was a phrase not a scientific statement, maybe you were not familiar with it. My point was actually the one you were making by way of rebuttal. Albeit I regard the American rebel culture dysfunctional in response to this Pandemic and you seem more anxious to avoid compliance to bad authorities than to support policies that will end this Pandemic.

Ends don't justify the means.

bekkilyn · Dec 4, 2021

mindlight said:
Exactly the unvaccinated have ignored the science or twisted it and are playing politics with peoples lives ;-)

No not exactly. You have taken what I said out of context and twisted it.

mindlight · Dec 4, 2021

bekkilyn said:
Ends don't justify the means.

When they save lives they do. Life trumps freedom.

bekkilyn · Dec 4, 2021

mindlight said:
When they save lives they do. Life trumps freedom.

Much evil has been done throughout history by tyrannical governments under the cover of "saving lives".

chevyontheriver · Dec 4, 2021

bekkilyn said:
Much evil has been done throughout history by tyrannical governments under the cover of "saving lives".

And the ends justifying the means is terrible moral theology.

godleadyoursoul · Dec 5, 2021

mindlight said:
Why? These irresponsible people are killing others by their negligence, something has to be done.

45 “Anyone with such a defiling disease must wear torn clothes, let their hair be unkempt, cover the lower part of their face and cry out, ‘Unclean! Unclean!’ 46 As long as they have the disease they remain unclean. They must live alone; they must live outside the camp. Lev 13:45-46

What if they don't have the disease? also, being vaccinated does not stop you from spreading it.

I've personally taken a lot of medications in my life and I can honestly say that only about 5% have actually worked, so I have little faith that the vaccine is going to do anything, and in a round about way, at least here in Australia they have admitted it, so now everybody is on a "booster" program

Lost4words · Dec 5, 2021

The world population is being forced and squeezed into accepting the vaccination in a very undemocratic and frightening manner.

Countries are getting ready to fine people if they dont take the jab! Also, stopping them from going about day to day business.

The world has gone bonkers!

The world has moved away from faith in God. In trusting God.

Man made Covid and man made vaccines are part of an agenda. Its all about controlling the population of the world.

So many have been sucked into the lies of the governments and the media.

I for one will not be forced into taking a concoction of drugs. Nope.

Trust in God.

mindlight · Dec 5, 2021

Lost4words said:
The world population is being forced and squeezed into accepting the vaccination in a very undemocratic and frightening manner.

It will not happen in the USA so more of you will probably die. In Europe we have an older population more vulnerable to this disease and tighter precautions are now being demanded by a public that has lost its patience with the anti-vaxxers and their looney tune conspiracy theories.

Countries are getting ready to fine people if they dont take the jab! Also, stopping them from going about day to day business.

The world has gone bonkers!

The world has moved away from faith in God. In trusting God.

God blesses rulers that lookout for the common good and rule with justice and truth, not those that pander to a selfish mob of individualists who do not care who they infect and who subscribe to lies.

Man made Covid and man made vaccines are part of an agenda. Its all about controlling the population of the world.

There is no evidence that covid is manmade. The vaccine is free and trains my body to beat a virus that could kill me or more likely others through me. How is that about control?

So many have been sucked into the lies of the governments and the media.

I for one will not be forced into taking a concoction of drugs. Nope.

Trust in God.

God sent the boat, the helicopter, etc. to the drowning man as the floodwater rose. But he stood on his roof and said " No, no, God will rescue me." When he drowned he asked God why He did not help and God replied- "I sent you a boat and a helicopter..."

mindlight · Dec 5, 2021

godleadyoursoul said:
What if they don't have the disease? also, being vaccinated does not stop you from spreading it.

I've personally taken a lot of medications in my life and I can honestly say that only about 5% have actually worked, so I have little faith that the vaccine is going to do anything, and in a round about way, at least here in Australia they have admitted it, so now everybody is on a "booster" program

The facts are clear and have been expressed here but you are free to ignore them.

mindlight · Dec 5, 2021

chevyontheriver said:
And the ends justifying the means is terrible moral theology.

It is always what ends and for what motives. Forcibly saving people's lives is different from forcibly ending them for example. Forcing a heroin addict to go cold turkey might save his life for example.

mindlight · Dec 5, 2021

JulieB67 said:
Yep

Again, for every article you post, I can post something that suggests that natural immunity is better, so what's the point?

I go by the fact that ever since we've been on the planet, natural immunity has always been more robust in fighting certain diseases, etc. Science only wishes they could replicate the way our bodies produce memory cells and so on. Whereas you have no idea where all those extra spike proteins will lay in the next 5 years or so. It's impossible because we haven't arrived there yet.

You say people are killing people, that's ridiculous over a virus with a 99 percent survival rate whereas me personally, I want to be here in the "long run" I have family to take care of. I've had Covid and moved on. I see no need to get a shot that again is not all that effective at stopping the spread or hospitalization as the highly vaccininated Israel studies will show you - and could do me harm in the next 5 to 10 years. That's about that time in the US you'll start seeing all the commericals "Have you or a loved been effected by the Covid vaccine, if so let us help you...." Most of those commericals are for certain drugs that have been FDA approved but over the years you'll start seeing the effects. I mean it's pretty crazy even that the FDA wants to wait 55 years to release all the vaccine info because they can only produce 500 pages a month. Yeah, most of us will be dead by then and the makers. And yet you'll down someone who's weary of a shot that has no known "long term" studies out there. Again, ridiculous. This isn't leprosy, it's a virus that most people survive when they catch it. I can't help it if someone has underyling conditions. Most of these same people pass away from the flu, etc as well. Where has your concern been in the past for all these people with underlying conditions, where's all your outrage for the people not getting flu shots and so on? I mean where does it stop? And if someone feels the need to get vaccinated again, that's fine, but for others who choose not to that's fine as well.

In Germany, natural immunity(in the sense of someone who has been infected and recovered naturally without vaccination) is being treated as a viable source of antibodies in the new lockdown legislation coming. Basically, it is about whether or not you have antibodies to the virus. So the people who are being targeted are those without them, whether from the vaccine or infection. The point here is to save lives. But as I have indicated peer-reviewed studies have shown that vaccination is a better and more comprehensive defense against this virus and the danger of reinfection than is just having been infected before.

Mandatory Vaccination against Covid

Do you think that vaccination should now be mandatory?

Yes, for almost everyone

No

See in the dark

See in the dark

See in the dark

See in the dark

See in the dark

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

See in the dark

Well-Known Member

Contemplative Christian

Contemplative Christian

See in the dark

Contemplative Christian

Well-Known Member

Active Member

Jesus I Trust In You

See in the dark

See in the dark

See in the dark

See in the dark

Similar threads