Do you believe if Christ came today you'll be saved?

Christ is Lord · Sep 25, 2019

I ask the question because recently it came to my mind. I've heard a number of times when I ask people the question they will say I need to work on x or y. However, doesn't that line of thinking mean that subconsciously you believe in meriting salvation to an extent? If Jesus came today and you think you won't go to heaven because you're smoker, addicted to inappropriate contentography, have an issue with your temper, etc. If that's the case, I believe that deep down you don't believe in salvation by faith alone (I am not knocking on those who don't affirm that). Just a food for thought what do you think?

PS: I am not talking universalism nor am I saying you can live as you want.

A_Thinker · Sep 25, 2019

Christ is Lord said:
I ask the question because recently it came to my mind. I've heard a number of times when I ask people the question they will say I need to work on x or y. However, doesn't that line of thinking mean that subconsciously you believe in meriting salvation to an extent? If Jesus came today and you think you won't go to heaven because you're smoker, addicted to inappropriate contentography, have an issue with your temper, etc. If that's the case, I believe that deep down you don't believe in salvation by faith alone (I am not knocking on those who don't affirm that). Just a food for thought what do you think?

PS: I am not talking universalism nor am I saying you can live as you want.

Christians are, very likely, striving to be better ... or not, ... until the day they depart this earth. Such is our calling.

We are not saved based upon how well we fulfilled our calling, ... but upon whether we have accepted His calling ...

Halbhh · Sep 25, 2019

12 Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13 Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14 I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.
Philippians 3 NIV

To the question -- Yes, only because I've continued to confess sins and continued to follow Him as best I can (imperfectly, and only by his help, at times stumbling, but then confessing, and being restored, by Him, to the path). It's really this way, as Paul wrote above, for us, continually. Some may think that if we don't confess, He would eventually bring such disasters and suffering on us as needed to finally force us to repentance.

That's not a theory I want to test out! By His Grace, I pray the prayer He said to you and to me to pray each day, for aid -- in Matthew chapter 6.

public hermit · Sep 25, 2019

I'm trusting wholly in Jesus Christ, in the grace and promises given through him. I strive towards the goal, but I don't assume any merit of my own. Not surprisingly, I am not yet perfect.

Christ is Lord · Sep 25, 2019

Halbhh said:
12 Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13 Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14 I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.
Philippians 3 NIV

To the question -- Yes, only because I've continued to confess sins and continued to follow Him as best I can (imperfectly, and only by his help, at times stumbling, but then confessing, and being restored, by Him, to the path). It's really this way, as Paul wrote above, for us, continually. Some may think that if we don't confess, He would eventually bring such disasters and suffering on us as needed to finally force us to repentance.

That's not a theory I want to test out! By His Grace, I pray the prayer He said to you and to me to pray each day, for aid -- in Matthew chapter 6.

I couldn’t agree with you more. It’s just that I’ve noticed that when I asked some Christians that question they see, hesitant. I too have felt that way I times. But I know folks that are of the belief that you need to be “ready” to meet him.

Christ is Lord · Sep 25, 2019

Chadrho said:
I'm trusting wholly in Jesus Christ, in the grace and promises given through him. I strive towards the goal, but I don't assume any merit of my own. Not surprisingly, I am not yet perfect.

So would you say you have an assurance that he would welcome you into heaven?

timewerx · Sep 25, 2019

Christ is Lord said:
I ask the question because recently it came to my mind. I've heard a number of times when I ask people the question they will say I need to work on x or y. However, doesn't that line of thinking mean that subconsciously you believe in meriting salvation to an extent? If Jesus came today and you think you won't go to heaven because you're smoker, addicted to inappropriate contentography, have an issue with your temper, etc. If that's the case, I believe that deep down you don't believe in salvation by faith alone (I am not knocking on those who don't affirm that). Just a food for thought what do you think?

PS: I am not talking universalism nor am I saying you can live as you want.

At that time, it's probably too late to do anything much.

Just be happy that justice is served that we receive according to our deeds. The Universe isn't about us.

Christ is Lord · Sep 25, 2019

timewerx said:
At that time, it's probably too late to do anything much.

Just be happy that justice is served that we receive according to our deeds. The Universe isn't about us.

Yeah you can’t do much. But do you believe you’ll go to heaven?

Job3315 · Sep 25, 2019

Halbhh said:
12 Not that I have already obtained all this, or have already arrived at my goal, but I press on to take hold of that for which Christ Jesus took hold of me. 13 Brothers and sisters, I do not consider myself yet to have taken hold of it. But one thing I do: Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead, 14 I press on toward the goal to win the prize for which God has called me heavenward in Christ Jesus.
Philippians 3 NIV

To the question -- Yes, only because I've continued to confess sins and continued to follow Him as best I can (imperfectly, and only by his help, at times stumbling, but then confessing, and being restored, by Him, to the path). It's really this way, as Paul wrote above, for us, continually. Some may think that if we don't confess, He would eventually bring such disasters and suffering on us as needed to finally force us to repentance.

That's not a theory I want to test out! By His Grace, I pray the prayer He said to you and to me to pray each day, for aid -- in Matthew chapter 6.

I sometimes wonder if Paul was talking about another thing, a rest in which you are aware of Salvation and the Kingdom of Heaven that is at hand.

A long time I go I realized I was "running" then I realized I am supposed to be seated in Heavenly places with Christ, learning how to rule and master sin and anything that raises against the knowledge of Christ. Then God said once, "Rest is also worship", so I learned to believe and rest in who He is and who I am in Him and not let what I see move me; I walk by faith.

Halbhh · Sep 25, 2019

Job3315 said:
I sometimes wonder if Paul was talking about another thing, a rest in which you are aware of Salvation and the Kingdom of Heaven that is at hand.

A long time I go I realized I was "running" then I realized I am supposed to be seated in Heavenly places with Christ, learning how to rule and master sin and anything that raises against the knowledge of Christ. Then God said once, "Rest is also worship", so I learned to believe and rest in who He is and who I am in Him and not let what I see move me; I walk by faith.

Yes, those 2 different passages (both from Paul) -- both the real situation, simultaneously. We are at rest in Christ (in our souls, with His peace) and also we "run the race to the end" in this world. Both together :

1As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh a and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
Ephesians 2 NIV

24Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize. 25Everyone who competes in the games goes into strict training. They do it to get a crown that will not last, but we do it to get a crown that will last forever. 26Therefore I do not run like someone running aimlessly; I do not fight like a boxer beating the air. 27No, I strike a blow to my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize.
(1rst Corinthians 9)

1Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us, 2fixing our eyes on Jesus, the pioneer and perfecter of faith.
(Hebrews 12)

public hermit · Sep 25, 2019

Christ is Lord said:
So would you say you have an assurance that he would welcome you into heaven?

I have assurance, but I don't presume. Again, the assurance comes not from anything about me, but because of who he is and what he has done. Does that make sense? I can't say "Yes" without the proper qualification, in other words. If I just said, "Yes" without the qualification it might be misunderstood.

Maybe another way to put it is: Asking me if I have assurance is like asking me if his work on the cross was efficacious for me. Yes it was, so yes I do. Or again, if you ask me what the experience of assurance is like I would say it is one of gratitude and love for him, not fear.

renniks · Sep 25, 2019

Christ is Lord said:
I ask the question because recently it came to my mind. I've heard a number of times when I ask people the question they will say I need to work on x or y. However, doesn't that line of thinking mean that subconsciously you believe in meriting salvation to an extent? If Jesus came today and you think you won't go to heaven because you're smoker, addicted to inappropriate contentography, have an issue with your temper, etc. If that's the case, I believe that deep down you don't believe in salvation by faith alone (I am not knocking on those who don't affirm that). Just a food for thought what do you think?

PS: I am not talking universalism nor am I saying you can live as you want.

Yes, only because I am trusting solely in Christ, and not in my merit. Even that requires something of me, but it is faith not works.

Job3315 · Sep 25, 2019

Halbhh said:
Yes, those 2 different passages (both from Paul) -- both the real situation, simultaneously. We are at rest in Christ (in our souls, with His peace) and also we "run the race to the end" in this world. Both together :

1As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh a and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast. 10For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.
Ephesians 2 NIV

24Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one gets the prize? Run in such a way as to get the prize. 25Everyone who competes in the games goes into strict training. They do it to get a crown that will not last, but we do it to get a crown that will last forever. 26Therefore I do not run like someone running aimlessly; I do not fight like a boxer beating the air. 27No, I strike a blow to my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize.
(1rst Corinthians 9)

1Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us, 2fixing our eyes on Jesus, the pioneer and perfecter of faith.
(Hebrews 12)

I understand what you mean, I am just very careful not to confuse rest in salvation by faith with running for salvation. I see a lot of people running for salvation because they are not aware of what they already possess because they haven't learned to rest.

We run to become aware of who's we are, who we are and what we have when we confessed with our mouth and believe in our hearts Jesus is Lord, not to obtain what we already have by that Faith in Christ. I think that's the race Paul is referring to.

John P. Alexander · Sep 25, 2019

I could live a Mother Teresa and Dobri Dobrev kind of life plus some, and my answer to this would still be that I don't know.

public hermit · Sep 25, 2019

Chadrho said:
I strive towards the goal

I strive to live the kingdom life now. I assume the fruits of the Spirit are the things that make for life: love, faithfulness, goodness, patience, self-control, etc. These are the ways of life that God always intended. So, in striving to live the Spirit led life, I am not striving for salvation so much as striving to be what I will become.

Having said that, I imagine life in God's presence will be very different than life here. Will I need patience in the Lord's presence? I don't know. What I do understand and believe is that love will remain forever, for God is love (1 Corinthians 13:13). So, that is the main thing I strive for, or strive to be and exhibit, love.

BobRyan · Sep 25, 2019

Christ is Lord said:
I ask the question because recently it came to my mind. I've heard a number of times when I ask people the question they will say I need to work on x or y. However, doesn't that line of thinking mean that subconsciously you believe in meriting salvation to an extent? If Jesus came today and you think you won't go to heaven because you're smoker, addicted to inappropriate contentography, have an issue with your temper, etc. If that's the case, I believe that deep down you don't believe in salvation by faith alone (I am not knocking on those who don't affirm that). Just a food for thought what do you think?

PS: I am not talking universalism nor am I saying you can live as you want.

In Matt 7 -- Jesus says that the vast majority of "believers" who are "doing things in Christ's name" don't go to heaven.

In 1 Cor 6 Paul says to the believers "do not be deceived"
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

In Matt 7 Jesus says it is not those who "say the right words" that go to heaven...

In Matt 18 in the lesson of Christ regarding "forgiveness revoked" Christ gives the warning to His own followers "so shall My Father do to each one of you IF ..."

In Romans 11 Paul says to believers "you stand only by your faith" and then adds "you should fear or if He did not spare them - He may not spare you either"

Christ is Lord · Sep 25, 2019

BobRyan said:
In Matt 7 -- Jesus says that the vast majority of "believers" who are "doing things in Christ's name" don't go to heaven.

In 1 Cor 6 Paul says to the believers "do not be deceived"
7 Actually, then, it is already a defeat for you, that you have lawsuits with one another. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? 8 On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11 Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

In Matt 7 Jesus says it is not those who "say the right words" that go to heaven...

In Matt 18 in the lesson of Christ regarding "forgiveness revoked" Christ gives the warning to His own followers "so shall My Father do to each one of you IF ..."

In Romans 11 Paul says to believers "you stand only by your faith" and then adds "you should fear or if He did not spare them - He may not spare you either"

So you would answer by saying, "no" or "I am not sure"?

BobRyan · Sep 25, 2019

Christ is Lord said:
So you would answer by saying, "no" or "I am not sure"?

In the Arminian model (And I am Arminian to some extent) -- you CAN know you are saved today (See Rom 8:16) but you can't know that 10 years from today you will still be saved. The Holy Spirit gives us the assurance of salvation - for today, if we ask Him.

So my answer would be "yes"

Christ is Lord · Sep 25, 2019

BobRyan said:
In the Arminian model (And I am Arminian to some extent) -- you CAN know you are saved today (See Rom 8:16)

Sounds about right coming from an Adventist (I don't mean that in a derogatory way)

BobRyan said:
but you can't know that 10 years from today you will still be saved. The Holy Spirit gives us the assurance of salvation - for today, if we ask Him.

You can have assurance of today but do you have an assurance of the next minute or hour? I think you see what I am getting at

. I do agree that you can't know if you'll be saved 10-years from now but I do believe once we are loyal in our belief we can have a level of assurance. After all you can't lose your salvation.

Daniel C · Sep 25, 2019

Christ is Lord said:
So would you say you have an assurance that he would welcome you into heaven?

Yes 100%

Oh how can that be? Saying i'm saved to that level of certainty seems unreasonable but I simply take God for his word:

Ephesians 2:8-9
''For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:Not of works, lest any man should boast.''

romans 6:23
''For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.''

There's nothing I have that God or I can do to redeem myself as a fallen person,I would be rejected at the doors of the creators perfect kingdom. All I can offer is my Trust on his son Jesus Christ and accept the handshake that he offered me and accept the eternal gift of salvation he promised me for my trust.

I'm saved! Praise the lord.

Do you believe if Christ came today you'll be saved?

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