THE SABBATH IS GOD'S 4th COMMANDMENT - WHERE IS THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS IT IS ABOLISHED?
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The Hebrew concept for mankind is that all are the children of Adam. We are all blood relatives. In Isaiah 66 the context is "the New Earth".
Rebellion is true for mankind living today - but is not true in the context of the New Earth which is the Isaiah 66 context. So the context for Isaiah 66 is that all mankind in the New Earth - living in obedience -- will worship God as He intended from the start "From Sabbath to Sabbath"
No - nor do I consider that all those who pray to the dead and/or bow down before images praying to - and promising to serve the beings represented by the images - do not have the Holy Spirit.
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Praying to the dead is.
In the Catholic church praying to someone who is alive today - is forbidden.
In the Bible praying to the dead is forbidden.
Isaiah 8 "do not consult the dead on behalf of the living"
1 Thess 4 those saints who then die - are called "the DEAD" and also "the DEAD in Christ".
Reading those sample prayers to the dead we do find them requesting favors of the dead, asking guidance and protection, and promising to serve the one being prayed to.
In any case - my point is that I would never claim that all those who do such things do not have the Holy Spirit.
Those "requests" include requests for protection, guidance, answers, blessing, help, ...
The text says not to bow down before them nor serve them.
Both are being done in practice today.
4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
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Perfect. I pray we all seek to do exactly that. Acts 10:35 comes to mind, "But in every nation whoever fears Him and works righteousness is accepted by Him. The word which God sent to the children of Israel, preaching peace through Jesus, He is Lord of all..." I think we agree that is the same Word before and after and forever. Thanks.
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Hello brother BNR32FAN, nice to see you again. Some comments provided below for your consideration.
Yes brother it is very clear that the CONTEXT, topic and question of discussion, in Acts 15 was "Is CIRCUMCISION under the OLD COVENANT from the Shadow laws of the MOSIAC BOOK of the covenant EXODUS 24:7 a requirement for salvation to new gentile believers? This was the chapter topic and context as shown in ACTS 15:1-2 and why Paul and Barnabus went to talk to the Apostles in Jerusalem about.
ACTS 15:1-2
[1], And certain men came down from Judaea and taught the brethren, saying, EXCEPT YOU BE CIRCUMCISED AFTER THE CUSTOM OF MOSES, YOU CANNOT BE SAVED.
[2], And when Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and questioning with them, the brethren appointed that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, SHOULD GO UP TO JERUSALEM UNTO THE APOSTLES ABOUT THIS QUESTION.
CIRCUMCISION was a part of the SHADOW laws of MOSES written in the book COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7; DEUTERONOMY 31:26. It was never a part of God's eternal LAW (10 Commandments) that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172.
CIRCUMCISION in the OLD COVENANT was a shadow law that points to a NEW HEART to LOVE by FAITH and it is only in LOVE that God's LAW is fulfilled *ROMANS 13:8-10. This is why PAUL writes in ROMANS.
ROMANS 2:25-29 [25] For circumcision verily profits, if you keep the law: but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision is made uncircumcision. [26], Therefore if the uncircumcision keeps the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? [27], And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfils the law, judge you, who by the letter and circumcision do transgress the law? [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW, WHO IS ONE; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OF THE OUTWARD FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; AND CIRCUMCISION IS THAT OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT AND NOT IN THE LETTER; WHOSE PRAISE IS NOT OF MEN BUT OF GOD.
If ACTS 15 was talking about the 10 Commandments then Pauls writings in to the CORITHIANS do not make any sense.
1 CORITHIANS 7:19 [19] CIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, AND UNCIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, BUT THE KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD.
ROMANS 2:25-29 and 1 CORINTHIANS 7:19 is agreeing with ACTS 15 showing that physical CIRCUMCISION was a shdow law pointing to a NEW HEART to keep God's Commandments.
CIRCUMCISION as a sign of a NEW HEART in the NEW COVENANT was even fortold in the OLD TESTAMENT and repeated in the NEW TESTAMENT scriptures here (only some)..
DEUTERONOMY 30:6 [6] And the LORD your God will CIRCUMCISE YOUR HEART AND THE HEART OF YOUR DECENDENCE, TO LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART AND WITHYOU’RE YOUR SOUL, THAT YOU MAY LIVE.
JEREMIAH 4:4 [4] CIRCUMCISE YOURSELF TO THE LORD, AND TAKE AWAY THE FORESKINS OF YOUR HEART, you men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem: lest my fury come forth like fire, and burn that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings.
DEUTERONOMY 10:16 [16] CIRCUMCISE therefore THE FORESKIN OF YOUR HEART, and be no more stiff-necked.
NEW COVENANT FULFILLMENT of the SHADOWS of the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCE of CIRCUMCISION pointing the CIRCUMCISION of the HEART through faith in Christ…
ROMANS 2:25-29 [25] For circumcision verily profits, if you keep the law: but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision is made uncircumcision. [26], Therefore if the uncircumcision keeps the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? [27], And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfils the law, judge you, who by the letter and circumcision do transgress the law? [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW, WHO IS ONE; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OF THE OUTWARD FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; AND CIRCUMCISION IS THAT OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT AND NOT IN THE LETTER; WHOSE PRAISE IS NOT OF MEN BUT OF GOD.
1 CORINTHIANS 7 [19] CIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, AND UNCIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, BUT THE KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD.
This is the operation of GOD in the NEW COVENANT fortold in JEREMIAH 31:31-34; EZEKIEL 36:26 and repeated in HEBREWS 8 and HEBREWS 10.
HEBREWS 8 [10], For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR MINDS, AND WRITE THEM IN THEIR HEARTS: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
It is an interesting topical study of the scriptures comparing love and law and the NEW COVENANT, especially in the light of what JESUS says in MATTHEW 22:36-40. I believe these are key scriptures that help to give a balance to law and love. JESUS shows in v40 you cannot separate our duty of LOVE to GOD and LOVE to man from OBEDIENCE to God's LAW and without God's LAW we cannot keep it.
will continue...
Just done so and have provided some comments below.Please read post 419 friend.
Yes brother it is very clear that the CONTEXT, topic and question of discussion, in Acts 15 was "Is CIRCUMCISION under the OLD COVENANT from the Shadow laws of the MOSIAC BOOK of the covenant EXODUS 24:7 a requirement for salvation to new gentile believers? This was the chapter topic and context as shown in ACTS 15:1-2 and why Paul and Barnabus went to talk to the Apostles in Jerusalem about.
ACTS 15:1-2
[1], And certain men came down from Judaea and taught the brethren, saying, EXCEPT YOU BE CIRCUMCISED AFTER THE CUSTOM OF MOSES, YOU CANNOT BE SAVED.
[2], And when Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and questioning with them, the brethren appointed that Paul and Barnabas, and certain other of them, SHOULD GO UP TO JERUSALEM UNTO THE APOSTLES ABOUT THIS QUESTION.
CIRCUMCISION was a part of the SHADOW laws of MOSES written in the book COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7; DEUTERONOMY 31:26. It was never a part of God's eternal LAW (10 Commandments) that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172.
CIRCUMCISION in the OLD COVENANT was a shadow law that points to a NEW HEART to LOVE by FAITH and it is only in LOVE that God's LAW is fulfilled *ROMANS 13:8-10. This is why PAUL writes in ROMANS.
ROMANS 2:25-29 [25] For circumcision verily profits, if you keep the law: but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision is made uncircumcision. [26], Therefore if the uncircumcision keeps the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? [27], And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfils the law, judge you, who by the letter and circumcision do transgress the law? [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW, WHO IS ONE; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OF THE OUTWARD FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; AND CIRCUMCISION IS THAT OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT AND NOT IN THE LETTER; WHOSE PRAISE IS NOT OF MEN BUT OF GOD.
If ACTS 15 was talking about the 10 Commandments then Pauls writings in to the CORITHIANS do not make any sense.
1 CORITHIANS 7:19 [19] CIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, AND UNCIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, BUT THE KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD.
ROMANS 2:25-29 and 1 CORINTHIANS 7:19 is agreeing with ACTS 15 showing that physical CIRCUMCISION was a shdow law pointing to a NEW HEART to keep God's Commandments.
CIRCUMCISION as a sign of a NEW HEART in the NEW COVENANT was even fortold in the OLD TESTAMENT and repeated in the NEW TESTAMENT scriptures here (only some)..
DEUTERONOMY 30:6 [6] And the LORD your God will CIRCUMCISE YOUR HEART AND THE HEART OF YOUR DECENDENCE, TO LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART AND WITHYOU’RE YOUR SOUL, THAT YOU MAY LIVE.
JEREMIAH 4:4 [4] CIRCUMCISE YOURSELF TO THE LORD, AND TAKE AWAY THE FORESKINS OF YOUR HEART, you men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem: lest my fury come forth like fire, and burn that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings.
DEUTERONOMY 10:16 [16] CIRCUMCISE therefore THE FORESKIN OF YOUR HEART, and be no more stiff-necked.
NEW COVENANT FULFILLMENT of the SHADOWS of the CEREMONIAL ORDINANCE of CIRCUMCISION pointing the CIRCUMCISION of the HEART through faith in Christ…
ROMANS 2:25-29 [25] For circumcision verily profits, if you keep the law: but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision is made uncircumcision. [26], Therefore if the uncircumcision keeps the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? [27], And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfils the law, judge you, who by the letter and circumcision do transgress the law? [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW, WHO IS ONE; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OF THE OUTWARD FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; AND CIRCUMCISION IS THAT OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT AND NOT IN THE LETTER; WHOSE PRAISE IS NOT OF MEN BUT OF GOD.
1 CORINTHIANS 7 [19] CIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, AND UNCIRCUMCISION IS NOTHING, BUT THE KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD.
This is the operation of GOD in the NEW COVENANT fortold in JEREMIAH 31:31-34; EZEKIEL 36:26 and repeated in HEBREWS 8 and HEBREWS 10.
HEBREWS 8 [10], For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord; I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR MINDS, AND WRITE THEM IN THEIR HEARTS: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
It is an interesting topical study of the scriptures comparing love and law and the NEW COVENANT, especially in the light of what JESUS says in MATTHEW 22:36-40. I believe these are key scriptures that help to give a balance to law and love. JESUS shows in v40 you cannot separate our duty of LOVE to GOD and LOVE to man from OBEDIENCE to God's LAW and without God's LAW we cannot keep it.
will continue...
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Absolutely brother. Keep in mind though we cannot come to the Spirit of the law unless we first know the letter of the law. It is the letter of the law that is the mirror *JAMES 4:17 to show us that we are all sinners in need of as Saviour *ROMANS 3:20 and leads us the cross of JESUS without excuse where we come to JESUS the true physician *MATTHEW 9:12-13, just as we are nothing to offer except complete dependence on the promises of JESUS to save us and forgive us from out sins *GALATIANS 3:22-25.
We need to be BORN again to LOVE, and repent and turn away from our sins (breaking any of God's 10 commandments) confessing them to JESUS before we can by faith alone walk in God's Spirit *JOHN 3:3-7; 1 JOHN 3:3-10; GALATIANS 5:16. It is the very letter of the law that brings us to the Spirit of the law by faith *EPHESIANS 2:8. JOHN 3:15-21.
Agreed that the purpose of the SABBATH is our duty of LOVE to GOD. It is one of God's 10 Commandments that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOUESNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4; PSALMS 119:172. It is God's 4th Commandment *EXODUS 20:8-11 that is a memorial of creation which is the SEVENTH DAY of the week *GENESIS 2:1-3; EXODUS 20:8-11. God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)
I do believe also that God know the heart and in times of ignorance God does not hold us accountable to SIN until we receive a knowledge of the truth through his Word *ACTS 17:30-31, but when a KNOWLEDGE of the truth is come we need to repent and BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD *JAMES 4:17. This is the case of you refer to in ACTS 15. When we are babes we do not know much about God's WORD. As we continue in God's WORD we learn more and more how to follow JESUS and as God reveals his Word to us he expects us to BELIEVE and FOLLOW it. If we reject God's WORD then we become UNBELIEVERS if we do not seek him in forgiveness and repentance and will not enter into God's KINGDOM because we reject the gift of God's dear son (the Word) *ROMANS 6:23; HEBREWS 10:26-27; HEBREWS 6:4-8.
I agree brother, God has people in every Church the scriptures are very clear in this regard *JOHN 10:16. Where ever God's people may be if they are living up to all the knowledge of God's WORD that God has given them then they are a part of God's true people (the Church) *ACTS 17:30-31. However, the scriptures are also clear that the time is coming and now is that God's is calling all his people where ever they may be to come out from following the teachings and traditions of men *MATTHEW 15:3-9 to worship God in Spirit and in truth.
JOHN 4:23-24 [23], But the hour comes, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeks such to worship him.[24], God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
This is also shown and prophesied in the book of REVELATION 17:3-6 and REVELATION 18:1-5 before the judgments of God are poured out on mankind. God's people wherever they may be will be called out to worship GOD in Spirit and in truth. All will be called back to the WORD of GOD alone and all God's sheep will hear his Voice where ever they may be.
May God bless you as you seek him through his Word.
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I agree you are correct about the context of Isaiah 66. Sorry I didn’t see that.
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Can you please post some examples of the prayers your referring to? I’m not aware of them. Moses and Elijah were not dead at the Transfiguration of Jesus when they appeared before the apostoles and spoke with Jesus. And in exodus 20:4 the words “or any” are not in the Hebrew text. The likeness that is referred to is a likeness of pecel, idols.
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The Transfiguration was a vision, Moses & Elijah weren’t really there.
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Book: The Catholic Catechism
By John Hardon
THE CATHOLIC CATECHISM
Page 297
The Catholic Church carefully distinguishes the worship of adoration given
to God and the worship of veneration offered to the angels and saints.
And in that same section
This is completely different from the veneration offered to the angels
and saints, no matter how exalted. They deserve to be honored because of
their nearness to God. Even the Blessed Virgin, though honored with
pre-eminent veneration by the faithful, is nevertheless a creature. She is
worshipped as the greatest of the saints and the Queen of Angels, but she
is not adored.
"5 You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the Lord your God" NASB
5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. - KJV
Online book -
https://books.google.com/books?id=3K...ice%22&f=false
Prayer to St. Francis
– St. Francis
faithful servant and friend of Jesus...
... the Church honors and invokes you
universally as the patron of hopeless cases,
of things despaired of.
Pray for me who am so miserable;
make use,
I implore you,
of this particular privilege accorded to you,
to bring visible and speedy help,
where help is almost despaired of.
"Do not consult the dead on behalf of the living"
Come to my assistance in this great need......
in ALL my necessities,
tribulations and sufferings,
particularly (here make your request),
and that I may bless God with you
and all the elect forever.
"Nor SERVE them"
I promise you,
O blessed St. Jude,
to be ever mindful of this great favor,
and I will never cease to honor you
as my special and powerful patron
and to do all in my power
to encourage devotion to you.
Amen.
958 Communion with the dead. "In full consciousness of this communion of the whole Mystical Body of Jesus Christ, the Church in its pilgrim members, from the very earliest days of the Christian religion, has honored with great respect the memory of the dead; and 'because it is a holy and a wholesome thought to pray for the dead that they may be loosed from their sins' she offers her suffrages for them."500 Our prayer for them is capable not only of helping them, but also of making their intercession for us effective.
962 "We believe in the communion of all the faithful of Christ, those who are pilgrims on earth, the dead who are being purified, and the blessed in heaven, all together forming one Church; and we believe that in this communion, the merciful love of God and his saints is always [attentive] to our prayers" (Paul VI, CPG § 30).
Catechism of the Catholic Church - PART 1 SECTION 2 CHAPTER 3 ARTICLE 9 PARAGRAPH 5
Elijah was translated directly to heaven in 2 Kings 2
The book "The Assumption of Moses" (regarding the bodily assumption of Moses into heaven" is quoted in Jude 7.
I have worked in India and among Indians in my office in America -
In my experience neither what would be called "pagans" nor Christians claim to be making a "likeness of an idol" rather the idol is the "likeness of a being in heaven".
====================
In any case as I said before I only give this example to point out my claim that those who do such things should not be said to "Not have the Holy Spirit" in other words - not all that do that are lost. James 4:17
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The text does not lead the reader to conclude Moses and Elijah were not there. You would have to read that "into it" and in other cases where angels "appear" it is also called "vision" -- not because they are not actually there but because it is a view of someone or something from/in heaven.
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where are the instances of angels appearing and it’s called a vision?
I think if we have an overall full understanding of the scriptures, we can easily conclude that it was a vision and that Moses & Elijah were not there.
Moses is dead (Hebrews 11:13), and Elijah is dead as well. They saw a glorified Messiah, who had not been glorified at the time.
Usually visions are when the people are in a trance, or when the Spirit or Yahweh comes upon them and shows them a vision.
There are many things we can’t conclude just from reading isolated verse, such as Messiah teaching his followers to eat his flesh and drink his blood. If we didn’t have any understanding, we would think he is talking literally/physically and not spiritually.
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Luke 24
4 And it happened, as they were greatly perplexed about this, that behold, two men stood by them in shining garments. 5 Then, as they were afraid and bowed their faces to the earth, they said to them, “Why do you seek the living among the dead? 6 He is not here, but is risen! Remember how He spoke to you when He was still in Galilee, 7 saying, ‘The Son of Man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again.’ ”
8 And they remembered His words. 9 Then they returned from the tomb and told all these things to the eleven and to all the rest. 10 It was Mary Magdalene, Joanna, Mary the mother of James, and the other women with them, who told these things to the apostles.
And when they found not his body, they came, saying, that they had also seen a vision of angels, which said that he was alive. Luke 24:23
IN the Bible there are "visions in the night" and "Visions in my mind" --- which do not reflect actual events see on Earth
- but in other cases it is a vision of angels or an vision of some heavenly being where that angel or being is in fact present on Earth in real life.
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2 Kings 2 - Elijah went to heaven without dying.
Jude 7 - scripture quotes from the "Assumption of Moses" which is a description of the bodily ascension of Moses into heaven after he had died. He was raised and bodily assumed into heaven.
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yeshuaslavejeff
simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Don't have to conclude anything. JESUS CALLED IT A VISION in the next verse when He told them not to tell anyone about the VISION.
Again, most people have no understanding of things spiritual.
JESUS SAID in this case(body and blood) HIS WORDS ARE SPIRIT <<<see, SPIRIT
and that they are life.
Just like JESUS IS A DOOR. <<< 'spiritual' meaning OR wooden door ???
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Yes I must concede you are correct due to the grammar used the Transfiguration was indeed a vision. Thank you for sharing that information it helped me to learn something new today. Oh and Merry Christmas by the way. Because in Matthew 17:9 Jesus used the words “the vision” which could also be used as “the sight” it doesn’t seem to fit the grammar used in other scriptures pertaining to something that is actually seen and the Greek word hórama is most often used to represent a vision except in the case of Acts 7:31 pertaining to Moses’ sight of the burning bush which is undoubtedly not a vision but actually happened in reality since God conjured the snake that transformed into a rod that Moses carried and performed many miracles with. But the grammar in this passage is more conclusively to referring to sight than Matthew 17:9 is. Now if Jesus had said tell no one of the sight you have seen that would be a different story but that’s not the case. So I believe you are correct and thank you for helping me to see this. God bless
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And so did the disciples say that seeing an angel in real life - is also seeing "a vision of angels"
=================
Luke 24
4 And it happened, as they were greatly perplexed about this, that behold, two men stood by them in shining garments. 5 Then, as they were afraid and bowed their faces to the earth, they said to them, “Why do you seek the living among the dead? 6 He is not here, but is risen! Remember how He spoke to you when He was still in Galilee, 7 saying, ‘The Son of Man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again.’ ”
8 And they remembered His words. 9 Then they returned from the tomb and told all these things to the eleven and to all the rest. 10 It was Mary Magdalene, Joanna, Mary the mother of James, and the other women with them, who told these things to the apostles.
And when they found not his body, they came, saying, that they had also seen a vision of angels, which said that he was alive. Luke 24:23
IN the Bible there are "visions in the night" and "Visions in my mind" --- which do not reflect actual events taking place on Earth
- but in other cases it is a vision of angels or an vision of some heavenly being where that angel or being is in fact present on Earth in real life.
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In all fairness you really should’ve posted the entire prayer to Jude. What you posted does not contain the full context of what the person is asking of Jude.
Saint Jude, glorious apostle, faithful servant and friend of Jesus, the name of the traitor has caused you to be forgotten by many. But the Church honors and invokes you universally as the patron of difficult and desperate cases. Pray for me who am so miserable. Make use, I implore you, of that particular privilege accorded to you to bring visible and speedy help where help was almost despaired of. Come to my assistance in this great need that I may receive the consolation and help of heaven in all my necessities, tribulations and sufferings, particularly — (here make your request) — and that I may bless God with you and all the elect throughout all eternity.
I promise you, O blessed SAINT JUDE, to be ever mindful of this great favor, and I will never cease to honor you as my special and powerful patron and do all in my power to encourage devotion to you. Amen.
Saint Jude, pray for us and for all who honor you and invoke your aid.
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Hi brother BNR32FAN. Bob is correct here. Just google prayers to the Saints. There is a lot of them requesting help from saints or asking petition to the Saint (praying to the dead). This is forbidden in God's WORD and is called an abomination.
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