The Last Day

iamlamad

Lamad
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Dispensationalists are entitled to an opinion.
As is every kind of believer - even YOU. If you cannot see "dispensations" that is your trouble, no one else to blame. In fact, my guess is, YOU believe in dispensations. For example:

Did time exist BEFORE Moses brought the LAW to people? Of course, you know it did: from Adam to Moses. But it was time BEFORE the Law. What commandments did people have then to live by? Paul answers that for us:

Romans 5
13 For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

It was a time BEFORE the Law of God: it was a DISPENSATION. From Dictionary.com: "a divinely appointed order or age: the old Mosaic, or Jewish, dispensation; the new gospel, or Christian, dispensation."

Will you agree then, there was a time before the law, then after Moses there was a time OF Law, then there was a time when GOD dwelt with man, the time of Immanuel, and then a time after that when the CHURCH began and Christ ascended? If you don't believe in these things, you simply don't believe the bible!

But what you wrote is so far from what "faith" means to me.

One should never form their doctrine on 1) the parables alone and more importantly, 2) on obscure figurative language in Revelation.

WHO TOLD YOU this is "figurative?"

3 and he cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more till the thousand years were finished...
4 ... And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished.
6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.
7 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison

There is not one hint that this should not be taken literally. IF one does not take verses like these literally - that make perfect sense literally, but chooses to think they are figurative and must mean something else, they will surely end up with nonsense.

We look first and foremost at the clear and straightforward scriptures in order to have proper Biblical hermeneutics.

Exactly! these verses in Revelation are VERY straightforward.

Without the proper hermeneutic (system for Biblical interpretation) one has only an eisegesis ( a projection of their personal opinions) of any of the Text.
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Let's look at your post realistically too.

You opine that the "saints rule and reign in a millennium kingdom"

Not only is that "doctrinal" opinion only based on the obscurity in Rev20- but you don't even have proof that Rev.20 says what you claim!
What is written says, The saints lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

The testimony of Jesus in Rev.20 never says "they lived and reigned with Him a thousand years on earth.!!"

There's a reason the inspired scripture leaves out "on earth."

It's to prove our point, for one!

It's bc the phrase is figurative and prophetic.

Dispensationals are "adding" to the Text.

Do they indeed?

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. .. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Do you imagine there will be thrones in heaven, and PEOPLE in heaven that will need "judgment?"

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Do you imagine this is speaking of HEAVEN? What does Jesus mean, "in the regeneration?" It is when earth is RENEWED BY FIRE.

Luke 22:30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.


Do you imagine this is speaking of heaven? NO! This is His kingdom ON EARTH.

Matt. 25
31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy[c] angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory.
32 All the nations will be gathered before Him...

Do you imagine this is speaking of heaven? NO! This is earth! Earth is where the nations are found. He cannot "come" to heaven - that is where He IS. If it mentions a "coming," that is TO EARTH.

34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world

Do you imagine this kingdom will be back in heaven? CAn you find even ONE VERSE that tells us Jesus will go BACK TO HEAVEN after He comes in Rev. 19? It looks more like "heaven" comes down to earth, as in the New Jerusalem.

And by doing so, they create a thousand years that not many can believe when they actually read Rev.20.

WHY do you think "not many" can believe? Is it because of their UNBELIEF?

LAMAD
 
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iamlamad

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I agree with this first paragraph. Many people cannot imagine that salvation shall end some day.

I agree with your second statement, which implies that a time of Spiritual desolation shall occur before the final End.

However, I am not sure if you are saying the faithful elect shall have to endure through that Spiritual desolation or have they been Spirited away before it happens?

Read it again. The Holy Spirit will be gone back to heaven with the Bride before the 70th week.

LAMAD
 
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coraline

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As is every kind of believer - even YOU. If you cannot see "dispensations" that is your trouble, no one else to blame. In fact, my guess is, YOU believe in dispensations. For example:

Did time exist BEFORE Moses brought the LAW to people? Of course, you know it did: from Adam to Moses. But it was time BEFORE the Law. What commandments did people have then to live by? Paul answers that for us:

Romans 5
13 For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

It was a time BEFORE the Law of God: it was a DISPENSATION. From Dictionary.com: "a divinely appointed order or age: the old Mosaic, or Jewish, dispensation; the new gospel, or Christian, dispensation."

Will you agree then, there was a time before the law, then after Moses there was a time OF Law, then there was a time when GOD dwelt with man, the time of Immanuel, and then a time after that when the CHURCH began and Christ ascended? If you don't believe in these things, you simply don't believe the bible!



WHO TOLD YOU this is "figurative?"

3 and he cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal on him, so that he should deceive the nations no more till the thousand years were finished...
4 ... And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished.
6 Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.
7 Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison

There is not one hint that this should not be taken literally. IF one does not take verses like these literally - that make perfect sense literally, but chooses to think they are figurative and must mean something else, they will surely end up with nonsense.



Exactly! these verses in Revelation are VERY straightforward.



Do they indeed?

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them. .. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.

Do you imagine there will be thrones in heaven, and PEOPLE in heaven that will need "judgment?"

Matthew 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Do you imagine this is speaking of HEAVEN? What does Jesus mean, "in the regeneration?" It is when earth is RENEWED BY FIRE.

Luke 22:30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.


Do you imagine this is speaking of heaven? NO! This is His kingdom ON EARTH.

Matt. 25
31 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy[c] angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory.
32 All the nations will be gathered before Him...

Do you imagine this is speaking of heaven? NO! This is earth! Earth is where the nations are found. He cannot "come" to heaven - that is where He IS. If it mentions a "coming," that is TO EARTH.

34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world

Do you imagine this kingdom will be back in heaven? CAn you find even ONE VERSE that tells us Jesus will go BACK TO HEAVEN after He comes in Rev. 19? It looks more like "heaven" comes down to earth, as in the New Jerusalem.



WHY do you think "not many" can believe? Is it because of their UNBELIEF?

LAMAD

Your entitled to your opinion.

But I disagree.

Belief is not "faith" Anyone can believe anything they want to. They can read last day madness books and "believe" them all.

I don't care.

It's all doom and gloom.

You miss the joy.

I don't
 
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iamlamad

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No these verses are warning Christians and everyone else to be ready because once Christ comes it will have been too late for your salvation. You will cast out into the outer darkness where there will be gnashing of teeth.

WHICH coming are you referring to? Paul used the word "coming" in 1 Thes,4. That will be the NEXT coming. But there will be yet another coming as seen in Rev. 19. That will be His THIRD coming - if someone is counting.

You are partly right: once Jesus comes FOR His bride [1 thes. 4] it will be TOO LATE to be a part of the Bride of Christ. But it will not be too late to make heaven. If one refuses to take the mark of the Beast, and loses his or her head, they can make heaven by way of death, and be guests at the wedding.

When Jesus comes as shown in Rev. 19, that will probably be when the parable of the wheat and tares take place. It will SURELY be too late for those living in lawlessness. They will be gathering and thrown straight into hell - NO TIME to do anything else. Then there will be the judgement of the nations: all will stand before God as a sheep or a goat. The sheep will be allowed to enter God's kingdom on earth. The goats will be cast into the lake of fire.

LAMAD
 
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random person

1 COR. 10:11; HEB. 1:2; HEB. 9:26,28; 1 PET. 1:20
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WHICH coming are you referring to? Paul used the word "coming" in 1 Thes,4. That will be the NEXT coming. But there will be yet another coming as seen in Rev. 19. That will be His THIRD coming - if someone is counting.

You are partly right: once Jesus comes FOR His bride [1 thes. 4] it will be TOO LATE to be a part of the Bride of Christ. But it will not be too late to make heaven. If one refuses to take the mark of the Beast, and loses his or her head, they can make heaven by way of death, and be guests at the wedding.

When Jesus comes as shown in Rev. 19, that will probably be when the parable of the wheat and tares take place. It will SURELY be too late for those living in lawlessness. They will be gathering and thrown straight into hell - NO TIME to do anything else. Then there will be the judgement of the nations: all will stand before God as a sheep or a goat. The sheep will be allowed to enter God's kingdom on earth. The goats will be cast into the lake of fire.

LAMAD

The Beast was Nero Caesar!

After this was done he cast the blame on the Christians, saying that they had done it; for, when the Romans, very much agitated on account of the immeasurable damage and the dire calamities which had sprung from this conflagration, began to murmur greatly, he, in order to shield himself, and to wreak his prejudiced hatred upon the Christians, put the whole blame on them. Introduction to the Martyrs Mirror, p. 35, from Baron. Anno 66. num. 1.

For this reason there were proclaimed immediately, in the name of the Emperor, throughout the whole known world (then under the monarchy of the Romans), bloody decrees against the Christians, that they should everywhere be put to death. The contents of these decrees were as follows, "If any one confesses that he is a Christian, he shall be put to death, without further trial, as a convicted enemy of mankind." loh. Gysii Hist Mart. edit. 1657. fol. 6. col. 2

Tertullian afterwards upbraided the Roman Senate, saying, "Read your own histories, and you will find, that Nero was the first who raged against this sect (so he calls the Christians), which then flourished the most in Rome." AQol. Contra Gentes. cap. 5.

In another place he says, "Nero was the first who stained with blood the rising Christian faith at Rome."

Shortly after this decree of Nero, a violent and unmerciful persecution of the Christians manifested itself in all the countries which were under the Roman dominion; which persecution lasted until the Emperor's death. The innocent Christians were accused not only of the burning of Rome, but also of every wickedness imaginable; that they might be tortured and put to death in the most awful manner. To this the Roman Tacitus (according to the translation of J. Gysius, and not that of Fenacolius) * refers, saying, "Then, Nero, in order to avert this report from himself, caused those called Christians by the common people, to be accused and exceedingly tormented. The author of this name is Christ, who was publicly put to death under the reign of Tiberius, by Pontius Pilate, the governor. Those who confessed that they were Christians, were first apprehended, and afterwards by making it known themselves a great multitude were all condemned, not so much on account of the conflagration, as of the hatred in which they were held by mankind. The taking of their lives was accompanied with much mockery; they were covered with the skins of wild beasts, and then torn to pieces by dogs; or nailed on crosses; or placed at stakes and burned; serving also as torches for the spectators, when the day was over."

Thus Tacitus, a Roman himself, has sufficiently confessed, in spite of himself, as J. Gysius writes, that the Christians were innocent of the burning of Rome, but that they notwithstanding had to suffer on account of their name.

Who the great multitudes were, that perished in those awful persecutions, confessing the name of Christ even unto death, is not stated in the histories of the fathers; however, we shall content ourselves therewith, that God remembers them, and that their names are written in the Book of Life. Nevertheless, we meet with some, though but few, names of such who suffered in that persecution in the reign of Nero, and sealed the truth of Christ with their blood and death; of these we shall speak in the proper place.

http://www.homecomers.org/mirror/martyrs011.htm
 
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coraline said in post 169:

The testimony of Jesus in Rev.20 never says "they lived and reigned with Him a thousand years on earth.!!"

Jesus will physically reign on the earth during the 1,000 years, for the 1,000 years will begin after his 2nd coming (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6), when he will physically land on the earth and rule it from Jerusalem (Zechariah 14:4-21). And because Jesus will reign physically on the earth during the 1,000 years, so will the physically resurrected church, for the physically resurrected church will reign with Jesus during the 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6). And so in Revelation 5:10, the reference to the church reigning in the future "on the earth" includes the 1,000 years. Also, in Revelation 2:26-29, the reigning of the church physically over the nations can refer to the 1,000 years. There's no reason to exclude the 1,000 years from Revelation 5:10 or Revelation 2:26-29, just as there's no reason to exclude the earth from Revelation 20:4-6.

Also, the church will reign forever on the new earth. For the church will reign forever in New Jerusalem (Revelation 22:5, Revelation 21:10 to 22:5), which will descend from heaven to a new earth (Revelation 21:1-3, Revelation 21:10) sometime after the future millennium and subsequent events are over (Revelation 20:7 to 21:3).

coraline said in post 169:

It's bc the phrase is figurative and prophetic.

Revelation is almost entirely literal, for it's unsealed (Revelation 22:10), meaning it shouldn't be difficult for saved people of any time to understand it if they simply read it as it's written: chronologically and almost-entirely literally. The few parts of it that are symbolic are almost always explained afterward (e.g. Revelation 1:20, Revelation 17:9-12). And Revelation's few symbols not explained afterward (e.g. Revelation 13:2) are usually explained elsewhere in the Bible (e.g. Daniel 7:4-7,17).

Just as Jesus' 2nd coming in Revelation 19:7 to 20:3 will be fulfilled almost entirely literally, so the events of the preceding tribulation in Revelation chapters 6 to 18 will be fulfilled almost entirely literally. Also, the millennium in Revelation 20 will be literal, and will begin after Jesus' 2nd coming (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, Zechariah 14:3-21), when he will reign on the earth with the bodily resurrected church for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29, Psalms 66:3-4, Psalms 72:8-11). After that, the events of Revelation 20:7 to 22:5 will occur literally.
 
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iamlamad said in post 177:

The rapture will take place, the BRIDE of Christ will rise up, and the Holy Spirit who has filled the Bride will rise with her - the restrainer being "taken out of the way."

The restrainer of the Antichrist (2 Thessalonians 2:6-8) could be a powerful, good angel, like the one who will restrain Satan at Jesus' 2nd coming (Revelation 20:1-3). The restrainer can't be the Holy Spirit, because in the future the restrainer will be removed (2 Thessalonians 2:7b), whereas the Holy Spirit can never be removed because he is always omnipresent (Psalms 139:7-10). Similarly, the restrainer can't be the church, or the Holy Spirit in the church, because the church won't be removed (John 17:15,20, Proverbs 10:30), and there are now no believers outside of the church (Ephesians 4:4-5), and now no one can be a believer without the Spirit (Romans 8:9); and the Antichrist will be allowed to physically overcome believers in every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13), just as, for example, the Roman emperors and Satan were allowed to physically overcome believers in the first century AD (e.g. Revelation 2:10).

*******

iamlamad said in post 181:

There is not one hint that this should not be taken literally. IF one does not take verses like these literally - that make perfect sense literally, but chooses to think they are figurative and must mean something else, they will surely end up with nonsense.

Good point.

Amillennialism mistakenly claims that the "thousand" in Revelation 20:4-6 can't be literal, but must be only symbolic of fullness/completion, like in Psalms 50:10. But in the Bible, "thousand" can be literal (e.g. Numbers 31:4-6, Numbers 35:4, Judges 20:10; 2 Kings 15:19; 1 Chronicles 19:6, Song of Songs 8:11, Revelation 20:2-7).

Amillennialism ends up (inadvertently) logically requiring the error of full preterism (2 Timothy 2:18). For claiming that the church's resurrection in Revelation 20:4-6 is already present requires that Jesus' 2nd coming has already happened. For the church's resurrection in Revelation 20:4-6 won't happen until the 2nd coming (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6; 1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-54; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16). Also, amillennialism ends up (inadvertently) logically requiring the error of partial preterism. For claiming that the resurrection of those beheaded by the Antichrist during the future tribulation and their subsequent reigning on the earth with the returned Jesus for the full 1,000 years of the millennium (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29) is already present, requires that the Antichrist's literal, 3.5-year worldwide reign during the tribulation (Revelation 13:4-18) has already happened. Also, amillennialism is mistaken because it requires that the devil is currently bound in the bottomless pit (Revelation 20:1-6), when in fact he is currently walking around on the earth seeking whom he may devour (1 Peter 5:8), and won't be bound until the 2nd coming (Revelation 19:19 to 20:3).
 
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random person said in post 186:

The Beast was Nero Caesar!

Any mistaken teaching which claims that the Antichrist has already come and gone could be employed in the future by the real Antichrist to fool some Christians into thinking that he isn't the Antichrist.

Nero didn't fulfill the detailed references to the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) in Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 16:2-16, Revelation 19:19-21, and Revelation 20:4. Also, Nero didn't fulfill other prophecies regarding the Antichrist (e.g. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-9, Daniel 11:31,36; cf. Matthew 24:15). And John the apostle didn't see the vision of Revelation until decades after the time of Nero. For Irenaeus (born c. 140 AD) said: "We will not, however, incur the risk of pronouncing positively as to the name of Antichrist; for if it were necessary that his name should be distinctly revealed in this present time, it would have been announced by him [John] who beheld the apocalyptic vision [Revelation]. For that was seen no very long time since, but almost in our day, towards the end of Domitian's reign" (Against Heresies 5:30:3c). The end of Domitian's reign was 96 AD. Nero's reign was 54-68 AD. The detailed prophecies regarding the Antichrist, just as the rest of the tribulation prophecies of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, have never been fulfilled.

--

Regarding the claim (made by some) that Nero's name in Hebrew added up to 666 (Revelation 13:17c-18), is there an ancient historical source which shows how "Nero Caesar" was usually transliterated into Hebrew at the time that Revelation was written, so we can confirm whether or not the usual Hebrew transliteration of "Nero Caesar" added up to 666 in Hebrew gematria, instead of an intentionally-altered Hebrew spelling? For example, why was an "n" added after "Nero", to make "Neron"; and why was the "ae" of "Caesar" skipped to make "Csar", when, for example, the "ae" in "Israel" gets at least an "aleph" in Hebrew? Could "Neron Csar" in fact be an intentionally-altered, never-actually-used spelling that adds up to 666, just as people today could intentionally mistransliterate into Hebrew the name of someone living today so that the mistransliterated name adds up to 666 in Hebrew gematria? Also, just by chance there could be more than one person in the world whose name adds up to 666. So even if it could be proven that the usual Hebrew spelling of "Nero Caesar" added up to 666, or that the usual spelling of the name of someone living today adds up to 666, this doesn't require that that person is the Antichrist.

Also, should we even assume that the Antichrist's name has to be transliterated into Hebrew for it to add up to 666? For Revelation was originally addressed to Greek-speaking Gentile churches in the Roman province of "Asia" (Revelation 1:11) (what is now western Turkey), not to Hebrew-speaking Jewish churches in Judaea. And John the apostle used 3 letters from the Greek alphabet to express the number 666 in Revelation 13:18 (in the original Greek Textus Receptus), not any letters from the Hebrew alphabet. (But this doesn't require that the Antichrist's name has to be transliterated into Greek in order for it to add up to 666, for John used the Greek alphabet only because it was the most common one used by the believers he was addressing at the time that Revelation was written.) Also, even when "Nero Caesar" (instead of "Neron Csar") is transliterated into Hebrew, it doesn't have to result in the name adding up to 666:

N - Nun = 50 (cf. the "Ne" in "Nebo" in the Hebrew of Num. 32:3: Nun for the "N" and nothing for the "e")
E /
R - Reysh = 200
O - Vav = 6 (cf. the "o" in "Nebo" in the Hebrew of Num. 32:3 being the letter Vav)

C - Qowph = 100 (cf. "Kareah" in the Hebrew of Jer. 40:8, & "Caesar" being "Kaisar" in the Greek of Mt. 22:17)
A - Aleph = 1 (cf. the "ae" in "Israel" in the Hebrew of Gen. 32:28: Aleph for the "a" and nothing for the "e")
E /
S - Samek = 60 (cf. the "sar" in "Ellasar" in the Hebrew of Gen. 14:1: Samek for the "s" & nothing for the "a")
A /
R - Reysh = 200

Total = 617
 
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iamlamad

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Any good news for the lost yet?

Well, sleep on it.

CERTAINLY! The door to salvation has not closed yet! God is still standing with His arms open wide, COMPELLING people to come in quickly, before the door to salvation and the born again experience is closed forever.

LAMAD
 
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iamlamad

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Your entitled to your opinion.

But I disagree.

Belief is not "faith" Anyone can believe anything they want to. They can read last day madness books and "believe" them all.

I don't care.

It's all doom and gloom.

You miss the joy.

I don't

You are mistaken: I am FULL of Joy! I laugh in the Spirit often. I know whom I have believed; I know He is able to deliver me from the wrath to come. But I also know the time is very short, and God is warning people of the late hour. The door to salvation is beginning to move....soon it will close forever, and the "church age" will be OVER.

Your ignoring of "the last days" will not change God's mind even a tiny bit! All I can do is warn you that many will be LEFT BEHIND to face the hardest time this earth has ever seen, or will ever see. God's will is that you follow Luke 21:36.

LAMAD
 
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WHICH coming are you referring to? Paul used the word "coming" in 1 Thes,4. That will be the NEXT coming. But there will be yet another coming as seen in Rev. 19. That will be His THIRD coming - if someone is counting.

You are partly right: once Jesus comes FOR His bride [1 thes. 4] it will be TOO LATE to be a part of the Bride of Christ. But it will not be too late to make heaven. If one refuses to take the mark of the Beast, and loses his or her head, they can make heaven by way of death, and be guests at the wedding.

When Jesus comes as shown in Rev. 19, that will probably be when the parable of the wheat and tares take place. It will SURELY be too late for those living in lawlessness. They will be gathering and thrown straight into hell - NO TIME to do anything else. Then there will be the judgement of the nations: all will stand before God as a sheep or a goat. The sheep will be allowed to enter God's kingdom on earth. The goats will be cast into the lake of fire.

LAMAD

Dear LAMAD, regardless of the debate in this thread, and regardless of other POV's, I'll say that I find your posts more accurate than most, and only because you seem to have a better picture of the future end, or Ending.

My post is to do something that nobody has tried yet, and I'll explain how this works: I use the given tools that we have in this world already, and nothing is new except for how they are used. In the same sense as a primitive man would have no idea how to use a Tablet, cell phone, or anything of our age, and in the same sense this is true for the visa in evolution of spirit. Another topic is about the evolution of flesh but there also is evolution of spirit so this is also in the works whether one sees it or not.

The present-day world wouldn't know how the primitive man lived or how he made use of the natural things that our current mind has made crutches for. Besides the natural evolution process of ever-changing man in technology there are also changes in the spirit, and another effect of the process is how each works with one another; what goes around comes around.

This same phenomenon is parallel to the 'Egg vs Chicken-which came first?' theorem debate that crosses over to question two realms, as to seek another witness in contrast, and even seen within the seed of the egg's 'image'; the 'yoke' be the male and the white be the female, et al, and in other parallel's.

This may be summed up in another parallel that involves mathematics and the Quantum-X theorem. In this case of the unseen things that I nor you may touch we may only then, use other methods to see, and first things first, we must be 'UP-right' in mind so to see, and use what Yahweh first gave us, which is Spirit by our mind in flesh.

This can be seen in the image of the 'X' where it may be inverted, turned backward or rotated in either direction, one click at a time. Each time a change is made it changes each of the other points in the 'X'. The 'X' is the imagery of the 'Four corners' in prophecy, which is an illusion of thought, and it either aligns with the 'X' in the Mind of our Master Seed or not, and all of them who are written in the Book of Life have a special identity in their spirit that has an original part in the Original Blueprint of Eternal Life.

It has to do with polarity, as well, and just the same as the N and S in a magnet. To change the law of Yahweh is to pull two magnets apart and hold them together against their natural power. This is a simple form of using the primitive tools that modern man has forgotten how to use, in both science and religion. This is the 'Old school' way that modern man cannot understand if he not strip himself down of his hindrance's and come to Christ as babes. Christ had a reason for saying this.

Back to the 'X', now, imagine 4 lines in a paragraph where each line is one above the other, and in each line of text is an 'X' that must align vertically with the others, regardless where the line/sentence begins or ends.

All Four of the 'X' when aligned are as overlaying 4 'X''s one over the other. Each 'X' is assigned properties, and permissions, and all of the Law of Yahweh in ORDER. Each must remain in there residence so that all of the heaven works in a spiritual geometry designed by Yahweh in the Beginning when the Mind of the Father Created Himself in Glorified Flesh.

This Created the Image of the Father in a Seed of flesh that must keep the same spirit in alignment as keeping all four 'X' aligned in mind. Any change will change how G-d is perceived, as well. In relation to the whole 'X' the mind then thinks to see all other of the three corners in sequence while not seeing the whole 'X' change position, and violations change the position.

The 'backward' flip, and the 'upside down' flip, and the 'Four corners', etc., are spoken of in both OT & NT, so here we apply those images in another parallel of the process. The prophecies describe changes in the 'X', and when certain men discovered this same process in their given visions albeit not all men saw it alike, nor fully understood it. Men have struggled with this knowledge because of hindrances that come as a flood of confusion, and the 'X' spins like a propeller.

The mind then creates things that are seen in their heaven, which is their mind and spirit, and their works are manifested in like parallel where the spiritual things are made natural. This describes how man creates from his thoughts, and if we change our thoughts we change our world and all that we do in it and to it. The Upright mind cares for the Father and Mother from which it came, from dust and breath of both in Holy matrimony according to YHWH.

We are to keep these things which are in heaven, but not according to our own heaven that we each create by another liberated law of the flipped mind. Each flipped mind opposes YHWH, and are alike as in the man on day-6 in spirit and before the Covenant was made. The mark of the beast is another area of imagery which is another deep topic of an outside process of the mind, and that is used for calculations done in the Upright mind. The flipped mind cannot properly count, as they count backwards, which lifts them OFF and into space, which is the opposite of mind in Christ and manifested in the works of the flesh to achieve a higher knowledge.

Space research is as building another tower of Babel in our mind's and it does cause the human race to adapt a dialectic mind that opposes YHWH therefore, communication is interrupted, and we are as 'dogs' barking UP (backwards) the Tree of Life, and neither can understand one another. G-d cannot hear the prayers of fallen man, it's as G-d listening to the wolves lament.

All I suggest is to look at your timing in your 'X' and see if it's aligned where the 4 is 4, and the 7 is 7 on the Cross. If not, the 7 becomes a 4 with a 1, which is the mindset of female portion of the Seed/Yoke, as in using the left hand when the right is wounded in a gunfight. The wounded cowboy is defenseless without his works made with that same wounded hand.

The mind is what must be first in ORDER so that all things make sense. If the man raises up by flipping his 'X' he may then move coordinates within the 'X' and it will be the same as taking up his Cross, and the horizontal beam is then back in step with the Law/Christ and the 4 is then 4, and the 7 is then 7, and the Covenant and G-d's Identity are then renowned in each of them who have the Law written in them.

The choice is of two laws, which both came from one, the law of the adversary which is a flipped law or the Law in the Original form and ORDER in which it will 'restore' when the Gentile mind is flipped upright. It will be as an ocean of 'Flipper' the dolphin. And the name implies much to do with what this process is about. What man creates in mind is manifest in works which gives instruction to others just as in a colony of ants; man has become like a colony of ants that invaded the earth, and I've seen a lot of that same attribute in man's creation of movie making.

All of man's works are evident in his fruits, and it being either manifested in nature or or in spirit. The things that we store up then go into the broken down storehouse where the front door is blocked, so they go around to the backdoor for access to a cluttered house/temple.

Some have lost their storehouse in the hurricane of the four winds completely while some will have moved closer to a new one that Yahweh prepared for them already so that they have a place to dwell among Him. The 'X' will be heated like a branding Iron, and will be seared in the mind forever, and it is for us to notice which way the 'X' is branded in our mind, it be done upright by Yahweh or upside down by the cattle rustler.

The cattle and the horses will be rounded up and brought home for the winter. Yahweh then gathers His cowboys, and even hires some to work in the round-up. G-d has His Hero's too, and they are all Cowboys!

Christ will say to some of the men who apply for the job, "Git along 'lil' doggy, git along".

Thanks, again. Just speaking my mind. :)
 
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coraline

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You are mistaken: I am FULL of Joy! I laugh in the Spirit often. I know whom I have believed; I know He is able to deliver me from the wrath to come. But I also know the time is very short, and God is warning people of the late hour. The door to salvation is beginning to move....soon it will close forever, and the "church age" will be OVER.

Your ignoring of "the last days" will not change God's mind even a tiny bit! All I can do is warn you that many will be LEFT BEHIND to face the hardest time this earth has ever seen, or will ever see. God's will is that you follow Luke 21:36.

LAMAD

You say you are full of joy. Well, praise God for you!
Why don't you try to spread that potential joy to those who are not in Christ?
Those actions would be noble.

Preaching to the choir and/or arguing with them about doom and gloom is just negative, any way you slice it.

I see no power in negative thinking.
 
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coraline

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CERTAINLY! The door to salvation has not closed yet! God is still standing with His arms open wide, COMPELLING people to come in quickly, before the door to salvation and the born again experience is closed forever.

LAMAD

Well, I believe differently.

Salvation is powerful in this life too. It seems you disregard the Lord's salvation NOW and just refer to "salvation" of one's soul in heaven.

When one strives to make life better for everyone, through their actions (and words too) then that is when one reaps what they sow- in this life now, imho!
 
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iamlamad

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Dear LAMAD, regardless of the debate in this thread, and regardless of other POV's, I'll say that I find your posts more accurate than most, and only because you seem to have a better picture of the future end, or Ending.

My post is to do something that nobody has tried yet, and I'll explain how this works: I use the given tools that we have in this world already, and nothing is new except for how they are used. In the same sense as a primitive man would have no idea how to use a Tablet, cell phone, or anything of our age, and in the same sense this is true for the visa in evolution of spirit. Another topic is about the evolution of flesh but there also is evolution of spirit so this is also in the works whether one sees it or not.

The present-day world wouldn't know how the primitive man lived or how he made use of the natural things that our current mind has made crutches for. Besides the natural evolution process of ever-changing man in technology there are also changes in the spirit, and another effect of the process is how each works with one another; what goes around comes around.

This same phenomenon is parallel to the 'Egg vs Chicken-which came first?' theorem debate that crosses over to question two realms, as to seek another witness in contrast, and even seen within the seed of the egg's 'image'; the 'yoke' be the male and the white be the female, et al, and in other parallel's.

This may be summed up in another parallel that involves mathematics and the Quantum-X theorem. In this case of the unseen things that I nor you may touch we may only then, use other methods to see, and first things first, we must be 'UP-right' in mind so to see, and use what Yahweh first gave us, which is Spirit by our mind in flesh.

This can be seen in the image of the 'X' where it may be inverted, turned backward or rotated in either direction, one click at a time. Each time a change is made it changes each of the other points in the 'X'. The 'X' is the imagery of the 'Four corners' in prophecy, which is an illusion of thought, and it either aligns with the 'X' in the Mind of our Master Seed or not, and all of them who are written in the Book of Life have a special identity in their spirit that has an original part in the Original Blueprint of Eternal Life.

It has to do with polarity, as well, and just the same as the N and S in a magnet. To change the law of Yahweh is to pull two magnets apart and hold them together against their natural power. This is a simple form of using the primitive tools that modern man has forgotten how to use, in both science and religion. This is the 'Old school' way that modern man cannot understand if he not strip himself down of his hindrance's and come to Christ as babes. Christ had a reason for saying this.

Back to the 'X', now, imagine 4 lines in a paragraph where each line is one above the other, and in each line of text is an 'X' that must align vertically with the others, regardless where the line/sentence begins or ends.

All Four of the 'X' when aligned are as overlaying 4 'X''s one over the other. Each 'X' is assigned properties, and permissions, and all of the Law of Yahweh in ORDER. Each must remain in there residence so that all of the heaven works in a spiritual geometry designed by Yahweh in the Beginning when the Mind of the Father Created Himself in Glorified Flesh.

This Created the Image of the Father in a Seed of flesh that must keep the same spirit in alignment as keeping all four 'X' aligned in mind. Any change will change how G-d is perceived, as well. In relation to the whole 'X' the mind then thinks to see all other of the three corners in sequence while not seeing the whole 'X' change position, and violations change the position.

The 'backward' flip, and the 'upside down' flip, and the 'Four corners', etc., are spoken of in both OT & NT, so here we apply those images in another parallel of the process. The prophecies describe changes in the 'X', and when certain men discovered this same process in their given visions albeit not all men saw it alike, nor fully understood it. Men have struggled with this knowledge because of hindrances that come as a flood of confusion, and the 'X' spins like a propeller.

The mind then creates things that are seen in their heaven, which is their mind and spirit, and their works are manifested in like parallel where the spiritual things are made natural. This describes how man creates from his thoughts, and if we change our thoughts we change our world and all that we do in it and to it. The Upright mind cares for the Father and Mother from which it came, from dust and breath of both in Holy matrimony according to YHWH.

We are to keep these things which are in heaven, but not according to our own heaven that we each create by another liberated law of the flipped mind. Each flipped mind opposes YHWH, and are alike as in the man on day-6 in spirit and before the Covenant was made. The mark of the beast is another area of imagery which is another deep topic of an outside process of the mind, and that is used for calculations done in the Upright mind. The flipped mind cannot properly count, as they count backwards, which lifts them OFF and into space, which is the opposite of mind in Christ and manifested in the works of the flesh to achieve a higher knowledge.

Space research is as building another tower of Babel in our mind's and it does cause the human race to adapt a dialectic mind that opposes YHWH therefore, communication is interrupted, and we are as 'dogs' barking UP (backwards) the Tree of Life, and neither can understand one another. G-d cannot hear the prayers of fallen man, it's as G-d listening to the wolves lament.

All I suggest is to look at your timing in your 'X' and see if it's aligned where the 4 is 4, and the 7 is 7 on the Cross. If not, the 7 becomes a 4 with a 1, which is the mindset of female portion of the Seed/Yoke, as in using the left hand when the right is wounded in a gunfight. The wounded cowboy is defenseless without his works made with that same wounded hand.

The mind is what must be first in ORDER so that all things make sense. If the man raises up by flipping his 'X' he may then move coordinates within the 'X' and it will be the same as taking up his Cross, and the horizontal beam is then back in step with the Law/Christ and the 4 is then 4, and the 7 is then 7, and the Covenant and G-d's Identity are then renowned in each of them who have the Law written in them.

The choice is of two laws, which both came from one, the law of the adversary which is a flipped law or the Law in the Original form and ORDER in which it will 'restore' when the Gentile mind is flipped upright. It will be as an ocean of 'Flipper' the dolphin. And the name implies much to do with what this process is about. What man creates in mind is manifest in works which gives instruction to others just as in a colony of ants; man has become like a colony of ants that invaded the earth, and I've seen a lot of that same attribute in man's creation of movie making.

All of man's works are evident in his fruits, and it being either manifested in nature or or in spirit. The things that we store up then go into the broken down storehouse where the front door is blocked, so they go around to the backdoor for access to a cluttered house/temple.

Some have lost their storehouse in the hurricane of the four winds completely while some will have moved closer to a new one that Yahweh prepared for them already so that they have a place to dwell among Him. The 'X' will be heated like a branding Iron, and will be seared in the mind forever, and it is for us to notice which way the 'X' is branded in our mind, it be done upright by Yahweh or upside down by the cattle rustler.

The cattle and the horses will be rounded up and brought home for the winter. Yahweh then gathers His cowboys, and even hires some to work in the round-up. G-d has His Hero's too, and they are all Cowboys!

Christ will say to some of the men who apply for the job, "Git along 'lil' doggy, git along".

Thanks, again. Just speaking my mind. :)

Thanks.....I think!


LAMAD
 
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iamlamad

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Well, I believe differently.

Salvation is powerful in this life too. It seems you disregard the Lord's salvation NOW and just refer to "salvation" of one's soul in heaven.

When one strives to make life better for everyone, through their actions (and words too) then that is when one reaps what they sow- in this life now, imho!


Originally Posted by iamlamad
CERTAINLY! The door to salvation has not closed yet! God is still standing with His arms open wide, COMPELLING people to come in quickly, before the door to salvation and the born again experience is closed forever.

LAMAD

"I believe differently."

Does this mean you DISAGREE that the door to salvation as mankind has seen it for the last almost 2000 years is CLOSING? Do you disagree that God is inviting people to come in quickly? Do you disagree the day will come when the doorway to the born again experience will be CLOSED forever?

OF COURSE Salvation is NOW also. God is delighted when we are happy on our path of cooperating with the Holy Spirit and what He wants to do in and through us in this life. I certainly agree with you on this.

I also strongly agree that all men reap what they sow. I believe this so strongly I am always on the lookout for places to sow.

However, all that being said, I know that we are very close to the end of this age. I know that the doorway to salvation through becoming born again will soon be impossible, for that door will shut. Therefore, I strive to find people ready to become a believer. I use the internet, and I talk to all whom I meet.

LAMAD
 
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coraline

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Originally Posted by iamlamad
CERTAINLY! The door to salvation has not closed yet! God is still standing with His arms open wide, COMPELLING people to come in quickly, before the door to salvation and the born again experience is closed forever.

LAMAD
"I believe differently."

Does this mean you DISAGREE that the door to salvation as mankind has seen it for the last almost 2000 years is CLOSING? Do you disagree that God is inviting people to come in quickly? Do you disagree the day will come when the doorway to the born again experience will be CLOSED forever?

OF COURSE Salvation is NOW also. God is delighted when we are happy on our path of cooperating with the Holy Spirit and what He wants to do in and through us in this life. I certainly agree with you on this.

I also strongly agree that all men reap what they sow. I believe this so strongly I am always on the lookout for places to sow.

However, all that being said, I know that we are very close to the end of this age. I know that the doorway to salvation through becoming born again will soon be impossible, for that door will shut. Therefore, I strive to find people ready to become a believer. I use the internet, and I talk to all whom I meet.

LAMAD

Well, the "church age" has no end. See my thread "world without end, amen for the exegesis on the "church age,"

And my question to you is : has Jesus said He would come "quickly" for 2,000 years?

See, that is one of the reasons I disagree with your thinking.

That sounds too confusing for God to say. And we know that God doesn't create confusion.
 
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Scriptural connections with respect to the Last Day;

1. The resurrection of the dead

2. The coming of Christ with thousands upon thousands of His saints

3. The destruction of the man of sin by the brightness of His (Christ's) coming

From what I can see in the scriptures, all of these things (and I'm sure there are more), are connected with the Last Day, the Day of the Lord.
 
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coraline

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Scriptural connections with respect to the Last Day;

1. The resurrection of the dead

2. The coming of Christ with thousands upon thousands of His saints

3. The destruction of the man of sin by the brightness of His (Christ's) coming

From what I can see in the scriptures, all of these things (and I'm sure there are more), are connected with the Last Day, the Day of the Lord.

I see that too.
But we disagree of when that would happen & what Jesus meant by the "last day."
 
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