The Conjunction of Opposites

[BelieveItOarKnot]

Then good and evil are just arbitrary constructs. Both equally of God and of his will.

Everything that is serves Him

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

Do you believe there was no reason for God to sacrifice his only son?

Did I ever say that?

We know His death put the proverbial nail in the judgement coffin for the devil and his messengers.

 

[DamianWarS]

Everything that is serves Him

Arbitrary in the sense there is no qualitative difference. Both would be equally obedient to his command and in this sense things like morality and justice operate as superficial illusions.

 

[Jipsah]

Should be?

Of course not.

But in fact there is.

Rubbish.

 

[Jipsah]

Serious question:

Have you ever joined forces with others across the country and mentally concentrated on approaching tornadoes to dissipate them?

I'll bet sometimes it works.

 

[Jipsah]

Are you into Kundalini?

Does that involve Primal Screeching and/or Transcontinental Meditation?

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

Arbitrary in the sense there is no qualitative difference. Both would be equally obedient to his command and in this sense things like morality and justice operate as superficial illusions.

IF you think about it there is God, beyond capture by any definitions creation can manage to muster up,
and then
there is creation, in part or in sum, vastly less than The Creator

Everything breaks down from there, but the essential lesson is that everything in creation serves the Perfect Purposes of The CREATOR

And therein is a good anchor for our soul, in simple trust. Difficult as it is from time to time

 

[Aseyesee]

Did I ever say that?

We know His death put the proverbial nail in the judgement coffin for the devil and his messengers.

It was a logical question sourced out of what you said, not an accusation ...

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

It was a logical question sourced out of what you said, not an accusation ...

If you knew how many people resort to the "why did Jesus die then" if everyone is saved retort

There's a mistaken notion that Jesus was the human equivalent of a sacrificed animal.

The reality is, devils in mankind killed him. No ritual priests, that's for sure

The same devils who occupied those people who reviled and killed Him will still be here when He's revealed, Rev. 1:7

The people "knew not" what they did. Devils on the other hand knew exactly what they were doing

But even in all that, it remained a precise Act of God, regardless. Acts 4:25-29

God called all the shots from the beginning, Gen. 3:15, the goal always being to extract One Nation from the midst of another (unseen) nation (Matt. 23:33), shadowed here: Deut. 4:34, and replayed by Paul in the spiritual, ongoing and future tense application in 1 Cor. 15:42-46

We are essentially being "grown" in the dirt, with fertilizer, like crops. Guess who the fertilizer is? Devils. 2 Kings 19:30, Isa. 37:31, Luke 13:7-9

Luke 11:20
But if I with the finger of God cast out devils, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you.

Devils whisper from the dust...oh crap

 

[Aseyesee]

If you knew how many people resort to the "why did Jesus die then" if everyone is saved retort

There's a mistaken notion that Jesus was the human equivalent of a sacrificed animal.

The reality is, devils in mankind killed him. No ritual priests, that's for sure

The same devils who occupied those people who reviled and killed Him will still be here when He's revealed, Rev. 1:7

The people "knew not" what they did. Devils on the other hand knew exactly what they were doing

But even in all that, it remained a precise Act of God, regardless. Acts 4:25-29

God called all the shots from the beginning, Gen. 3:15, the goal always being to extract One Nation from the midst of another (unseen) nation (Matt. 23:33), shadowed here: Deut. 4:34, and replayed by Paul in the spiritual, ongoing and future tense application in 1 Cor. 15:42-46

We are essentially being "grown" in the dirt, with fertilizer, like crops. Guess who the fertilizer is? Devils. 2 Kings 19:30, Isa. 37:31, Luke 13:7-9

Luke 11:20
But if I with the finger of God cast out devils, no doubt the kingdom of God is come upon you.

Devils whisper from the dust...oh crap

How do you characterize hearing an accusation in my question? Would this be to you a listening to devils?

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

How do you characterize hearing an accusation in my question? Would this be to you a listening to devils?

Heaven forbid you have sin and sin is of the devil

Can't have that now can we?

 

[Aseyesee]

Heaven forbid you have sin and sin is of the devil

Can't have that now can we?

... and whoever sins is of the devil ...

I was just wondering which of you was replying to me

All kidding aside ... I was just looking for a yes or no ... has to be one or the other ... and this is not meant as a snare for you ... there will be no follow up to this from me, or from the devil in me.

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

I was just wondering which of you was replying to me

Only one way to tell. Do you know?

 

[Aseyesee]

Only one way to tell. Do you know?

Holy Spirit ... can't trust in myself ...

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

Holy Spirit ... can't trust in myself ...

I might suggest it's those who don't condemn their neighbors either outright or potentially, to burn alive forever,

simple method

 

[Aseyesee]

I might suggest it's those who don't condemn their neighbors either outright or potentially, to burn alive forever,

simple method

If I had one, mine would be ... if it doesn't cause you to love God and your brother more it's not of God ... but laws have consequences even if you have a Flip Wilson thing going on in your head...

 

[DamianWarS]

Everything breaks down from there, but the essential lesson is that everything in creation serves the Perfect Purposes of The CREATOR

Can you go deeper than this? (Critically speaking) If everything in creation serves the perfect purposes of the creator then how can anything be in conflict with or against God's will? If the answer is nothing is and everything is in harmony with God how can dicotomies of good and evil exist when both are qualitatively the same? How do we make sense of the biblical call of the gospel to be a superior path to one that would irreconcilablly blaspheme this call? Or are you suggesting a pluralistic view?

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

Can you go deeper than this? (Critically speaking) If everything in creation serves the perfect purposes of the creator then how can anything be in conflict with or against God's will?

God clearly uses bad things and is great enough to have good things come about because of the bad things. There's basically two different paths that believers take on "theodicy" i.e. the problem of the existence of evil in light of a Perfect God.

The path most take is to isolate God and provide excuses for God by blaming evil as a void of good or evil creating itself or freewill or whatever. However the minute such proponents concede that God remains active in His Own creation such claims fall apart. God just looks the other way and is thereby implicated by what's called omission. Watching a crime transpire and not stepping in to stop it.

The other less taken sight is that God is so vastly Superior to anything in creation He can make all such things as if they never even happened.

Romans 11:32 is a prime example,

Romans 11:32
For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

Here we see God using disobedience to hammer home the fact of His Prevailing Mercy, which is needed for creation of anything to even exist.

Some say God is soooo good He can't stand to be around any sin. But if this is true, everything in creation is less than God and God shouldn't be able to tolerate anything less than His Own Perfect Self, which again doesn't cut it.

IF God can stand evil in creation, then He can not only tolerate it, but can USE anything in creation for His Sole Perfect Purposes, which only He can comprehend in its fullness.

If the answer is nothing is and everything is in harmony with God how can dicotomies of good and evil exist when both are qualitatively the same?

We can slice and dice anything in creation and pieces of it or the entirety of it can never be compared to God anyway.

We're engaging 2 basic sights here that are vastly different.

The Creator
and
the creation

How do we make sense of the biblical call of the gospel to be a superior path to one that would irreconcilablly blaspheme this call? Or are you suggesting a pluralistic view?

You make a simple mistake when seeing only people in the equations.

The scriptures account for 2 parties. People and devils. They currently walk in the same pair of shoes, people and the tempter or his own. Who in this equation would be the "blasphemer?" Who in the equations would be the "denier?"

We know sins are not counted against people, 2 Cor. 5:19

WHO remains in the equations to count sins against? 1 John 3:8, Mark 4:15

We should be able to "account" for both parties in every scripture, at least regarding this present age

 

[BelieveItOarKnot]

a Flip Wilson thing going on in your head

That may be what your mind heard, the devil made me do it (Flip Wilson version)

Scripture says: The devil did it

Critical difference in hearing

 

[Aseyesee]

That may be what your mind heard, the devil made me do it (Flip Wilson version)

Scripture says: The devil did it

Critical difference in hearing

Same outcome for the one on the recieving end of it (like my sons mother-n-law, whose friend was stabbed to death by her special needs teenager. Without the individual, Satan is powerless to affect anything ...