Does man have a freewill ?

[Brightfame52]

Before regeneration, which I believe is how men are set free by Christ,, we are slaves to sin. Paul indicates that here Rom 6:20

20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

The words Ye were both times are in the imperfect tense, it was a continuous repeated state, you couldn't do any righteousness while in that state.

So a person wouldn't be able to stop being a slave to sin, and start doing righteous, like turning by his or her own freewill and repent towards God and put Faith in Jesus Christ. If you can do that, congratulations, you set your own self free and started doing righteous. 2

 

[Brightfame52]

"When tempted, no one should say, “God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone: but each person is tempted when they are dragged away by their own evil desire and enticed." James 1:13

One has to read the whole bible, and with understanding. God's church has understood that He foreknew that many would prefer darkness over light and determined to use their wicked choices to bring about an even greater good than the evil they desired. A God who would cause the evil itself, then blame the evil-doers for the evil they do, and then send them to eternal torment for the evil He caused them to do would be a very creepy god, indeed, much creepier than satan, in fact.

You evaded and rabbit trailed away from my point with scripture.

 

[Brightfame52]

In your mind it's truth.

Your right it is truth in my mind, thats why Im posting it

 

[Brightfame52]

"Will" = "free will", unless you have some different dictionary?

The will of man isnt free, its a slave to sin, and its not free from Gods control, I dont need a dictionary to know that

 

[Brightfame52]

Whatever. That's like someone training a dog to maul people, and then punishing the dog eternally for mauling people. You might be able to accept the "logic" in that but it won't-and shouldn't-fly with most.

Don't matter what illustrations you muster up, God made man to sin with his will, and to hold him accountable, yet God predetermined it all. If you dont like it, it wont be long we will be before Him in Judgment, let him know about your logic

 

[Brightfame52]

The flesh profits nothing in the matters of spiritual things and salvation !

Jn 6:63

63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Not only the natural man has not a freewill, the will he does have is a slave to sin, and a will that is dead to God and the things of God spiritually.

This doesnt change unless he is quickened, or made alive !

 

[fhansen]

Don't matter what illustrations you muster up, God made man to sin with his will, and to hold him accountable, yet God predetermined it all. If you dont like it, it wont be long we will be before Him in Judgment, let him know about your logic

Well, it does matter that you choose to ignore some scripture while picking other parts that might support your author of sin God, because whoever meets that God can't count on heaven being any better than hell anyway.

 

[fhansen]

Your right it is truth in my mind, thats why Im posting it

Yes, just not truth in reality. That's the only problem.

 

[fhansen]

The flesh profits nothing in the matters of spiritual things and salvation !

Jn 6:63

63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Not only the natural man has not a freewill, the will he does have is a slave to sin, and a will that is dead to God and the things of God spiritually.

This doesnt change unless he is quickened, or made alive !

Better start seeking the Spirit then.

 

[Clare73]

Humans are limited, created, finite beings. As such, they have limited and finite freedom compared to God's infinite and perfect freedom. But, being made in His image, our freedom, such as it is, however weak or strong, God gave to us and wants us to use rightly. And He's been seeking to draw and guide humanity into the right use of that freedom beginning already in Eden when we first used it wrongly. That's what the "drama" of this life is all about.

The world we find ourselves in now is a world where we're learning the foolishness and evil of that original choice. And with the help of grace, we can make the right choice, turning back to Him again. So, now connected to the Vine as we're meant to be, He does His job of making us sinless,

Our "own sinlessness" is the righteousness of Christ imputed to us (Ro 3:21-22, 4:22-25, 2 Co 5:21).
We are by (fallen) nature objects of wrath (Eph 2:3). . .we are born with our nature

 

[Clare73]

No one has to make any rule. God either directly wills, wants, causes the rape and torture of a child whenever happens, as the author of sin, or He allows such things for a time, for a season, for His ultimately good purposes.

God 101:

Sin in the world does not make God the author of sin.

God's free will to Adam does not make God the author of Adam's sin.

Study Ro 9:22-23, 11:32.

 

[Clare73]

Will does not have to be free. Luther wrote a book with the title, "The Bondage of the Will," for example, written in response to works of Erasmus which championed the notion of free will.

And there is Jesus on the matter. . .man is a slave to sin (Jn 8:34). . .slaves aren't free.

 

[fhansen]

God 101:

Sin in the world does not make God the author of sin.

God's free will to Adam does not make God the author of Adam's sin.

Study Ro 9:22-23, 11:32.

That's right-God is not the author of sin, meaning He does not will man to sin. So man wills to sin, or he wills not to sin. That's why/how he's morally accountable. And his first, most basic, right moral choice is to turn to God, enabled by the Holy Spirit but never determined by Him for us to make that choice. Otherwise man has no choice and any sin would therefore be directly authored by God. So now you need only adjust your theology because, at present, it supports the concept that God is the author of sin.

 

[fhansen]

Our "own sinlessness" is the righteousness of Christ imputed to us (Ro 3:21-22, 4:22-25, 2 Co 5:21).
We are by (fallen) nature objects of wrath (Eph 2:3). . .we are born with our nature

Read 1 John 3. Our own sinlessness is...our own sinlessness. Made possible by God the Holy Spirit indwelling us.

 

[Brightfame52]

Well, it does matter that you choose to ignore some scripture while picking other parts that might support your author of sin God, because whoever meets that God can't count on heaven being any better than hell anyway.

If you dont like the way God does things, take it up with Him, you will soon face Him in Judgment, we all will

 

[Brightfame52]

Yes, just not truth in reality. That's the only problem.

Thats your opinion in your mind.

 

[Brightfame52]

Better start seeking the Spirit then.

You better hope the Spirit is seeking you friend

 

[fhansen]

You better hope the Spirit is seeking you friend

No worries-He found me. It's just a matter of me remaining in Him now.

 

[Clare73]

That's right-God is not the author of sin, meaning He does not will man to sin. So man wills to sin, or he wills not to sin. That's why/how he's morally accountable. And his first, most basic, moral choice is to turn to God, enabled by the Holy Spirit but never determined by Him for us to make that choice. Otherwise man has no choice and any sin would therefore be directly authored by God.

Who made that rule?

 

[Clare73]

Read 1 John 3. Our own sinlessness is...our own sinlessness. Made possible by the God the Holy Spirit indwelling us.

The redeemed are not sinless. . .but justice regarding their sin has been satisfied, and they are not subject to the justice of damnation.