Where is the Great Multitude from Rev 7:13,14

[Douggg]

The ONLY dead people resurrected when Jesus Returns, will be the martyrs killed during the Great Tribulation. Revelation 20:4 makes that crystal clear.
Any ideas of other Christians rising from the dead then, are false and will not happen.

keras, 1Thessalonians5:9-11 is before the great tribulation begins - not at Jesus's return.

1Thessalonians5:10 involves both the living and dead in Christ. It is the rapture/resurrection event of 1Thessalonians4:13-18.

Paul in 1Thessalonains4:13-18, described the resurrection of the dead in Christ, followed immediately by the translation of the living in Christ. Then in 1Thessalonians5:9-11 said it will happen before the wrath of God is poured when the day of the Lord begins.

 

[Douggg]

I can and I have proved there will be Christians under persecution during the 42 month period of world Satanic control. Daniel 7:25,revelation 13L7 and as Revelation 12:17 plainly tell us. They are not new converts, during the GT, as they are present when it starts.

There will be persons who become Christians after the rapture/resurrection event. And when the great tribulation begins, such as the Jews in Revelation 12:10.

But your theory of there being no rapture/resurrection event before the wrath of God is poured out, fails as there is no reason to resurrect them who sleep in Christ for protection during the great tribulation - as them who sleep in Christ, their bodies are already dead.

1Thessalonians5:
9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

 

[keras]

keras, 1Thessalonians5:9-11 is before the great tribulation begins - not at Jesus's return.

That scripture is a general statement, it is not time specific.

Paul in 1Thessalonains4:13-18, described the resurrection of the dead in Christ, followed immediately by the translation of the living in Christ. Then in 1Thessalonians5:9-11 said it will happen before the wrath of God is poured when the day of the Lord begins.

What confused and wrong interpretations.
There is no 'translation of the living' when Jesus Returns to be found in the Bible. And why should there be?

The change to immortality as described in 1 Cor 15, does not happen until after the GWT Judgment and Eternity kicks in.

 

[Douggg]

There is no 'translation of the living' when Jesus Returns to be found in the Bible. And why should there be?

keras, I never stated that there was a translation of the living in Christ to occur at Jesus's Return.

The timing of the rapture (the translation of the living in Christ)/ resurrection of the dead in Christ event is before Jesus's return, and before the great tribulation begins.

At the end of the 7 years, the raptured/resurrected saints will follow Jesus from heaven, as part of the armies of heaven the day that He returns in great glory and power.

keras, who are these persons in verse 14, clothed in fine linen, white and clean ?

Revelation 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

They are the bride of Christ, The raptured/resurrected saints in their eternal everlasting life bodies.

Revelation 19:8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

 

[keras]

The timing of the rapture (the translation of the living in Christ)/ resurrection of the dead in Christ event is before Jesus's return, and before the great tribulation begins.

At the end of the 7 years, the raptured/resurrected saints will follow Jesus from heaven, as part of the armies of heaven the day that He returns in great glory and power.

The incredible and impossibly fantastic fable of the rapture to heaven believers.
Why do people think such a thing is even possible? Joining with the armies of heaven? You must be delusional.
Noted that any scriptural support is absent.

keras, who are these persons in verse 14, clothed in fine linen, white and clean ?

Revelation 7:14 They are the ones who passed safely thru the great ordeal...... obviously referring to the just happened terrible Day of the Lords vengeance and wrath; the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster.

 

[Douggg]

The incredible and impossibly fantastic fable of the rapture to heaven believers.
Why do people think such a thing is even possible? Joining with the armies of heaven? You must be delusional.
Noted that any scriptural support is absent.

The armies were made up the raptured/resurrected saints, the bride of Christ. Jesus in Revelation 19, descends from heaven to earth, and the armies which were in heaven follow Him.

Revelation 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

Revelation 19:8 And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

Furthermore, that Jesus will be accompanied by the saints is in Zechariah 14:5.

5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

Revelation 7:14 They are the ones who passed safely thru the great ordeal...... obviously referring to the just happened terrible Day of the Lords vengeance and wrath; the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster.

No, scriptural support what-so-ever that the ones following Jesus from heaven are the survivors of the great tribulation. It is not even rational.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

I can and I have proved there will be Christians under persecution during the 42 month period of world Satanic control. Daniel 7:25,revelation 13L7 and as Revelation 12:17 plainly tell us. They are not new converts, during the GT, as they are present when it starts.

You are wrong, your beliefs are confused and in error and you reject the truth when it is presented.

It is you who has no way to prove the rapture.
Every verse the rapture believers; suckers; deluded fools; post - just do not say the Lord will take His people to heaven. Six verses say He won't!

Rev 4:1 is proven to be a future event by the proof that apostle John never left Patmos during his vision of Revelation. There are two verses that prove this:

Rev 1:1 (ESV): The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things that must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John,

Rev 22:8 (ESV): I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I heard and saw them, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who showed them to me,

Where did the angel go to be with John for the vision he was about to hear and see?

Prove that John left Patmos and went to Heaven through Rev 4:1. Your lack of proof proves that John never left Patmos during his entire vision of Revelation. Therefore, Rev 4:1 is a future event, the pre-Trib rapture of the Church, straight to Heaven.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

There will be persons who become Christians after the rapture/resurrection event. And when the great tribulation begins, such as the Jews in Revelation 12:10.

But your theory of there being no rapture/resurrection event before the wrath of God is poured out, fails as there is no reason to resurrect them who sleep in Christ for protection during the great tribulation - as them who sleep in Christ, their bodies are already dead.

1Thessalonians5:
9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

You're exactly right, Douggg, that there will be unbelievers on Earth who become Christians after the rapture. The work of the 144k (Rev 7:9-17) is for assisting those in the Trib who repent and turn to Jesus. The work of the 144k will be very instrumental in saving a multitude. Rev 9:4 also proves that at the timepoint for that verse, only the 144k and unbelievers are on Earth. The 144k are sealed servants of God, per Rev 7:3-4.

 

[keras]

You're exactly right, Douggg, that there will be unbelievers on Earth who become Christians after the rapture

Jesus said the time would come when false prophets/teachers will arise and will mislead many. Matthew 24:11, 2 Peter 2:1-2

The idea of Christian converts during the Great Trib, is false ; Revelation 13:3b-4....the whole world will follow Satan and the beast.
To believe and promote that theory, dreamed up so as to enable the Church to be in heaven, is gross error, which contradicts scripture.

No matter how much people might wish for the Lord to take them to heaven, it is not going to happen. We are made to inhabit the earth and we are given tasks to do here, any thought of escaping our responsibilities, is wrong and those who do want to, will be Judged for it.

 

[Oseas]

You're exactly right, Douggg, that there will be unbelievers on Earth who become Christians after the rapture. The work of the 144k (Rev 7:9-17) is for assisting those in the Trib who repent and turn to Jesus. The work of the 144k will be very instrumental in saving a multitude. Rev 9:4 also proves that at the timepoint for that verse, only the 144k and unbelievers are on Earth. The 144k are sealed servants of God, per Rev 7:3-4.

1Timothy 4:1-2
1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

2Thessalonians 2:3 - 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that Day shall not come, except there come a falling away first,...

John 3:31 - 31 He that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: He that cometh from above is above all...

Matthew 23:33 - 33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

Matthew 25:34& 41& 46
34 - Then shall the King JESUS say unto them on His right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom(REVELATION 11:15-18) prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
41 - Then shall the King JESUS say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye CURSED, into everlasting fire, prepared for the Devil and his angels: (2Corinthians 11:13-15)
46 - And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life Eternal.

Romans 2:5-12

5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself WRATH against the Day of Wrath (seventh and last Day, the Lord's Day, or seventh and last millennium) and revelation of the righteous Judgment of GOD;

6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:

8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,

9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;

10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:

11 For there is no respect of persons with God.

12 For as many as have sinned without law(THE GENTILES) shall also PERISH without law: and as many as have sinned in the law(the Jews) shall be JUDGED by the law;

Revelation 12:12 -> ...Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea(JEWISH AND GENTILES)! for the Devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

Revelation 19:19-21
19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
20 And the Beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the Beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

21 And the remnant were slain with the Sword of him that sat upon the horse, which Sword proceeded out of his mouth(Hebrews 4:12-13 combined with Revelation 13:3 & 14): and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Be careful or else get ready

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Jesus said the time would come when false prophets/teachers will arise and will mislead many. Matthew 24:11, 2 Peter 2:1-2

The idea of Christian converts during the Great Trib, is false ; Revelation 13:3b-4....the whole world will follow Satan and the beast.
To believe and promote that theory, dreamed up so as to enable the Church to be in heaven, is gross error, which contradicts scripture.

No matter how much people might wish for the Lord to take them to heaven, it is not going to happen. We are made to inhabit the earth and we are given tasks to do here, any thought of escaping our responsibilities, is wrong and those who do want to, will be Judged for it.

Keras, the whole world ("everyone") is cited in Rev 6:15. In Rev 6:15-17, everyone in the world reacts in terror to hide in caves and under rocks. Everyone is reacting in terror to an alleged sighting of Jesus. Everyone in the world thereby publicly rejects Jesus. Everyone in the world is therefore an unbeliever.

Everyone in the world is at the 6th seal. Show me proof of just one believer in the 6th seal. Not a single person there behaves as a believer. If believers were there, and Jesus was truly sighted, we would RUN TO Jesus in COMPLETE JOY to PRAISE, WORSHIP and THANK Him! There isn't one iota of Christian behavior by anybody in the 6th seal.

How, then, are there believers in the Trib later in Rev 12:17 and Rev 13:7? Just maybe, you will finally acknowledge the truth of the tremendous work of the 144k in helping to save a multitude. There are millions of new converts in the Trib (Rev 7 -- the greatest revival in the Trib).

 

[keras]

Everyone in the world is at the 6th seal. Show me proof of just one believer in the 6th seal. Not a single person there behaves as a believer. If believers were there, and Jesus was truly sighted, we would RUN TO Jesus in COMPLETE JOY to PRAISE, WORSHIP and THANK Him! There isn't one iota of Christian behavior by anybody in the 6th seal.

Just because Christians are not specifically mentioned at the Sixth Seal, does not mean they won't be present.
That we are is proved by the many verses saying how we must keep strong, trusting the Lord and enduring until the end. Also how we must take shelter on that terrible Day. Isaiah 26:20-21

the truth of the tremendous work of the 144k in helping to save a multitude

the truth? Or JB's fanciful idea, made to prop up a false theory.
Please provide a scripture that says the 144k convert anyone.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Just because Christians are not specifically mentioned at the Sixth Seal, does not mean they won't be present.
That we are is proved by the many verses saying how we must keep strong, trusting the Lord and enduring until the end. Also how we must take shelter on that terrible Day. Isaiah 26:20-21

the truth? Or JB's fanciful idea, made to prop up a false theory.
Please provide a scripture that says the 144k convert anyone.

Keras, one of the purposes of Rev 6:15-17 is to prove that no believers enter the Trib. The dramatization of the planet-wide rejection of Jesus Christ is clear evidence there are no believers on Earth. We are not there in verses Rev 6:15-17 that account for EVERYONE on Earth, who so willingly demonstrate a complete rejection of Jesus Christ. We are not there in Rev 6:15-17.

The 2nd seal (Rev 6:4) also proves that no believers are on Earth. There are no believers on Earth because all inhabitants are subject to being influenced by God to indiscriminately murder each other. We are not there in Rev 6:4.

Those millions of martyrs in the 5th seal were first converted by the 144k. Who are those sealed servants of God roaming the earth in Rev 9:4? They are the 144k (Rev 7:3-4). Rev 9:4 also proves there are no believers on Earth. Yet, there are many more martyrs. The 144k operate well into the GT. The martyrs in the GT are killed for their testimony of Jesus Christ or their refusal to worship the image of the beast (Rev 12:17 and Rev 13:7, 15). All those martyrs end up under the altar. That begins in the 5th seal and it ends in Rev 20:4. All those martyrs are resurrected in the last sentence of Rev 20:4. They next appear in Heaven, per Rev 7:9-17. They appear in Rev 7 to honor the 144k that facilitated their conversion. Keras, can you connect the dots?

You are operating on your own unscriptural ideas (like seals 1-5 already being open). I am quoting Scripture. For instance: Rev 6:11 (ESV): Then they were each given a white robe and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brothers should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been.

Rev 6:10 proves that the first half of the GM are converted after the 2nd and 4th seals. Rev 20:4 holds the second half of the GM after those converted in the GT are martyred in Rev 12:17 and Rev 13:7, 15.

The purpose of Rev 7 is to honor the 144k for facilitating the conversion of a multitude. Their accomplishment is so tremendous, the GT is halted to perform the ceremony to honor them. Let that sink in, sir.

That we are is proved by the many verses saying how we must keep strong, trusting the Lord and enduring until the end. Also how we must take shelter on that terrible Day. Isaiah 26:20-21

the truth? Or JB's fanciful idea, made to prop up a false theory.
Please provide a scripture that says the 144k convert anyone.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Just because Christians are not specifically mentioned at the Sixth Seal, does not mean they won't be present.
That we are is proved by the many verses saying how we must keep strong, trusting the Lord and enduring until the end. Also how we must take shelter on that terrible Day. Isaiah 26:20-21

the truth? Or JB's fanciful idea, made to prop up a false theory.
Please provide a scripture that says the 144k convert anyone.

Here are Rev 6:15-17 (NLT): 15 Then everyone—the kings of the earth, the rulers, the generals, the wealthy, the powerful, and every slave and free person—all hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16 And they cried to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of the one who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb. 17 For the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to survive?”

Everyone on Earth pleas to hide from an alleged sighting of Jesus. They even cry to the mountains and the rocks. Why do they not cry out to Jesus?

The 6th seal is rich with details that convict these people. If you were there, would you not boldly proclaim your faith in God? A voice for God was desperately needed. No one stepped forward!

Furthermore, the claim of the wrath is a lie. Where is it in the 6th seal? These people are mocking Jesus and lying about Him. Where's the wrath and where's the disaster?

In Rev 6:15-17, the wording purposely emphasizes the viewpoint of and the ungodly practices of hardcore unbelievers. There's a reason for this. That's what they are -- all of them because not one dissenting voice proclaimed otherwise. If that's not a time to boldly proclaim your faith, what is?

 

[Oseas]

Keras, the whole world ("everyone") is cited in Rev 6:15. In Rev 6:15-17, everyone in the world reacts in terror to hide in caves and under rocks. Everyone is reacting in terror to an alleged sighting of Jesus. Everyone in the world thereby publicly rejects Jesus. Everyone in the world is therefore an unbeliever.
Everyone in the world is at the 6th seal. Show me proof of just one believer in the 6th seal. Not a single person there behaves as a believer.

2Thessalonians 1:7-12
7 And to you who are troubled (the Lord's Church) rest with us, when the Lord JESUS shall be revealed from heaven(Ephesians 1:3-8) with His mighty angels (His mighty messengers - the TRUE believers) -> Luke 20:35-36 combined with Revelation 12:9-12.

8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not GOD, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord JESUS Christ:

9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of His power(Matthew 28:18);

10 When JESUS shall come to be glorified in His saints (the true believers), and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that Day. ->seventh and last Day or seventh and last Millennium. This Day arrived.

11 Wherefore also we pray always for you(for GOD's people), that our GOD would count you WORTHY of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of His goodness, and the work of faith with power:

12 That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you(in GOD's people-the true believers) , and they in Him, according to the grace of our GOD and the Lord JESUS Christ.

JEREMIAH 46:10 -> For this is the Day of the Lord GOD of hosts, a Day of vengeance, that he may avenge Him of His adversaries: and the Sword shall devour them, and it shall be satiate and made drunk with their blood.

If believers were there, and Jesus was truly sighted, we would RUN TO Jesus in COMPLETE JOY to PRAISE, WORSHIP and THANK Him! There isn't one iota of Christian behavior by anybody in the 6th seal.

Matthew 7:21-23
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many (believers) will say to me in that Day(seventh and last Day-Lord's Day, Day of the righteous Judgment Seat Christ), Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I NEVER knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. -> Matthew 25:41-> Then shall JESUS say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye CURSED, into everlasting fire, prepared for the Devil and his angels->his messengers- 2Corinthians 11:13-15.

How, then, are there believers in the Trib later in Rev 12:17 and Rev 13:7? Just maybe, you will finally acknowledge the truth of the tremendous work of the 144k in helping to save a multitude. There are millions of new converts in the Trib (Rev 7 -- the greatest revival in the Trib).

Revelation 7:1&3:
1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth(ISRAEL AS A WHOLE), nor on the sea(GENTILE PEOPLES AS A WHOLE), nor on any tree(true believers-Psalms 1:3-6).
3 Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

Revelation 14:1 and 6-12 and 15-19
1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven(Ephesians 1:3-8), having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,

7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear GOD, and give glory to Him; for the hour of His Judgment is come(Read Romans 2): and worship Him that made heaven(Ephesians 1:3-8), and earth(Isaiah 64:8), and the sea(Gentile nations), and the fountains of waters(Holy Scriptures->John 7:38).

8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.-> Revelation 18, take a look

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the Beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation(ROMANS 2:8); and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the Beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of GOD, and the faith of Jesus.

15 Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the HARVEST of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the WRATH of GOD.->Revelation 11:18

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

Just because Christians are not specifically mentioned at the Sixth Seal, does not mean they won't be present.
That we are is proved by the many verses saying how we must keep strong, trusting the Lord and enduring until the end. Also how we must take shelter on that terrible Day. Isaiah 26:20-21

the truth? Or JB's fanciful idea, made to prop up a false theory.
Please provide a scripture that says the 144k convert anyone.

You are recycling through irrelevant verses we have gone over before. Isaiah 26:20-21 have NOTHING to do with the Trib. The same goes for those verses you claim where no one is allowed to go to Heaven. They are about Jesus' disciples wanting to follow Him to Heaven after His ascension.

You cannot find any verse that invalidates the pre-Trib rapture. Just like you can't prove the Trib is longer than seven years as would be needed to accommodate your false theory that seals 1-5 are already open. You are woefully in violation of Daniel 9:27 which is a summary of the SEVEN-YEAR Trib: Daniel 9:27 (ESV): And he shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and for half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator.”

One "week" in Daniel 9 = seven years. "Half of the week" = 3.5 years. half of that "week" will be devoted to putting an end to "sacrifice and offering." How much time elapses between Rev 6:1-2 and the AoD in Matt 24;15? "And on the wing of abominations ..., until the end is poured out on the desolator," how much time will there be from the AoD (Matt 24:15) to Rev 19:20?

When will you lose your falsehood that the first seals 1-5 are open? Just because you might be able to match some death rates with the death rates in seals 2 and 4, doesn't mean seals 2 and 4 have been opened. First, you can't match the death rates because, as one example, billions of unbelievers (25% of the world's population) are killed in the 4th seal. The Trib only lasts seven years, so even if took all seven years to complete that worldwide slaughter, it wouldn't match the PERCENTAGE of the world's population having been killed by famine, wars, wild beasts and disease on a yearly basis. The 4th seal would EXCEED all so-called comparable stats for death-rate percentages on a yearly basis. Keras, you will lose from every angle trying to support your false theories.

 

[Oseas]

The apostasy and demonic interpretation of post above and others posted, the flood of apostasy of many posts in this topic, and even in similar thousands others in Internet, besides a flood of apostate literatures spread through the TAIL of the dragon-Isaiah 9:15-16- , all of them are the LITERAL fulfilment of 2Thessalonians 2:1-4 and 1Timothy 4:1-2. The Word is GOD, GOD Himself, His Judgment are righteous..

One "week" in Daniel 9 = seven years. "Half of the week" = 3.5 years. half of that "week" will be devoted to putting an end to "sacrifice and offering." How much time elapses between Rev 6:1-2 and the AoD in Matt 24;15? "And on the wing of abominations ..., until the end is poured out on the desolator," how much time will there be from the AoD (Matt 24:15) to Rev 19:20?

The promise of our Lord JESUS - Matthew 24:13-15
13-He that shall endure unto the END of the world(1Corinthians 15:24-26), the same shall be saved;
14 The gospel of the Kingdom of GOD(Revelation 11:15-18) shall be PREACHED in all the WORLD for a witness unto all NATIONS, then shall the END come(1Corinthians 15:24, take a look).

THE WARNING OF JESUS IS FOR ALL
15 So, when ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place-in JERUSALEM- the holy city spiritually called Sodom and Egypt, (whoso readeth, let him understand: ) then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.-(The terrible event of the great tribulation will happen because Michael will stand up, Michael shall cause the great tribulation in whole Earth) -> Example: Genesis 19:12-14 combined with Daniel 12:1-,

Genesis 19:12-14
12 And the men said unto Lot, Hast thou here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place:
13 For WE WILL DESTROY THIS PLACE (NOW, EVEN IN THIS CURRENT TIME, WILL BE DESTROYED THE WORLD OF DEVIL AS A WHOLE, UNDERSTAND?-REVELATION 11;18) because the cry of them (NOW OF ALL THE NATIONS) waxen great before the face of the Lord; and the Lord hath sent us to DESTROY it. AND EXCEPT THESE DAYS (THESE CURRENT DAYS) should be shortened, there should NO FLESH be saved: but FOR THE ELECT'S SAKE (EXCLUSIVELY) these days shall be shortened.

TO ALL
The NEXT and LAST POPE, yeah, the NEXT and LAST POPE must be elected soon, and ALSO must be MANIFESTED THE JEWISH FALSE MESSIAH-John 5:43-47, the MAN of sin- 2Thes. 2: 1-4 & 8-12, he yet did not manifeted himself because the SACRIFICE OF JESUS still remains until he be taken out of the way, and then shall that Wicked be revealed-2Thes.2:8,
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders.

THE WARNING OF JESUS IS FOR ALL
Then, if any man shall say unto you(Pastors, an Bishops, and Evangelists, and others false preachers of the Word of GOD) , yeah, say unto you, Lo, here is Christ-John 5:43-47-, or there, BELIEVE NOT, there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets(false preachers of the Word of GOD), and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, THEY SHALL DECEIVE THE VERY ELECTED. -> (PERILOUS TIMES-Be careful or else get ready)

My Lord warned : Behold, I have told you before. Matthew 24:25
Be careful or else get ready


Again: Genesis 19: 13 For WE WILL DESTROY THIS PLACE (NOW, EVEN IN THIS CURRENT TIME, WILL BE DESTROYED THE WORLD OF DEVIL AS A WHOLE, UNDERSTAND?-REVELATION 11;18) because the cry of them (NOW OF ALL THE NATIONS) waxen great before the face of the Lord; and the Lord hath sent us to DESTROY it. ~> And as it was in the days of Lot, so shall it be also in these days of the Son of man -> (the days of the seventh and last millennium-the first century already started) .

Get ready

 

[keras]

Keras, you will lose from every angle trying to support your false theories.

You are the loser, you have yet to provide any scripture that says the Lord will take his people to heaven.
Jesus said six times that He wouldn't!

Those who believe in and promote escapist theories, will be shocked and surprised when disaster strikes. We will need to get under cover to shelter from the extreme heat, earthquakes, storms and tsunamis.

 

[Oseas]

Hebrews 1:3:
1 GOD, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days (last 2000 years) spoken unto us by His Son, whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also GOD made the worlds;

3 Who being the brightness of His glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE of the Person of GOD(by the way, EXPRESSED in the BIBLE), and upholding all things by the Word of His power(Matthew 28:18), when JESUS had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

Acts 1:9-11
9 And when JESUS had spoken these things, while they beheld, JESUS was taken up; and a CLOUD received Him out of their sight.

10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as JESUS went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; (Would be Gabriel and Michael? would be?)

11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same JESUS, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen JESUS go into heaven. (By the way, the SAME CLOUD will now appear in His coming. Get ready)


Matthew 17:2-9
2 And was transfigured before them: and His face did shine as the sun, and His raiment was white as the light.

3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.

4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.

5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright CLOUD overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the CLOUD, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye Him.

6 And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid.

7 And Jesus came and touched them, and said, Arise, and be not afraid.

8 And when they had lifted up their eyes, they saw no man, save JESUS only.

9 And as they came down from the mountain, JESUS charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.

1 Thessalonians 4:16
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel(Michael-Daniel 12:1-3), and with the trump of GOD: and the DEAD in CHRIST shall rise first: -> John 11:23-26.

17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the CLOUD(the same CLOUD of Acts 1:9 and Matthew 17:5) , to meet the Lord in the air (in the environment of the 3rd heaven-Luke 20:35-36 combined with 2Corinthians 12:2-4): and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

John 7:38- He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.

John 8:51- Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.

John 11:26 - And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

1Thessalonians 4:17:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the CLOUD ((the same CLOUD of Acts 1:9 and Matthew 17:5) to meet the Lord in the air((in the environment of the 3rd heaven-Luke 20:35-36 combined with 2Corinthians 12:2-4): and so shall we ever be with the Lord.-> in the 3rd heaven -> Philippians 3:20-21, take a look.

 

[Jeffrey Bowden]

You are the loser, you have yet to provide any scripture that says the Lord will take his people to heaven.
Jesus said six times that He wouldn't!

Those who believe in and promote escapist theories, will be shocked and surprised when disaster strikes. We will need to get under cover to shelter from the extreme heat, earthquakes, storms and tsunamis.

Rev 4:1 is provably a future event. Apostle John never left the island of Patmos during the whole time of his vision of Revelation. Two verses: Rev 1:1 and Rev 22:8 prove that it was one angel who showed John everything he heard and saw in his vision of Revelation. Therefore, Rev 4:1 is a future event, the pre-Trib rapture of the Church, straight to Heaven.