Are we subject to the Old Covenant today?

[Leaf473]

That meeting was just to confirm what the body of Christ already accepted as canon.

When had the body of Christ finished accepting the canon?

 

[Gary K]

That meeting was just to confirm what the body of Christ already accepted as canon.

But the point, if you look at the context of 1 cor 13

Speak like a child
Think like a child
Reasoned like a child

All refers to the 3 gifts mentioned, so when scripture was completed, no need to be a child anymore

How do you come up with that? Where is your scriptural evidence for what you say?

 

[Guojing]

When had the body of Christ finished accepting the canon?

I have no idea on that.

 

[Guojing]

How do you come up with that? Where is your scriptural evidence for what you say?

Read the entire chapter 1 Corinthians 13.

 

[Gary K]

Read the entire chapter 1 Corinthians 13.

I have, quite a few times. I see no evidence of your assertion.

 

[Guojing]

I have, quite a few times. I see no evidence of your assertion.

Even when I addressed your previous questions to me, you just move on to other questions anyway without acknowledging my answer, so you are clearly not keen to discuss doctrine with me.

Let's just agree to disagree on this one and move on.

 

[Studyman]

God's people, my people, in scripture always refers to the nation of Israel.

And Hebrews 8:8 and Jeremiah 31:31 tell you precisely who God will make a New Covenant with.

So Hebrews 8:11 could only mean the people stated in those 2 verses.

The nation of Israel that you see now, they rejected Christ as the Messiah.

How do you define "Nation of Israel"? If "God's People" only means men born of a certain DNA, then Hebrews 8 was written only for physical Jews. ( Israel and Judah) The Christ of the Bible said Abraham's Children were those who did the works of Abraham. Isn't a true Israelite one who does the works of Israel?

1 Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens;

Are you saying that only the physical Nation of Israel is the "WE" here? And they are the only ones who have such a High Priest?

6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

The "HE" here is the Christ of the Bible, Yes? He is the mediator of a better covenant spoken of in Jer. 31, Yes? And the Hebrews author said "WE" have such a High Priest.

In the Holy Scriptures, "Strangers" who Sojourned with Israel were to be considered as one born among them, making them also Israelites. An Israelite is then not only a person born with a specific DNA, but one of the heart as well, Yes? (Children of Israel, or as the Christ says, those who do the works of Israel) Men were/are still grafted into Israel are they not? Don't they become God's People then, just as Israel was.

And would this New Covenant based on "Better Promises" not only pertain to those born with Jewish DNA, but Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;" spoken of in Isaiah?

I agree with the Christ, "Salvation is of the Jews". And Paul, "And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

"And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:" For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

And Paul does says about the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, "We are the Circumcision".

I'm just not sure how you define "Nation of Israel".

 

[Gary K]

Even when I addressed your previous questions to me, you just move on to other questions anyway without acknowledging my answer, so you are clearly not keen to discuss doctrine with me.

Let's just agree to disagree on this one and move on.

I'm sorry I hurt your feelings. That was not my intent. I have a responsibility to tell you the truth if I see you heading down a path that leads to death. Here is why.

Eze 33:7 So thou, O son of man, I have set thee a watchman unto the house of Israel; therefore thou shalt hear the word at my mouth, and warn them from me.
Eze 33:8 When I say unto the wicked, O wicked man, thou shalt surely die; if thou dost not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.
Eze 33:9 Nevertheless, if thou warn the wicked of his way to turn from it; if he do not turn from his way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul. \

We all have this responsibility to our fellow man and God will hold us responible if we do not love our fellow man enough to show them the truth.

 

[Guojing]

I have a responsibility to tell you the truth if I see you heading down a path that leads to death.

That is the problem. You fail to see you own egocentric bias, and assume that whatever you hold as truth, must always be the truth for everyone else.

FYI no one is hurt here, don't be condescending.

 

[Guojing]

And Paul does says about the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, "We are the Circumcision".

I'm just not sure how you define "Nation of Israel".

I am curious, where is the KJV scripture that says the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, "We are the Circumcision"?

You claimed this but provided no reference.

 

[Gary K]

I am curious, where is the KJV scripture that says the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, "We are the Circumcision"?

You claimed this but provided no reference.

I'm not sure what Studyman is referencing but it is most likely a text like one of the following.

Col 3:11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.

Rom_2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

 

[Aussie Pete]

I am curious, where is the KJV scripture that says the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, "We are the Circumcision"?

You claimed this but provided no reference.

Philippians 3:3. It took me about 30 seconds to find it.

 

[Guojing]

Philippians 3:3. It took me about 30 seconds to find it.

Firstly that verse is not saying the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, are the Circumcision

Secondly, you are another who is not aware that Jews call fellow Jews brethren.

Why would you ever think Philippians 3:1-5 be Paul addressing anyone other than the Jewish brethren of Paul?

 

[Guojing]

I'm not sure what Studyman is referencing but it is most likely a text like one of the following.

It is true that in the Body of Christ, circumcision or uncircumcision counts for nothing.

However, neither of those passages say that we gentile believers in the Body of Christ are the circumcision.

 

[Gary K]

Firstly that verse is not saying the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, are the Circumcision

Secondly, you are another who is not aware that Jews call fellow Jews brethren.

Why would you ever think Philippians 3:1-5 be Paul addressing anyone other than the Jewish brethren of Paul?

Paul is addressing the Gentile church in Phillipi. That's who he wrote that letter to. You seem to be pretty confused as to who is who. Paul started that church so he knew who the members were.

 

[Guojing]

Paul is addressing the Gentile church in Phillipi. That's who he wrote that letter to. You seem to be pretty confused as to who is who. Paul started that church so he knew who the members were.

Have you even read Philippians 3:1-5, to come to that conclusion?

In scripture, no gentile is ever called brethren. If I am wrong, please let me see the counterexample.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Firstly that verse is not saying the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, are the Circumcision

Secondly, you are another who is not aware that Jews call fellow Jews brethren.

Why would you ever think Philippians 3:1-5 be Paul addressing anyone other than the Jewish brethren of Paul?

Why would I think otherwise? In Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek. Paul said that.

 

[Guojing]

Why would I think otherwise? In Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek. Paul said that.

In Christ there is neither Jew nor Greek implies we are the circumcision?

What kind of logic is that?

 

[Gary K]

Have you even read Philippians 3:1-5, to come to that conclusion?

In scripture, no gentile is ever called brethren. If I am wrong, please let me see the counterexample.

So, you will ignore the fact that I didn't write the letter to the Phillippians, but Paul did and he called we Gentiles brethren.

Act_15:23 And they wrote letters by them after this manner; The apostles and elders and brethren send greeting unto the brethren which are of the Gentiles in Antioch and Syria and

Act 15:36 And some days after Paul said unto Barnabas, Let us go again and visit our brethren in every city where we have preached the word of the Lord, and see how they do.

Act 16:37 But Paul said unto them, They have beaten us openly uncondemned, being Romans, and have cast us into prison; and now do they thrust us out privily? nay verily; but let them come themselves and fetch us out.
Act 16:38 And the serjeants told these words unto the magistrates: and they feared, when they heard that they were Romans.
Act 16:39 And they came and besought them, and brought them out, and desired them to depart out of the city.
Act 16:40 And they went out of the prison, and entered into the house of Lydia: and when they had seen the brethren, they comforted them, and departed.

There are a lot more instances of Paul writing to the Gentile churches he started and calling them brethren. It seems you know far less scripture than you think.

 

[Studyman]

I am curious, where is the KJV scripture that says the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile, "We are the Circumcision"?

You claimed this but provided no reference.

Thanks for asking, I should have included the reference.

Phil. 3:1 Finally, my brethren, (This would be the Body of Christ, both Jew and Gentile that Paul, according to the Vision of the Christ, taught)

Acts 26: 19 Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision: 20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they (Both) should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.

Paul's Brethren would be those who "Yielded themselves" Servants to Obey God, and became "Servants of God's righteousness" in Romans 6, Yes? And again in Acts 15: 3 And being brought on their way by the church, they passed through Phenice and Samaria, declaring the conversion of the Gentiles: and they caused great joy unto all the brethren.

And again; 8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; 9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

(Phil. continued)

rejoice in the Lord. To write the same things to you, to me indeed is not grievous, but for you it is safe.

And in my understanding, the "You" is defined in Phil. 1:1 Paul and Timotheus, the servants of Jesus Christ, to all the saints in Christ Jesus which are at Philippi, with the bishops and deacons:

2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.

3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.

How could the "WE" here not include the Gentiles Paul taught according to the Vision given him by the very Christ, who worship God in the Spirit and have no confidence in the Flesh to whom God Himself gave His Holy Spirit and put no difference between them and the Apostles?

I respect your knowledge of scripture, if you think I am in error here, please show me where my thinking went wrong.


Hope this helps.