The heart of the Florida Parental rights in Education Act. A.k.a don’t say gay.

[rjs330]

Is it shaming if a doctor points out to a patient that they have cancer?

Interesting thing is Jesus preached repentance. That gets forgotten or conveniently excluded.

 

[rjs330]

As an athiest, what skin do you have in the game about sin? Maybe you would just rather we repressed our people in the LGBT+ community? At the heart of the question is why do you even care?

What skin do you have in the game?

 

[rjs330]

B e c a u s e the child has already heard what their parents have said about “people like that”?
The child needs an adult who they can trust.

They should trust their parents. Not some teacher who knows nothing about any of this but thinks they do. They are with the child for nine months and that's it. They should stay out of it.

 

[rjs330]

If a child cannot trust their teachers, then the teachers aren’t “good teachers”; it is difficult to learn from someone whom you do not trust enough to tell you the truth.

Who's truth?

 

[rjs330]

That's you anti-gay people politicizing the issue. If you are not anti-gay you would just see it as a part of life and curiosity and not like their life is over because they have a same-sex attraction. Why don't you consider accepting kids for who they are and not what you want to force them into?.

Sorry, but the left started this battle by introducing it to schools and the education system. We didn't bring it in, they did. If it's simply left out like it was for generations there wouldn't be this issue. The facts that they want it in is the problem.

 

[rturner76]

Why do they need to "help" them?

Because sometimes kids trust and have great affection for their teachers. I know when I worked as an Education Assistant, kids would come to me with all kinds of problems and I couldn't remain silent but I did try to stay diplomatic. Parents who want to isolate their kids from reality should home-school. School is a community and many benefit from their teacher's input. I have also seen home-schooled kids come out kind of messed up with their parent's extremist ideas and whether they are home-schooled or not they might still turn out gay. Their parents should accept their children instead of trying to beat the gay out of them. It won't work.

 

[ralliann]

Schools exist to indoctrinate children

No they are not. Here we go with attempts to change the meaning of words. Schools are for educating our Children academically, not to indoctrinate. It is what we pay for.

to live successfully in their communities.

hopefully if we return to academics, they can have a very solid foundation to live successfully in the career of their choice. Substandard education should not hold them back.

Besides “book-learning” they’re taught (and practice) social skills as they grow and become aware of who they are as a human being.

They are first taught socialized at home, extended family etc. The teachers are simply another adult in their lives, for the purpose of education. Socialized to respect these adults.

 

[Pommer]

No they are not. Here we go with attempts to change the meaning of words. Schools are for educating our Children academically, not to indoctrinate. It is what we pay for.

Like it or not, schools exist to indoctrinate children into the system in which the schools exist.
When teaching about our system of governance (how each home, street, town, city, county, state and nation serially interact), children are indoctrinated to “fit in” where they (eventually) choose.

Don’t fear the word “indoctrinate” (or it’s variants).

hopefully if we return to academics, they can have a very solid foundation to live successfully in the career of their choice. Substandard education should not hold them back.

They are first taught socialized at home, extended family etc. The teachers are simply another adult in their lives, for the purpose of education. Socialized to respect these adults.

All that you’ve mentioned are “indoctrination”.

What seems to be the “problem” is that the part where we inculcate the notion that “we are free to choose” is “too broad” for some people and that a more limited view seems desirable, “don’t change too much!”

 

[ralliann]

Like it or not, schools exist to indoctrinate children into the system in which the schools exist.

They do not "indoctrinate" into a system. Alot of systems exists and have for many centuries.

When teaching about our system of governance (how each home, street, town, city, county, state and nation serially interact), children are indoctrinated to “fit in” where they (eventually) choose.

Children do not choose those things. Children are prepared through academic education to choose as adults. They do not choose in elementary, jr high high for that. Basic education prepares them for adulthood decisions and success. Our universities takes them into other areas of Education. Even then it should not be an indoctrination. Since it has for quite sometime we are having problems today.

Don’t fear the word “indoctrinate” (or it’s variants).


All that you’ve mentioned are “indoctrination”.

What seems to be the “problem” is that the part where we inculcate the notion that “we are free to choose” is “too broad” for some people and that a more limited view seems desirable, “don’t change too much!”

Again no. It's not too broad unless by broad you mean to begin at an age to young to choose, it to adulthood based upon a good foundation in basic education.
Indoctrination is limiting, education is not.

 

[Ken-1122]

Like it or not, schools exist to indoctrinate children into the system in which the schools exist.
When teaching about our system of governance (how each home, street, town, city, county, state and nation serially interact), children are indoctrinated to “fit in” where they (eventually) choose.

Don’t fear the word “indoctrinate” (or it’s variants).


All that you’ve mentioned are “indoctrination”.

Indoctrination is about personal beliefs, not facts. Teachers should not be in the business of teaching their students their personal beliefs that may contradict parents personal beliefs.

 

[ralliann]

Indoctrination is about personal beliefs, not facts. Teachers should not be in the business of teaching their students their personal beliefs that may contradict parents personal beliefs.

These, would like to call women birthing people. Along with their control over our children what does that sound like? Breeders for the states children. We produce, and care for them physically, and the government makes them agents of themselves. They want a political system. It is all an ends to a means.

 

[Pommer]

Indoctrination is about personal beliefs, not facts. Teachers should not be in the business of teaching their students their personal beliefs that may contradict parents personal beliefs.

How does one make sure that their children will be good citizens and have a nice life, if not by indoctrinating the little tykes into the systems the schools operate under?

Children are being indoctrinated whether you believe that they are or not.
“Indoctrination” is not a “bad thing” unless it involves something that gets in the way of the children of being “good citizens” and lead a relatively happy life.

Some here can’t see where their own indoctrination has taken over.

 

[ralliann]

How does one make sure that their children will be good citizens and have a nice life, if not by indoctrinating the little tykes into the systems the schools operate under?

Children are being indoctrinated whether you believe that they are or not.
“Indoctrination” is not a “bad thing” unless it involves something that gets in the way of the children of being “good citizens” and lead a relatively happy life.

Some here can’t see where their own indoctrination has taken over.

Just as yours has taken over you. So, the issue is to have an open and honest discussion concerning the differing systems each have as "doctrine". On a national scale, by people that are fully "educated" concerning the systems. That is what is missing, but much needed.

 

[Ken-1122]

How does one make sure that their children will be good citizens and have a nice life, if not by indoctrinating the little tykes into the systems the schools operate under?

It is the teachers job to educate children. It is the parents job to ensure they are good citizens and have a nice life.

Children are being indoctrinated whether you believe that they are or not.
“Indoctrination” is not a “bad thing” unless it involves something that gets in the way of the children of being “good citizens” and lead a relatively happy life.

By whose standards? During Nazi Germany, the Hitler youth were taught those ideas would lead to them being good citizens and a happy life. No! Indoctrination should be left up to the parents; not the State.

 

[Bradskii]

Indoctrination should be left up to the parents; not the State.

I think the term was first used in this discussion to make a point. Seeing as it means to teach someone to accept a belief uncritically, then it shouldn't be used at all. By teachers, parents or state.

 

[Ken-1122]

I think the term was first used in this discussion to make a point. Seeing as it means to teach someone to accept a belief uncritically, then it shouldn't be used at all. By teachers, parents or state.

I think most religious beliefs are learned via indoctrination; and I have no problem with parents being allowed to indoctrinate their kids that way.

 

[Bradskii]

I think most religious beliefs are learned via indoctrination; and I have no problem with parents being allowed to indoctrinate their kids that way.

I object very strongly to both. It's the worst of all worlds. Blind acceptance versus a critical understanding. Thoughtless adherence versus a considered position.

 

[Ken-1122]

I object very strongly to both. It's the worst of all worlds. Blind acceptance versus a critical understanding. Thoughtless adherence versus a considered position.

Do you think it should be illegal for parents to indoctorinate their children into their religious beliefs?

 

[rjs330]

Because sometimes kids trust and have great affection for their teachers. I know when I worked as an Education Assistant, kids would come to me with all kinds of problems and I couldn't remain silent but I did try to stay diplomatic. Parents who want to isolate their kids from reality should home-school. School is a community and many benefit from their teacher's input. I have also seen home-schooled kids come out kind of messed up with their parent's extremist ideas and whether they are home-schooled or not they might still turn out gay. Their parents should accept their children instead of trying to beat the gay out of them. It won't work.

I've seen some kids come out of public schools pretty messed up too. Probably a far higher percentage than the homeschoolers who typically score better on the tests.

But the question still remains as to why the teachers have to answer these questions? What's the reason they just have to?

I think we've given teachers far too much power to the point where they feel entitled to do whatever they want.

 

[rjs330]

How does one make sure that their children will be good citizens and have a nice life, if not by indoctrinating the little tykes into the systems the schools operate under?

Children are being indoctrinated whether you believe that they are or not.
“Indoctrination” is not a “bad thing” unless it involves something that gets in the way of the children of being “good citizens” and lead a relatively happy life.

Some here can’t see where their own indoctrination has taken over.

And we are saying the indoctrination in the schools today is out of order. It is not acceptable. Schools are indoctrinating kids in things that is none of their business.